TONGUES TODAY
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Yes He did.......but accordingto Mark 16....He personally only commissioned the ELEVEN.
The apostles were special, but only because of their message. As long as they preached their special message, special power would be available to prove the truth of their special message.
Acts 14:3........
"Therefore they stayed there a long time, speaking boldly in the Lord, who was bearing witness to the word of His grace, granting signs and wonders to be done by their hands."
First, there is no evidence that anyone other than the apostles received the baptism of the Holy Spirit on the day of Pentecost. That blessing had been promised to them (see Acts 1:5, 8). The only other exception was to the household of Cornelius, in fulfillment of Joel’s prophecy, as a divine token that Gentiles were to be admitted into the church (Joel 2:28ff; cf. Acts 2:17ff; 10:44; 11:15; 15:8).
Second, there is no explicit testimony which indicates that anyone other than the apostles possessed miraculous gifts for some time following Pentecost. If the claim be made that the expression “gift of the Holy Spirit” (Acts 2:38) reflects such, we would insist that this is a point to be proven, not merely asserted. The expression itself does not determine the nature of the gift. In fact, the evidence of Luke’s subsequent record suggests otherwise.
Note the following:
These passages are puzzling if all of the early Christians were going about performing miracles.
The apostles were special, but only because of their message. As long as they preached their special message, special power would be available to prove the truth of their special message.
Acts 14:3........
"Therefore they stayed there a long time, speaking boldly in the Lord, who was bearing witness to the word of His grace, granting signs and wonders to be done by their hands."
First, there is no evidence that anyone other than the apostles received the baptism of the Holy Spirit on the day of Pentecost. That blessing had been promised to them (see Acts 1:5, 8). The only other exception was to the household of Cornelius, in fulfillment of Joel’s prophecy, as a divine token that Gentiles were to be admitted into the church (Joel 2:28ff; cf. Acts 2:17ff; 10:44; 11:15; 15:8).
Second, there is no explicit testimony which indicates that anyone other than the apostles possessed miraculous gifts for some time following Pentecost. If the claim be made that the expression “gift of the Holy Spirit” (Acts 2:38) reflects such, we would insist that this is a point to be proven, not merely asserted. The expression itself does not determine the nature of the gift. In fact, the evidence of Luke’s subsequent record suggests otherwise.
Note the following:
- “[W]onders and signs were done through the apostles” (Acts 2:43).
- “y the hands of the apostles were many signs and wonders wrought” (5:12).
These passages are puzzling if all of the early Christians were going about performing miracles.
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For to which of the angels said He at any time, thou art My Son. This day have I begotten Thee?
Does the author of Hebrews accept the idea that 'the angel of the Lord' refers to pre-incarnate Christ? is there any evidence for this view in the NT?
But, IMO, this conversation should be its own thread.
Does the author of Hebrews accept the idea that 'the angel of the Lord' refers to pre-incarnate Christ? is there any evidence for this view in the NT?
But, IMO, this conversation should be its own thread.
S
why do you think I am your friend?
I didn't say I don't like you...I said you are not my fav person here. Big difference
seems to me you are taking liberty with my post and changing what I said, to sound so righteous...but you are making things up here (polite way of saying you are lying)
the Bible clearly says Paul spoke in tongues..but you, in your vain style of changing the truth, have decided he meant different languages
I speak 3 myself...2 better than the third, but I don't call that tongues.. but I do have the gift of tongues
you are just running around in circles and it's quite noticeable
I didn't say I don't like you...I said you are not my fav person here. Big difference
seems to me you are taking liberty with my post and changing what I said, to sound so righteous...but you are making things up here (polite way of saying you are lying)
the Bible clearly says Paul spoke in tongues..but you, in your vain style of changing the truth, have decided he meant different languages
I speak 3 myself...2 better than the third, but I don't call that tongues.. but I do have the gift of tongues
you are just running around in circles and it's quite noticeable
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Jesus sent out the 70 also.
Why would you have a problem with other believers who preach the same message doing miracles then?
Yes there is. A more natural, plain sense reading of Acts 2 would be one piece of evidence, where 'all' in Acts 2:1 refers to all who were in the upper room,.
The Joel passage Peter quoted is about the Spirit being poured out on all flesh, your sons and daughers prophesying. then Peter says to repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. Why does your interpretation of the passage have so little to do with the words of the message Peter preached? Why take a message about the Spirit being poured out on 'all flesh' and 'your sons and your daughters' prophesying and interpret that to mean only the 11 were baptized with the Spirit?
When John spoke the words about the baptism with the Holy Spirit in the gospels, it is obvious that the Twelve were not the only ones present.
But before Acts 1 it is well established that there were miracle workers other than the 12. The seventy, for example, and there were those who did not follow with the Twelve who performed the miracle of casting out demons in Jesus' name, and Jesus said do not forbid them.
Why would you have a problem with other believers who preach the same message doing miracles then?
Yes there is. A more natural, plain sense reading of Acts 2 would be one piece of evidence, where 'all' in Acts 2:1 refers to all who were in the upper room,.
The Joel passage Peter quoted is about the Spirit being poured out on all flesh, your sons and daughers prophesying. then Peter says to repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. Why does your interpretation of the passage have so little to do with the words of the message Peter preached? Why take a message about the Spirit being poured out on 'all flesh' and 'your sons and your daughters' prophesying and interpret that to mean only the 11 were baptized with the Spirit?
When John spoke the words about the baptism with the Holy Spirit in the gospels, it is obvious that the Twelve were not the only ones present.
But before Acts 1 it is well established that there were miracle workers other than the 12. The seventy, for example, and there were those who did not follow with the Twelve who performed the miracle of casting out demons in Jesus' name, and Jesus said do not forbid them.
All of your comments are sarcastic......and are opinions. That seems to be your way of talking to others.
Would you care to give us YOUR exegesis and explination of Mark 16:14-19............
"Afterward he appeared unto the eleven as they sat at meat, and upbraided them with their unbelief and hardness of heart, because they believed not them which had seen him after he was risen.
15 And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.
16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
17 And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;
18 They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover."
This is NOT a trick or baited question. Just a genuine question so that I can try and understand where you are coming from so that we can have a basis of communication. So I am asking you to correct the 50 years of study and learning I have accumulated.
#1. Who is the CONTEXT of verse #15 ?
#2. Who is the "antecedent" (Greek Grammar- use your google ability) of the the word "THEM" in verse #15?
#3. What were the ones in verse #14 commissioned to do?
#4. Who is Jesus talking about in verse #16?
#5. Who is the "THEM" in verse #17?
#6. What are the ones in focus, standing in front of Jesus told that they will receive in verse #17?
#7. What are the abilities Jesus told these men that they would be able to do:
A.
B.
C.
D.
E.
#8. Biblically speaking, are there Apostles today and if so, what Scriptures give the qualifications of that office, TODAY!
In advance.....I want to thank you for the time and effort to help my understanding of these Scriptures and I eagerly wait for your responce.
Would you care to give us YOUR exegesis and explination of Mark 16:14-19............
"Afterward he appeared unto the eleven as they sat at meat, and upbraided them with their unbelief and hardness of heart, because they believed not them which had seen him after he was risen.
15 And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.
16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
17 And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;
18 They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover."
This is NOT a trick or baited question. Just a genuine question so that I can try and understand where you are coming from so that we can have a basis of communication. So I am asking you to correct the 50 years of study and learning I have accumulated.
#1. Who is the CONTEXT of verse #15 ?
#2. Who is the "antecedent" (Greek Grammar- use your google ability) of the the word "THEM" in verse #15?
#3. What were the ones in verse #14 commissioned to do?
#4. Who is Jesus talking about in verse #16?
#5. Who is the "THEM" in verse #17?
#6. What are the ones in focus, standing in front of Jesus told that they will receive in verse #17?
#7. What are the abilities Jesus told these men that they would be able to do:
A.
B.
C.
D.
E.
#8. Biblically speaking, are there Apostles today and if so, what Scriptures give the qualifications of that office, TODAY!
In advance.....I want to thank you for the time and effort to help my understanding of these Scriptures and I eagerly wait for your responce.
Do you have any evidence that SDAs teach that? I'd never heard of that. From what I have read, they teach that Michael is a reference to the preincarnate Christ, but are trinitarian, also. They have a few doctrines in common with the JWs, who apparently drew from Adventism for some of their doctrines.
Ok
You are claiming they are off
Way off.
I already told you i have no dog in that fight.
YOU MAKE THE CLAIM.
YOU POST THE AOG statement of faith.
SHOW US the vast error that exists.
YOU made the claim. Now back it up.
Lose salvation?
That is a theological ping pong ball that is never going to be sorted out.
The prodigal was family and LEFT. He was the equivalent of born again, then going into the world and leaving his heavenly father.
But he came back.
Could he lose his salvation?
Who are those blotted out of the book of life?
You need to look at both sides instead of wildly picking a side and not reading any further.
Those positions you take are not virtuous.
Osas is the most circular reasoning of any doctrine.
Clever but not from heaven.
The more you talk, the more baptist doctrine comes out.
( osas)
Uh huh.
Pssst....stop acting like you are not cessationist.
You are claiming they are off
Way off.
I already told you i have no dog in that fight.
YOU MAKE THE CLAIM.
YOU POST THE AOG statement of faith.
SHOW US the vast error that exists.
YOU made the claim. Now back it up.
Lose salvation?
That is a theological ping pong ball that is never going to be sorted out.
The prodigal was family and LEFT. He was the equivalent of born again, then going into the world and leaving his heavenly father.
But he came back.
Could he lose his salvation?
Who are those blotted out of the book of life?
You need to look at both sides instead of wildly picking a side and not reading any further.
Those positions you take are not virtuous.
Osas is the most circular reasoning of any doctrine.
Clever but not from heaven.
The more you talk, the more baptist doctrine comes out.
( osas)
Uh huh.
Pssst....stop acting like you are not cessationist.
No sir I am not going to do the work for you.
I know exactly what those 16 truths are, if you want to know YOU do the study my friend.
YES...The AOG teach that the saved man can lose his salvation. They always have from their inception.
OSAS IS EXACTLY what the Bible say which is why I am what I am.
THAT is why I left it, exactly for the reasons you just posted.
I only need to look at and consider ONE SIDE brother......the Word of God!
Thank you for the compliment. I am a Cessationist because that is what the Bible teaches and I AM a Southern Baptist. Never ever suggested anything else!!!!!!!
I know exactly what those 16 truths are, if you want to know YOU do the study my friend.
YES...The AOG teach that the saved man can lose his salvation. They always have from their inception.
OSAS IS EXACTLY what the Bible say which is why I am what I am.
THAT is why I left it, exactly for the reasons you just posted.
I only need to look at and consider ONE SIDE brother......the Word of God!
Thank you for the compliment. I am a Cessationist because that is what the Bible teaches and I AM a Southern Baptist. Never ever suggested anything else!!!!!!!
YOu need to read your Bible guy.
Did you hear of Stephen? Acts 6:8 "And Stephen, full of faith and power, did great wonders and miracles among the people."
This is the word of God that completely debunks your statement. Stephen was not an Apostle YET it SAYS!!!!!!!! Stephen performed miracles.
I guess you never heard of Ananias who laid his hands on Saul who became known as Paul? Acts 9: 17-18
17 And Ananias went his way and entered the house; and laying his hands on him he said, “Brother Saul, the Lord Jesus, who appeared to you on the road as you came, has sent me that you may receive your sight and be filled with the Holy Spirit.” 18 Immediately there fell from his eyes something like scales, and he received his sight at once; and he arose and was baptized.
What was Ananias? do you know? this man who was sent to Paul and pray for him? Had to be an Apostle right?
NOPE!
Acts 9:10
10 Now there was a certain disciple at Damascus named Ananias; and to him, the Lord said in a vision, “Ananias.”
You are wrong and in error But you continue to attack others you disagree with. That will not continue much longer guy.
Please read Your Bible and stop saying unbiblical things that you are clueless about.
I now have asked you TWICE.
Now this is the 3rd time.
Please post where what I have Said that is way out of line. SPECIFICALLY! What have I said that is not Biblical????
YOU not lieing what I have said is not the same as "Being way out of line" Biblically."
NO ONE....has a gun to your head forcing you to post responces to me. Please feel free to say good bye any time you want to.
I enjoy responding to your opinions as you never seem o be able to post ANY Bible scripture to support anything you say....but again, if you are reading things you have never learned and they bother you, then you can do one of two thing...........
1. Say Good-bye and your stress is over.
2. YOU open YOUR Bible, READ it, do the study and work that I have done and be able to say that you are workman so that the Lord can say....well done!
Either way.....God bless you and thank you for your time, and I hope that because you do not agree with me that you do not continue th o think that I am the enemy.
Now this is the 3rd time.
Please post where what I have Said that is way out of line. SPECIFICALLY! What have I said that is not Biblical????
YOU not lieing what I have said is not the same as "Being way out of line" Biblically."
NO ONE....has a gun to your head forcing you to post responces to me. Please feel free to say good bye any time you want to.
I enjoy responding to your opinions as you never seem o be able to post ANY Bible scripture to support anything you say....but again, if you are reading things you have never learned and they bother you, then you can do one of two thing...........
1. Say Good-bye and your stress is over.
2. YOU open YOUR Bible, READ it, do the study and work that I have done and be able to say that you are workman so that the Lord can say....well done!
Either way.....God bless you and thank you for your time, and I hope that because you do not agree with me that you do not continue th o think that I am the enemy.