When spiritual leaders fall.

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Edify

Well-known member
Jan 27, 2021
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#42
If you look at the allegations against him in past several years, he is also a major con man.
His word salad apologetics was mere a front for his ego and celebrity status.
For years, his site called him "Doctor", until someone called him on it. He didn't have a doctorate in anything.
 

GiveThanks

God Will Make A Way
Dec 6, 2020
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#43
I did not follow this man and I dont know much about it, but while we may never know whether the alegations are true, this is yet another reminder that we need to look to Jesus alone, our perfect saviour, and not imperfect mankind.

The scripture is true, Romans 3:23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God
 

Edify

Well-known member
Jan 27, 2021
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#44
Some will say it's not right to bring this out to the public where it belongs. But if their own pastor did it & it was swept underthe rug, they would raise 10 kinds of cain over it because the members weren't allowed to find out.

BTW, if it is deemed wrong by some on here, how can mocking & speaking bad about the revealers be right?

The RZIM apology video is a smoking gun. Ravi's OWN PEOPLE confessing to the truth.

Nobody here is trying to make him look bad. He did that to himself.

Its a sad day indeed when people get flack for telling the truth.:rolleyes:
 
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Godsgirl83

Guest
#45
Wow, I have the power to make a female speechless... I wonder if the Avengers will be calling me?:ROFL:
all I really can say is that (to me, and this is just my opinion here) your words have NOT lived up to your screen name......
now being the following day and a little more rested as I go back and reread them I still can not tell if you were seriously attacking Billy Graham, or in some strange way really playing up the overhype of how if somethings on the internet it must be true........
either way leaves me shaking my head.

And as far as leaving a female speechless,
hate to break it to you but that's not now or EVER the case with this one (me) ;)
 

Edify

Well-known member
Jan 27, 2021
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654
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#46
all I really can say is that (to me, and this is just my opinion here) your words have NOT lived up to your screen name......
now being the following day and a little more rested as I go back and reread them I still can not tell if you were seriously attacking Billy Graham, or in some strange way really playing up the overhype of how if somethings on the internet it must be true........
either way leaves me shaking my head.

And as far as leaving a female speechless,
hate to break it to you but that's not now or EVER the case with this one (me) ;)
I didn't attack Billy Graham. I never called him names or mocked him in any way.
 
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Godsgirl83

Guest
#47
I didn't attack Billy Graham. I never called him names or mocked him in any way.
Well then, thank you for clearing that up.....
you know, very few men leave a lasting legacy behind that continue to spread and proclaim the gospel truth ;)
Food for thought: being friendly to someone is FAR different from being friends with them.
 

CS1

Well-known member
May 23, 2012
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#48
Well, Graham was a 33rd degree freemason who proved it by all his Masonic friends he had, besides the presidents.
The Bible says it plainly, John 15:19 If you were of the world, the world would love you as its own; but because you are not of the world, but I chose you out of the world, because of this the world hates you.
The media loved Graham, The magazines & newspapers loved Graham. The Clinton family loved Graham. He & Bill were good friends. Yet somehow I suspect you don't believe this. It's out there on the net.:)
No, he was not LOL
 

GiveThanks

God Will Make A Way
Dec 6, 2020
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#49
When our Christian teachers preach one thing but does something else, Jesus offers the following advise: Matthew 23:3 Therefore whatever they tell you to observe, that observe and do, but do not do according to their works; for they say, and do not do.

Because the fact is some of them do have sound teachings. So even if they fall from grace, we can still find value in what they taught.
 

Edify

Well-known member
Jan 27, 2021
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#50
When our Christian teachers preach one thing but does something else, Jesus offers the following advise: Matthew 23:3 Therefore whatever they tell you to observe, that observe and do, but do not do according to their works; for they say, and do not do.

Because the fact is some of them do have sound teachings. So even if they fall from grace, we can still find value in what they taught.
I would never listen to them no matter what. Anyone that bad can't be trusted. My goodness, some of the good ones can't be fully trusted because they don't really know that much. They are simply riding on their reputations.
 

CS1

Well-known member
May 23, 2012
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#51
I would never listen to them no matter what. Anyone that bad can't be trusted. My goodness, some of the good ones can't be fully trusted because they don't really know that much. They are simply riding on their reputations.
I think anyone in this day who takes what is on Youtube or regular media channels as truth, has serious issues with discernment.

FYI Billy Graham has spoken to more POTUS than any other Pastor. The Idea that Speaking to BillmClinton is a sin, that is foolishness.
 

notuptome

Senior Member
May 17, 2013
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#52
I think anyone in this day who takes what is on Youtube or regular media channels as truth, has serious issues with discernment.

FYI Billy Graham has spoken to more POTUS than any other Pastor. The Idea that Speaking to BillmClinton is a sin, that is foolishness.
Dr. Graham would more appropriately be labeled as an evangelist not a Pastor.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 

CS1

Well-known member
May 23, 2012
13,007
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#53
Dr. Graham would more appropriately be labeled as an evangelist not a Pastor.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
Excuse me, Evangelist Billy Graham. I will accept that correction and not rob you of your moment of celebration.
 

notuptome

Senior Member
May 17, 2013
15,050
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#54
Excuse me, Evangelist Billy Graham. I will accept that correction and not rob you of your moment of celebration.
Don't take it personal but it is the title he preferred.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 
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SophieT

Guest
#56
Well, Graham was a 33rd degree freemason who proved it by all his Masonic friends he had, besides the presidents.
The Bible says it plainly, John 15:19 If you were of the world, the world would love you as its own; but because you are not of the world, but I chose you out of the world, because of this the world hates you.
The media loved Graham, The magazines & newspapers loved Graham. The Clinton family loved Graham. He & Bill were good friends. Yet somehow I suspect you don't believe this. It's out there on the net.:)

right. And I am the Easter bunny. I bet you didn't know the Easter bunny was a girl :LOL:

Guess what? I'm out there on the net too but you don't know who I am.

Graham lived in a different time. It was good politics to be religious back then and the words male and female were not offensive
 

GiveThanks

God Will Make A Way
Dec 6, 2020
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#57
I would never listen to them no matter what. Anyone that bad can't be trusted. My goodness, some of the good ones can't be fully trusted because they don't really know that much. They are simply riding on their reputations.
I said that because there are some who followed him and their faith is shaken because of the scandal. But if what he preached was truth, then i think they can still hold on to that.
 

Pam

New member
Mar 4, 2021
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#58
With the recent allegations against Ravi Zacharias coming about, I felt pressed to ask, what do we do when our spiritual leader fall?

Although the claims made against Ravi after his passing have not been proven to be true, there is evidence to support that they might be.

This is very disheartening to many as he was a very well established apologetic and ministry leader. His work reached thousands and he did speak the truth of God.

I think of my own sin and how I’m only a few inches from falling into the pit of transgressions at any given time. This only confirms the notion that we all have fallen short the glory of God and need a savior for past, current, and future sin.
 

Edify

Well-known member
Jan 27, 2021
1,559
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#59
Dr. Graham would more appropriately be labeled as an evangelist not a Pastor.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
"Doctor" graham never was a doctor, though he claimed it. AAMOF, he didn't even have a Master's degree in theological studies at all.
 

Edify

Well-known member
Jan 27, 2021
1,559
654
113
#60
I think anyone in this day who takes what is on Youtube or regular media channels as truth, has serious issues with discernment.

FYI Billy Graham has spoken to more POTUS than any other Pastor. The Idea that Speaking to BillmClinton is a sin, that is foolishness.
Being friends of presidents doesn't amount to squat actually. :)
BTW, Graham & Bill clinton were very good friends for years. Graham said Bill Clinton missed his calling & shoulda been an evangelist. :rolleyes: