Body Of CHRIST "Does NOT" Go To Heaven?
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So is the church the Bride or her bridal attendants?
Older versions of the bible than St. Jerome's vulgate says
"behold at midnight a cry the Bridegroom cometh with the bride ...."
Even though Jerome omitted her and all translations have followed him she is still there conspicuous by her absence. Why is she omitted? my guess is that Jerome had espied as he thought the church in the maidens and he knew well there could not be 2 churches so he dropped her. That solved his problem but it completely alters the meaning of the parable.
Of COURSE there is no question as to whether the Bride should gain entrance to her own wedding feast.
Who are the maidens?
Older versions of the bible than St. Jerome's vulgate says
"behold at midnight a cry the Bridegroom cometh with the bride ...."
Even though Jerome omitted her and all translations have followed him she is still there conspicuous by her absence. Why is she omitted? my guess is that Jerome had espied as he thought the church in the maidens and he knew well there could not be 2 churches so he dropped her. That solved his problem but it completely alters the meaning of the parable.
Of COURSE there is no question as to whether the Bride should gain entrance to her own wedding feast.
Who are the maidens?
I started believing pre-trib. That is what I was taught. I never saw it in scripture, and started seeing scripture that contradicted pre-trib. What I do not get is why you think what you present is evidence for pre-trib. Assuming more than one return of Christ is a huge assumption, not something we should believe without some solid evidence. it just does not make sense with the wording we have. If the church receives rest when Jesus returns executing vengence on the wicked in II Thessalonians 1, how does tha tline up at all with pre-trib.
Scripture tells us that salvation is a simple matter, as seen in Paul's answer to the Philippian jailer's question of what he must do to be saved. "Believe on the Lord Jesus and you will be saved". It is that simple.
It is trust in what Christ did for us on the cross, and NOT what we may do for Him, which is what "commitment" is about.
This passage is mostly misunderstood. The whole basis of this crowd's appeal for entering the kingdom is related to what they have done in Jesus' name. This shows they were religious only. The fact that Jesus tells them "I NEVER knew you" proves that none in this crowd ever believed in Him for salvation.
So, they were not believers, not ever.
This verse is not relevant to gaining salvation, or losing it, which is impossible.
The Bible is clear about such people. They will be disciplined by the Lord. Heb 12:11. And it will be painful. They won't be getting away with anything.
Scripture tells us we need ONLY ONE thing for salvation: faith in Christ, which means trusting what He has done for us, rather than what we may do for Him.
Salvation is by grace, which means there is NOTHING we can do to earn or deserve salvation.
It is trust in what Christ did for us on the cross, and NOT what we may do for Him, which is what "commitment" is about.
This passage is mostly misunderstood. The whole basis of this crowd's appeal for entering the kingdom is related to what they have done in Jesus' name. This shows they were religious only. The fact that Jesus tells them "I NEVER knew you" proves that none in this crowd ever believed in Him for salvation.
So, they were not believers, not ever.
This verse is not relevant to gaining salvation, or losing it, which is impossible.
The Bible is clear about such people. They will be disciplined by the Lord. Heb 12:11. And it will be painful. They won't be getting away with anything.
Scripture tells us we need ONLY ONE thing for salvation: faith in Christ, which means trusting what He has done for us, rather than what we may do for Him.
Salvation is by grace, which means there is NOTHING we can do to earn or deserve salvation.
Don't wait. You didn't provide any proof for your appraisal of my post.
I don't want to discuss "pretribulation rapture" I'd rather discuss Biblical prophecy.
I posted scriptures which state plainly Jesus returns once more. I'm sorry you can't agree with that.
Let's just say we disagree. I can't accept "church age" "dispensation" doctrinal ideas in place of the prophetic picture.
He comes on the clouds as the prophets witnessed he would and as he told us himself.
I want to focus on his return, which is our hope and joy.
We must witness about him until his glorious return.
I don't want to discuss "pretribulation rapture" I'd rather discuss Biblical prophecy.
I posted scriptures which state plainly Jesus returns once more. I'm sorry you can't agree with that.
Let's just say we disagree. I can't accept "church age" "dispensation" doctrinal ideas in place of the prophetic picture.
He comes on the clouds as the prophets witnessed he would and as he told us himself.
I want to focus on his return, which is our hope and joy.
We must witness about him until his glorious return.
3933 parthénos - properly, a virgin; a woman who has never had sexual relations; a female (virgin), beyond puberty but not yet married; (figuratively) believers when they are pure (chaste), i.e. faithful to Christ their heavenly Bridegroom (2 Cor 11:2; Rev 14:4).
2 For I am jealous over you with godly jealousy: for I have espoused you to one husband, that I may present you as a chaste virgin to Christ.
mat 24
38 For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,
39 And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
40 Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
41 Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
42 Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come.
One taken/left BEFORE THE FLOOD....same as the 50/50 dynamic of the 10 virgins...both are the rapture
48 But and if that evil servant shall say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming;
49 And shall begin to smite his fellowservants, and to eat and drink with the drunken;
50 The lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looketh not for him, and in an hour that he is not aware of,
51 And shall cut him asunder, and appoint him his portion with the hypocrites: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
HMMMM ....His coming delayed? or they SAID his coming WILL BE DELAYED by the trib
(that Jesus himself depicts that we do not go through)
no matter what,postrib rapturists INSIST his coming is delayed by the trib.
even when revealed that Jesus comes for ripe fruit DURING THE GT they default to their error of omitting verses.
2 For I am jealous over you with godly jealousy: for I have espoused you to one husband, that I may present you as a chaste virgin to Christ.
mat 24
38 For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,
39 And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
40 Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
41 Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
42 Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come.
One taken/left BEFORE THE FLOOD....same as the 50/50 dynamic of the 10 virgins...both are the rapture
48 But and if that evil servant shall say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming;
49 And shall begin to smite his fellowservants, and to eat and drink with the drunken;
50 The lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looketh not for him, and in an hour that he is not aware of,
51 And shall cut him asunder, and appoint him his portion with the hypocrites: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
HMMMM ....His coming delayed? or they SAID his coming WILL BE DELAYED by the trib
(that Jesus himself depicts that we do not go through)
no matter what,postrib rapturists INSIST his coming is delayed by the trib.
even when revealed that Jesus comes for ripe fruit DURING THE GT they default to their error of omitting verses.
May I ask which versions have this?
[note: I do not believe the "virgins" are the "bride"... I'm curious which versions read as you are showing it, above. Thanks.
]
[note: I do not believe the "virgins" are the "bride"... I'm curious which versions read as you are showing it, above. Thanks.
]
bridegroom
virgins
entering a room with a door WITH THE BRIDEGROOM.
THE DOOR was shut.
(but we mustn't assume that has anything to do with intimacy correct)
body of Christ = virgins
nowhere do the supposed "attendants" return to the brides house to supposedly fetch "one bride".
because "attendants" help to reframe and destroy the parable.
Before the flood.
Jesus placed his coming BEFORE THE FLOOD.
You need a post flood deliverance.
You need Noah removed/ delivered/ rescued from the earth POSTFLOOD.
Your model says the church is DELIVERED/ REMOVED after the flood.
Lot is worrisome also. You saying lot and Noah were delivered/ taken out AFTER JUDGEMENT???
HUH????
Jesus placed his coming BEFORE THE FLOOD.
You need a post flood deliverance.
You need Noah removed/ delivered/ rescued from the earth POSTFLOOD.
Your model says the church is DELIVERED/ REMOVED after the flood.
Lot is worrisome also. You saying lot and Noah were delivered/ taken out AFTER JUDGEMENT???
HUH????
It does NOT say 'before the rapture' in Matthew 24. It says 'after the tribulation'-- the topic we are discussing.
21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.
...
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
Notice 'the Son of Man coming' after 'the tribulation'.
And notice
37 But as the days of Noah were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
38 For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,
39 And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
Sure, it is talking about the flood, but the passage already sets the events after the tribulation
Why should I rely on you to properly interpret an allegory, when your allegorical interpretation directly contradicts what is plainly stated in the passage?
21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.
...
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
Notice 'the Son of Man coming' after 'the tribulation'.
And notice
37 But as the days of Noah were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
38 For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,
39 And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
Sure, it is talking about the flood, but the passage already sets the events after the tribulation
Why should I rely on you to properly interpret an allegory, when your allegorical interpretation directly contradicts what is plainly stated in the passage?
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You seem very confused. The passage deals with the coming of the Son of Man 'AFTER THE TRIBULATION'. Those are the very words of the passage. The passage does not compare the tribulation to the flood. The events related to the coming of the Son of Man are compared to Noah and the flood. Read the chapter.
Again, why would anyone believe your interpretations of allegories when they do not line with with the direct statements of the passage?
Again, why would anyone believe your interpretations of allegories when they do not line with with the direct statements of the passage?
