How We Can Tell If We Possess The Agape of God
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Thanks. I trained in a bit of hand to hand in the Navy boot camp, but now I'm a soldier - in the Army of the Lord. As for me, wouldn't get a tattoo at all for two reasons: I don't believe God any more approves of us defacing His property any more than I would approve of one of my friends returning my truck "customized" with a new dent, and the practice of bodily defacing is rooted in occultism 
I think the only things in Scripture that allow for it are circumcision and elective permanent slave status
I think the only things in Scripture that allow for it are circumcision and elective permanent slave status
However if one wants a tattoo because they want one and it has no religious connection why would it be wrong?
I don't have one as you know but often thought about getting one of 2 love birds.
They form a strong bond and stay together.
My wife and I are in a 3 weeks celebrating 28 years of marriage.
We are a couple of love birds.
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Incorrect. The righteous still sin, and what that means is that such sin needs to be forgiven (“there is no remission of sin without the shedding of blood”). This happens with the blood of Christ. Remember, Christ has an eternal priesthood and through His sacrifice people get forgiven of their sin, believers and unbelievers coming into repentance alike. The same blood that grants the remission of sin at conversion is the same blood that keeps us justified throughout life and eternity.
This is why 1 John 2 starts off speaking on if someone sins we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous; the propitiation for the sins of the world. God knew it was necessary to have a safeguard for His children. Read up on Jesus as your high priest.
This is why 1 John 2 starts off speaking on if someone sins we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous; the propitiation for the sins of the world. God knew it was necessary to have a safeguard for His children. Read up on Jesus as your high priest.
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K
God's Word never returns unto Him void
Our goal should not be to change anyone's mind: only the Holy Spirit can "lead us and guide us into all truth", which by implication means those needing to be led into truth must be led out of error, and for this cause, we present the truth, that those willing to be led may be convicted (John 7:17 KJV).
Our goal should not be to change anyone's mind: only the Holy Spirit can "lead us and guide us into all truth", which by implication means those needing to be led into truth must be led out of error, and for this cause, we present the truth, that those willing to be led may be convicted (John 7:17 KJV).
Oh I've been here long enough that everyone knows where I stand. If they have any questions they can ask.
K
Actually not a big chocolate fan. I recall my sisters hubby got in trouble one Valentines when instead of buying her fav. Dove chocolates, he bought her bakers chocolate. Even her kids, young at the time, knew what her favorite chocolates were. We all still haven't let him live that one down. lol
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I'll answer it when I get back from a "FEAST" of two or three bread crumbs in the same manner you claim the wicked possess "agape" when they "agapao".
in the same manner you claim the wicked possess "agape" when they "agapao".
stop dodging the question:
- what do 'you intend to' endure in and how do 'you intend to' do it?
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Still at the "FEAST" of three bread crumbs (we all know how important it is to masticate)
hmm, got a question for you:
- what do 'you intend to' endure in and how do 'you intend to' do it?
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Not necessarily. Observe...
"a 24 hour period" is only 1 of 4 ways to translate the word. Sometimes it means an indefinite scope of time.
We have to look at the context of how the Bible describes the day of the Lord. Here are a few examples:
There are other passages about the day of the Lord that described the very end of it, which involves the total destruction of the universe with fire. That part is what Peter emphasized in his 2nd epistle. He states that total universal destruction happens within the day of the Lord, but certainly not the only event. These Scriptures (above) bear witness.
It is impossible for all of this to happen in a 24-hour day. These events span longs lengths of time, involving judgment, military conquest, the expansion of the Jewish claim on their promised land, the rise of the man of lawlessness, the desolation of Jerusalem, the doom of Babylon, the return of Jesus. These events will be fulfilled in the prophecies written in Revelation 6-19.
"But the day of the Lord will come like a thief..."
"a 24 hour period" is only 1 of 4 ways to translate the word. Sometimes it means an indefinite scope of time.
We have to look at the context of how the Bible describes the day of the Lord. Here are a few examples:
““I will not totally destroy the house of Jacob,” declares the LORD. “For behold, I am commanding, And I will shake the house of Israel among all nations As grain is shaken in a sieve, But not a kernel will fall to the ground. “All the sinners of My people will die by the sword, Those who say, ‘The calamity will not overtake or confront us.’ “In that day I will raise up the fallen booth of David, And wall up its breaches; I will also raise up its ruins And rebuild it as in the days of old; That they may possess the remnant of Edom And all the nations who are called by My name,” Declares the LORD who does this. “Behold, days are coming,” declares the LORD, “When the plowman will overtake the reaper And the treader of grapes him who sows seed; When the mountains will drip sweet wine And all the hills will be dissolved. “Also I will restore the captivity of My people Israel, And they will rebuild the ruined cities and live in them; They will also plant vineyards and drink their wine, And make gardens and eat their fruit. “I will also plant them on their land, And they will not again be rooted out from their land Which I have given them,” Says the LORD your God.” (Amos 9:8–15)
““For the day is near, Even the day of the LORD is near; It will be a day of clouds, A time of doom for the nations. “A sword will come upon Egypt, And anguish will be in Ethiopia; When the slain fall in Egypt, They take away her wealth, And her foundations are torn down. “Ethiopia, Put, Lud, all Arabia, Libya and the people of the land that is in league will fall with them by the sword.” ‘Thus says the LORD, “Indeed, those who support Egypt will fall And the pride of her power will come down; From Migdol to Syene They will fall within her by the sword,” Declares the Lord GOD. “They will be desolate In the midst of the desolated lands; And her cities will be In the midst of the devastated cities. “And they will know that I am the LORD, When I set a fire in Egypt And all her helpers are broken. “On that day messengers will go forth from Me in ships to frighten secure Ethiopia; and anguish will be on them as on the day of Egypt; for behold, it comes!”” (Ezekiel 30:3–9)
“And in that day The mountains will drip with sweet wine, And the hills will flow with milk, And all the brooks of Judah will flow with water; And a spring will go out from the house of the LORD To water the valley of Shittim. Egypt will become a waste, And Edom will become a desolate wilderness, Because of the violence done to the sons of Judah, In whose land they have shed innocent blood. But Judah will be inhabited forever And Jerusalem for all generations.” (Joel 3:18–20)
““In that day,” declares the LORD, “I will assemble the lame And gather the outcasts, Even those whom I have afflicted. “I will make the lame a remnant And the outcasts a strong nation, And the LORD will reign over them in Mount Zion From now on and forever.” (Micah 4:6–7)
“It will be a day for building your walls. On that day will your boundary be extended. It will be a day when they will come to you From Assyria and the cities of Egypt, From Egypt even to the Euphrates, Even from sea to sea and mountain to mountain. And the earth will become desolate because of her inhabitants, On account of the fruit of their deeds.” (Micah 7:11–13)
““Many nations will join themselves to the LORD in that day and will become My people. Then I will dwell in your midst, and you will know that the LORD of hosts has sent Me to you. “The LORD will possess Judah as His portion in the holy land, and will again choose Jerusalem.” (Zechariah 2:11–12)
““It will come about in that day that I will make Jerusalem a heavy stone for all the peoples; all who lift it will be severely injured. And all the nations of the earth will be gathered against it. “In that day,” declares the LORD, “I will strike every horse with bewilderment and his rider with madness. But I will watch over the house of Judah, while I strike every horse of the peoples with blindness. “Then the clans of Judah will say in their hearts, ‘A strong support for us are the inhabitants of Jerusalem through the LORD of hosts, their God.’ “In that day I will make the clans of Judah like a firepot among pieces of wood and a flaming torch among sheaves, so they will consume on the right hand and on the left all the surrounding peoples, while the inhabitants of Jerusalem again dwell on their own sites in Jerusalem. “The LORD also will save the tents of Judah first, so that the glory of the house of David and the glory of the inhabitants of Jerusalem will not be magnified above Judah. “In that day the LORD will defend the inhabitants of Jerusalem, and the one who is feeble among them in that day will be like David, and the house of David will be like God, like the angel of the LORD before them. “And in that day I will set about to destroy all the nations that come against Jerusalem. “I will pour out on the house of David and on the inhabitants of Jerusalem, the Spirit of grace and of supplication, so that they will look on Me whom they have pierced; and they will mourn for Him, as one mourns for an only son, and they will weep bitterly over Him like the bitter weeping over a firstborn. “In that day there will be great mourning in Jerusalem, like the mourning of Hadadrimmon in the plain of Megiddo.” (Zechariah 12:3–11)
“Then the LORD will go forth and fight against those nations, as when He fights on a day of battle. In that day His feet will stand on the Mount of Olives, which is in front of Jerusalem on the east; and the Mount of Olives will be split in its middle from east to west by a very large valley, so that half of the mountain will move toward the north and the other half toward the south. You will flee by the valley of My mountains, for the valley of the mountains will reach to Azel; yes, you will flee just as you fled before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah. Then the LORD, my God, will come, and all the holy ones with Him! In that day there will be no light; the luminaries will dwindle. For it will be a unique day which is known to the LORD, neither day nor night, but it will come about that at evening time there will be light. And in that day living waters will flow out of Jerusalem, half of them toward the eastern sea and the other half toward the western sea; it will be in summer as well as in winter. And the LORD will be king over all the earth; in that day the LORD will be the only one, and His name the only one. All the land will be changed into a plain from Geba to Rimmon south of Jerusalem; but Jerusalem will rise and remain on its site from Benjamin’s Gate as far as the place of the First Gate to the Corner Gate, and from the Tower of Hananel to the king’s wine presses. People will live in it, and there will no longer be a curse, for Jerusalem will dwell in security.” (Zechariah 14:3–11)
(and more: (Obadiah 17–21, Isaiah 30:15–26, Joel 2:18–20, Isaiah 29:17–23, Hosea 2:14–23, Micah 2:12–13, Zephaniah 2:3–7, etc)
I checked all of these contexts, and they are in fact describing the day of the Lord. The exact phrase is either mentioned explicitly in the quote, or in near surrounding verses, or in a parallel passage with the same events mentioned.““For the day is near, Even the day of the LORD is near; It will be a day of clouds, A time of doom for the nations. “A sword will come upon Egypt, And anguish will be in Ethiopia; When the slain fall in Egypt, They take away her wealth, And her foundations are torn down. “Ethiopia, Put, Lud, all Arabia, Libya and the people of the land that is in league will fall with them by the sword.” ‘Thus says the LORD, “Indeed, those who support Egypt will fall And the pride of her power will come down; From Migdol to Syene They will fall within her by the sword,” Declares the Lord GOD. “They will be desolate In the midst of the desolated lands; And her cities will be In the midst of the devastated cities. “And they will know that I am the LORD, When I set a fire in Egypt And all her helpers are broken. “On that day messengers will go forth from Me in ships to frighten secure Ethiopia; and anguish will be on them as on the day of Egypt; for behold, it comes!”” (Ezekiel 30:3–9)
“And in that day The mountains will drip with sweet wine, And the hills will flow with milk, And all the brooks of Judah will flow with water; And a spring will go out from the house of the LORD To water the valley of Shittim. Egypt will become a waste, And Edom will become a desolate wilderness, Because of the violence done to the sons of Judah, In whose land they have shed innocent blood. But Judah will be inhabited forever And Jerusalem for all generations.” (Joel 3:18–20)
““In that day,” declares the LORD, “I will assemble the lame And gather the outcasts, Even those whom I have afflicted. “I will make the lame a remnant And the outcasts a strong nation, And the LORD will reign over them in Mount Zion From now on and forever.” (Micah 4:6–7)
“It will be a day for building your walls. On that day will your boundary be extended. It will be a day when they will come to you From Assyria and the cities of Egypt, From Egypt even to the Euphrates, Even from sea to sea and mountain to mountain. And the earth will become desolate because of her inhabitants, On account of the fruit of their deeds.” (Micah 7:11–13)
““Many nations will join themselves to the LORD in that day and will become My people. Then I will dwell in your midst, and you will know that the LORD of hosts has sent Me to you. “The LORD will possess Judah as His portion in the holy land, and will again choose Jerusalem.” (Zechariah 2:11–12)
““It will come about in that day that I will make Jerusalem a heavy stone for all the peoples; all who lift it will be severely injured. And all the nations of the earth will be gathered against it. “In that day,” declares the LORD, “I will strike every horse with bewilderment and his rider with madness. But I will watch over the house of Judah, while I strike every horse of the peoples with blindness. “Then the clans of Judah will say in their hearts, ‘A strong support for us are the inhabitants of Jerusalem through the LORD of hosts, their God.’ “In that day I will make the clans of Judah like a firepot among pieces of wood and a flaming torch among sheaves, so they will consume on the right hand and on the left all the surrounding peoples, while the inhabitants of Jerusalem again dwell on their own sites in Jerusalem. “The LORD also will save the tents of Judah first, so that the glory of the house of David and the glory of the inhabitants of Jerusalem will not be magnified above Judah. “In that day the LORD will defend the inhabitants of Jerusalem, and the one who is feeble among them in that day will be like David, and the house of David will be like God, like the angel of the LORD before them. “And in that day I will set about to destroy all the nations that come against Jerusalem. “I will pour out on the house of David and on the inhabitants of Jerusalem, the Spirit of grace and of supplication, so that they will look on Me whom they have pierced; and they will mourn for Him, as one mourns for an only son, and they will weep bitterly over Him like the bitter weeping over a firstborn. “In that day there will be great mourning in Jerusalem, like the mourning of Hadadrimmon in the plain of Megiddo.” (Zechariah 12:3–11)
“Then the LORD will go forth and fight against those nations, as when He fights on a day of battle. In that day His feet will stand on the Mount of Olives, which is in front of Jerusalem on the east; and the Mount of Olives will be split in its middle from east to west by a very large valley, so that half of the mountain will move toward the north and the other half toward the south. You will flee by the valley of My mountains, for the valley of the mountains will reach to Azel; yes, you will flee just as you fled before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah. Then the LORD, my God, will come, and all the holy ones with Him! In that day there will be no light; the luminaries will dwindle. For it will be a unique day which is known to the LORD, neither day nor night, but it will come about that at evening time there will be light. And in that day living waters will flow out of Jerusalem, half of them toward the eastern sea and the other half toward the western sea; it will be in summer as well as in winter. And the LORD will be king over all the earth; in that day the LORD will be the only one, and His name the only one. All the land will be changed into a plain from Geba to Rimmon south of Jerusalem; but Jerusalem will rise and remain on its site from Benjamin’s Gate as far as the place of the First Gate to the Corner Gate, and from the Tower of Hananel to the king’s wine presses. People will live in it, and there will no longer be a curse, for Jerusalem will dwell in security.” (Zechariah 14:3–11)
(and more: (Obadiah 17–21, Isaiah 30:15–26, Joel 2:18–20, Isaiah 29:17–23, Hosea 2:14–23, Micah 2:12–13, Zephaniah 2:3–7, etc)
There are other passages about the day of the Lord that described the very end of it, which involves the total destruction of the universe with fire. That part is what Peter emphasized in his 2nd epistle. He states that total universal destruction happens within the day of the Lord, but certainly not the only event. These Scriptures (above) bear witness.
It is impossible for all of this to happen in a 24-hour day. These events span longs lengths of time, involving judgment, military conquest, the expansion of the Jewish claim on their promised land, the rise of the man of lawlessness, the desolation of Jerusalem, the doom of Babylon, the return of Jesus. These events will be fulfilled in the prophecies written in Revelation 6-19.
Side note,
This is a Biblical Discussion forum. I will only respond to Biblical arguments, not dismissals of doctrine you don't agree with.
If this 70th week was fulfilled from 27 A.D-34 A.D., can you point out what these events were? (you may have some trouble because Jesus spoke of them as future events during the Olivet discourse).
Then go ahead; tell me what it will be since you know...
When we're testing the weight of an argument, it doesn't matter what label we write on it. What matters is...how heavy it is. We test the validity of arguments with the scale of God's Word. All arguments are welcome to be tested. We do not believe in censorship. I would never tell someone they aren't allowed to put their view to the test because I disagree. On the contrary, God invites opposing views to be brought to the table and be put to the test (Isaiah 1:18, Acts 17:2, 17:2–3).
This is a Biblical Discussion forum. I will only respond to Biblical arguments, not dismissals of doctrine you don't agree with.
Week 70:
““Then he (the ruler of bold face [Dan 8]) will make a firm covenant with the many (the Jews) for one week, but in the middle of the week he will put a stop to sacrifice and grain offering; and on the wing of abominations will come one who makes desolate, even until a complete destruction, one that is decreed, is poured out on the one who makes desolate.”” (Daniel 9:27)
““Then he (the ruler of bold face [Dan 8]) will make a firm covenant with the many (the Jews) for one week, but in the middle of the week he will put a stop to sacrifice and grain offering; and on the wing of abominations will come one who makes desolate, even until a complete destruction, one that is decreed, is poured out on the one who makes desolate.”” (Daniel 9:27)
If this 70th week was fulfilled from 27 A.D-34 A.D., can you point out what these events were? (you may have some trouble because Jesus spoke of them as future events during the Olivet discourse).
Then go ahead; tell me what it will be since you know...
When we're testing the weight of an argument, it doesn't matter what label we write on it. What matters is...how heavy it is. We test the validity of arguments with the scale of God's Word. All arguments are welcome to be tested. We do not believe in censorship. I would never tell someone they aren't allowed to put their view to the test because I disagree. On the contrary, God invites opposing views to be brought to the table and be put to the test (Isaiah 1:18, Acts 17:2, 17:2–3).
What we know:
1. Strong's G2250 is defined as "24 hours" - not a plurality of days
2. Jesus said His coming - which is as "a thief in the night" - will be as it was in the days of Noah, when God destroyed the Earth in a matter of hours, not 7 more years.
3. The only way for you to make "day" refer to "7 years" is for you to subjectively introduce symbolism, which Peter's contextual Deluge comparison demands we do not.
4. Your only justification for inserting symbolism into 2 Peter 3:10 KJV is to free Jesuit Futurism from the grave in which 2 Peter 3:10 KJV holds it -- symbolic use of "day" to refer to "period of years" that the Bible may contain does not demand we make use of symbolism here, for reasons above.
Now, if you can find a verse where the Flood took years to kill everything, then please share it. Otherwise, please stick to Scripture, and put away Jesuit lies.
1. Strong's G2250 is defined as "24 hours" - not a plurality of days
2. Jesus said His coming - which is as "a thief in the night" - will be as it was in the days of Noah, when God destroyed the Earth in a matter of hours, not 7 more years.
3. The only way for you to make "day" refer to "7 years" is for you to subjectively introduce symbolism, which Peter's contextual Deluge comparison demands we do not.
4. Your only justification for inserting symbolism into 2 Peter 3:10 KJV is to free Jesuit Futurism from the grave in which 2 Peter 3:10 KJV holds it -- symbolic use of "day" to refer to "period of years" that the Bible may contain does not demand we make use of symbolism here, for reasons above.
Now, if you can find a verse where the Flood took years to kill everything, then please share it. Otherwise, please stick to Scripture, and put away Jesuit lies.
I've already pointed out that a 24-period is only 1 of 4 ways to translate it. If you must insist on using Strong's (which, by the way, isn't the most authoritative lexicon), here is James Strong's translation of the word:
See? It can mean a period, a while, or years. It just depends on how the biblical authors describe it. I have provided those passages in post# 414. Why are you ignoring the Scriptures?
A matter of hours?... How do you know that?
The claim that I am using symbolism can only be true if the word "ἡμέρα" never means anything other than a 24-hour day.
Examples of ἡμέρα (Strong's G2250) meaning something other than a 24-hour day:
“And it happened at that time that she fell sick and died; and when they had washed her body, they laid it in an upper room.” (Acts 9:37)
So...
The day of the Lord is a period of time yet the future. Jesus describes some of the events that the OT prophets wrote about concerning this day (ἡμέρα). The salvation he speaks of in Matt 24 is the deliverance of Israel from those events and they have nothing to do with your position on the soteriological debate.
See? It can mean a period, a while, or years. It just depends on how the biblical authors describe it. I have provided those passages in post# 414. Why are you ignoring the Scriptures?
A matter of hours?... How do you know that?
“Then the flood came upon the earth for forty days, and the water increased and lifted up the ark, so that it rose above the earth.” (Genesis 7:17)
Symbolism?...yes the Bible uses symbolic language sometimes. Subjectively...absolutely not. What symbol have I introduced apart from Scripture? The Bible's usage of the "day of the Lord" describes a period of time (provided in post# 414). If you are only reading the one verse you are quoting, then yes it may seem to be just one 24-hour day. The claim that I am using symbolism can only be true if the word "ἡμέρα" never means anything other than a 24-hour day.
Examples of ἡμέρα (Strong's G2250) meaning something other than a 24-hour day:
““And having received it in their turn, our fathers brought it in with Joshua upon dispossessing the nations whom God drove out before our fathers, until the time of David.” (Acts 7:45)
““Then you are not the Egyptian who some time ago stirred up a revolt and led the four thousand men of the Assassins out into the wilderness?”” (Acts 21:38)
““At that time they made a calf and brought a sacrifice to the idol, and were rejoicing in the works of their hands.” (Acts 7:41)“And it happened at that time that she fell sick and died; and when they had washed her body, they laid it in an upper room.” (Acts 9:37)
So...
The day of the Lord is a period of time yet the future. Jesus describes some of the events that the OT prophets wrote about concerning this day (ἡμέρα). The salvation he speaks of in Matt 24 is the deliverance of Israel from those events and they have nothing to do with your position on the soteriological debate.
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