As the angel of the LORD, Jesus appeared as a man, or spoke, to many in the O.T. Do you believe He has appeared since the Ascension?

I'm not so sure that any of the appearances of "the Angel or the Lord" are Christophanies. The word angel would kind of indicate the contrary.
Also Jesus kind of squashes the idea of Jesus appearing to people today (not that they couldn't have a vision or something)
Then if anyone says to you, ‘Look, here is the Christ!’ or ‘There he is!’ do not believe it. For false christs and false prophets will arise and perform great signs and wonders, so as to lead astray, if possible, even the elect. See, I have told you beforehand. So, if they say to you, ‘Look, he is in the wilderness,’ do not go out. If they say, ‘Look, he is in the inner rooms,’ do not believe it. For as the lightning comes from the east and shines as far as the west, so will be the coming of the Son of Man.
Matthew 24:23‭-‬27 ESV

Absolutely, every reference of the "angel of the LORD" (LORD all caps) was Jesus Christ. There are many other passages of an "angel of the Lord", who is not Jesus. Just read a study from another member on this thread who says the English bibles do a disservice with the "angel of the LORD" choice. He claims the better translation would have been "Yahweh Messenger" because Jesus was often referred to as Yahweh and as a messenger in the Old Testament.

I'll look into it.

Absolutely, every reference of the "angel of the LORD" (LORD all caps) was Jesus Christ. There are many other passages of an "angel of the Lord", who is not Jesus. Just read a study from another member on this thread who says the English bibles do a disservice with the "angel of the LORD" choice. He claims the better translation would have been "Yahweh Messenger" because Jesus was often referred to as Yahweh and as a messenger in the Old Testament.

Help me out, give me a couple of scripture as a reference.

For instance, the angel of the LORD (Jesus) visited Hagar in her suffering:

• Gen 16:7 And the angel of the LORD found her by a fountain of water in the wilderness, by the fountain in the way to Shur.

Spoke to Abraham to stop him from sacrificing Isaac:

• Gen 22:11 And the angel of the LORD called unto him out of heaven, and said, Abraham, Abraham: and he said, Here am I.

Dealt with Balaam:

• Num 22:31 Then the LORD opened the eyes of Balaam, and he saw the angel of the LORD standing in the way, and his sword drawn in his hand: and he bowed down his head, and fell flat on his face.

Visited Manoah and his wife to prophecy they would have a child named Samson:

• Jdg 13:20 For it came to pass, when the flame went up toward heaven from off the altar, that the angel of the LORD ascended in the flame of the altar. And Manoah and his wife looked on it, and fell on their faces to the ground. 22 And Manoah said unto his wife, We shall surely die, because we have seen God.

And Jesus was in the Burning Bush with Moses, and a vision to David, and spoke to Elijah, and slayed thousands of Assyrian soldiers, etc.

Do you believe He has appeared since the Ascension?
OF crouse,I do.
He can show up anywhere which you can't guess.

Your welcome! No word of God is ever off topic. Oh, the existence and timing of the Rapture is very important to me.

I believed the pre-Trib Rapture for 40 years, as taught, starting with Hal Lindsey's book The Late Great Planet Earth, and I was a member of his church. I assumed that Revelation was confusing so I just never read about end times prophecy at all, hearing only the teaching of it everywhere over the years. I never even knew there were alternative interpretations.

When I retired this year, and was thrown into a lockdown, I received a challenge to prove pre-trib and enthusiastically pursued. I wanted only the Lord and The Holy Spirit to lead me, so I had to constantly redirect my mind from reading anything I'd been told into the verses (really difficult). Reading pre-trib verses IN CONTEXT (much like Rev 3:10), is when I realized they had been taken out of context to support a pre-Trib view. Soon, it became crystal clear, there is one Second Coming (as The Master told us) and one resurrection of the dead in Christ pre-millennial ("the rest" after the 1,000 years) and this coming includes the Rapture of the living, after the dead. I see no evidence the dead in Christ rise 7 years before His coming, and then a second resurrection of the dead 7 years later at His Second Coming. I find that Jesus, Paul and John told us exactly what will happen and we will know when the end comes and won't be caught off guard as unbelievers will be:


God showed me the end times and the Post-Trib, Pre Wrath Rapture, which goes:

1) The Tribulation
2) Antichrist is revealed at the Abomination of Desolation mid-Trib:

2) Jesus 2nd Coming
3) Resurrection of the dead in Christ

4) Rapture of the living

5) The Wrath of God begins

6) The Battle of Armaggedon

...

I did a blog on this, you can find it Here

As you have shown yourself diligent in the matter of the study of the end times, and specifically the Rapture, may I throw some things into the equation for your consideration. You need not answer. I have also cropped your posting to make the 10,000 character-rule.

There are, to my knowledge, 13 mentions of "wrath" in the Book of Revelation Ten say it is "God's wrath", starting with Chapter 6 and ending with Armageddon in Chapter 19. I would say that the whole 3½ years from the Abomination of Desolation to Armageddon is the "wrath of God"

There are three scripture which indicate a pre-Tribulation Rapture. But you will notice that all three are CONDITIONAL.

1. In Philippians 3 the "out-resurrection" (literally, "the resurrection (out) of resurrection") must be "attained to" (v.11), and the subsequent "Upward Call" (lit. Gk.) is a "PRIZE" (v.14). Naturally, Paul's words are almost identical to 1st Thessalonians 4:15-18 which include a Resurrection and a Rapture
2. In Luke 21:36 the context is the the time of (i) the Fig Tree, (ii) the trial that comes on the WHOLE earth, (iii) the coming of the Millennial Kingdom, and (iv) the coming of the Son of man. Since Matthew 24:29-31 shows our Lord Jesus descending from the clouds "AFTER the Tribulation of those days", to "stand before the Son of man" means you must be in the clouds, for the trial is about to begin in Luke 21:36. But again, it is CONDITIONAL. One must be "accounted worthy".
3. In Revelation 3:10, the Church addressed is the only one of two Churches that was commended. It is indicated that the saints already have their crowns (for ruling the Nations - 2:27) as they "Overcame". The promise of Christ here is that "BECAUSE" the Philadelphian saints did something, He will do something - that is, CONDITIONAL. And the Promise is that they would be (i) "kept" FROM - not "IN", and (ii) kept FROM the HOUR of Tribulation. That is, they will not be PRESENT, nor will they be present during the TIME of Tribulation

You could say there as a fourth - 1st Thessalonians 4:15-18. Why? Have you noticed that the Church at Thessaloniki was the only Church that had no moral problems? They were as close to the perfect Church you'll find in scripture (see 1st Thess Chapters 1 & 3). These scriptures, with their CONDITIONS for Rapture, are in sharp contrast to four scriptures which show Christians going through the Great Tribulation. They are Revelation 7:9-17, 12:13-17, 13:7 and 18:4. This adds power to the fact that to miss the Great Tribulation, one must be a ripe firstfruit, worthy of it, attain to it as a "prize". The slothful Christians will be left on earth to endure a "wilderness".

Next, the dilemma of 1st Thessalonians 4:15-18 is because most Christians believe that when a Christian dies, he/she goes to heaven. If this is so, 1st Thessalonians 4:15-17 does not make sense. The "dead in Christ" cannot "RISE", and the living cannot go "together" with the RISEN saints. But if we are strict with wording, we find no scripture indicating going to heaven at death. Much more, if the dead RISE, then they come from below. And according to 1st Corinthians 15:23 ONLY AT HIS COMING! Adding confirmation is the fact that David, who will rule Israel under Christ in the Millennium (Jer.30:9), is found still in Hades in Acts Chapter 2:29-34 - and that, 50 days after Christ's resurrection, and 10 days after His ascension. If the dead in Christ are in Paradise where the thief went WITH Jesus, and this is under the earth (Matt.12:40, Eph.4:8-9), then 1st Thessalonians 4:15-18 makes sense. The dead RISE FIRST, meet with the living and "TOGETHER" they are raptured to the clouds, as shown in Luke 21:36.

Lastly, the problem of one or more Raptures is easily solved when we acknowledge that the end of the age is a HARVEST (Matt.13:39-40). If we study a harvest in nature, and in Leviticus 23, we immediately see that although it is one harvest, and one crop, it has THREE GATHERINGS. They are (i) the firstfruits, those ripe early, (ii) the general harvest after a while of more heat and dryness, and (iii) the Gleanings left for the poor.

Hal Lindsay wrote a book (and I also don't agree with him), but I only get a few paragraphs. So I could have said much more. Would you not say that there is a case for a Pre-Tribulation Resurrection and Rapture (the firstfruits) which must be "ATTAINED TO", a General harvest at the end of the Tribulation (Rev.7:9-17), and some Gleanings (the Two Witnesses of Revelation 11)? Have you noticed that the firstfruits go into the Father's RESIDENCE (Jas.5:7), the general harvest in the Father's BARN (Matt.13:30), and the Gleanings help the poor on earth?

Think on these things.

I did a blog on this, you can find it Here

That is not Biblical!

As you have shown yourself diligent in the matter of the study of the end times, and specifically the Rapture, may I throw some things into the equation for your consideration. You need not answer. I have also cropped your posting to make the 10,000 character-rule.

There are, to my knowledge, 13 mentions of "wrath" in the Book of Revelation Ten say it is "God's wrath", starting with Chapter 6 and ending with Armageddon in Chapter 19. I would say that the whole 3½ years from the Abomination of Desolation to Armageddon is the "wrath of God"

There are three scripture which indicate a pre-Tribulation Rapture. But you will notice that all three are CONDITIONAL.

1. In Philippians 3 the "out-resurrection" (literally, "the resurrection (out) of resurrection") must be "attained to" (v.11), and the subsequent "Upward Call" (lit. Gk.) is a "PRIZE" (v.14). Naturally, Paul's words are almost identical to 1st Thessalonians 4:15-18 which include a Resurrection and a Rapture
2. In Luke 21:36 the context is the the time of (i) the Fig Tree, (ii) the trial that comes on the WHOLE earth, (iii) the coming of the Millennial Kingdom, and (iv) the coming of the Son of man. Since Matthew 24:29-31 shows our Lord Jesus descending from the clouds "AFTER the Tribulation of those days", to "stand before the Son of man" means you must be in the clouds, for the trial is about to begin in Luke 21:36. But again, it is CONDITIONAL. One must be "accounted worthy".
3. In Revelation 3:10, the Church addressed is the only one of two Churches that was commended. It is indicated that the saints already have their crowns (for ruling the Nations - 2:27) as they "Overcame". The promise of Christ here is that "BECAUSE" the Philadelphian saints did something, He will do something - that is, CONDITIONAL. And the Promise is that they would be (i) "kept" FROM - not "IN", and (ii) kept FROM the HOUR of Tribulation. That is, they will not be PRESENT, nor will they be present during the TIME of Tribulation

You could say there as a fourth - 1st Thessalonians 4:15-18. Why? Have you noticed that the Church at Thessaloniki was the only Church that had no moral problems? They were as close to the perfect Church you'll find in scripture (see 1st Thess Chapters 1 & 3). These scriptures, with their CONDITIONS for Rapture, are in sharp contrast to four scriptures which show Christians going through the Great Tribulation. They are Revelation 7:9-17, 12:13-17, 13:7 and 18:4. This adds power to the fact that to miss the Great Tribulation, one must be a ripe firstfruit, worthy of it, attain to it as a "prize". The slothful Christians will be left on earth to endure a "wilderness".

Next, the dilemma of 1st Thessalonians 4:15-18 is because most Christians believe that when a Christian dies, he/she goes to heaven. If this is so, 1st Thessalonians 4:15-17 does not make sense. The "dead in Christ" cannot "RISE", and the living cannot go "together" with the RISEN saints. But if we are strict with wording, we find no scripture indicating going to heaven at death. Much more, if the dead RISE, then they come from below. And according to 1st Corinthians 15:23 ONLY AT HIS COMING! Adding confirmation is the fact that David, who will rule Israel under Christ in the Millennium (Jer.30:9), is found still in Hades in Acts Chapter 2:29-34 - and that, 50 days after Christ's resurrection, and 10 days after His ascension. If the dead in Christ are in Paradise where the thief went WITH Jesus, and this is under the earth (Matt.12:40, Eph.4:8-9), then 1st Thessalonians 4:15-18 makes sense. The dead RISE FIRST, meet with the living and "TOGETHER" they are raptured to the clouds, as shown in Luke 21:36.

Lastly, the problem of one or more Raptures is easily solved when we acknowledge that the end of the age is a HARVEST (Matt.13:39-40). If we study a harvest in nature, and in Leviticus 23, we immediately see that although it is one harvest, and one crop, it has THREE GATHERINGS. They are (i) the firstfruits, those ripe early, (ii) the general harvest after a while of more heat and dryness, and (iii) the Gleanings left for the poor.

Hal Lindsay wrote a book (and I also don't agree with him), but I only get a few paragraphs. So I could have said much more. Would you not say that there is a case for a Pre-Tribulation Resurrection and Rapture (the firstfruits) which must be "ATTAINED TO", a General harvest at the end of the Tribulation (Rev.7:9-17), and some Gleanings (the Two Witnesses of Revelation 11)? Have you noticed that the firstfruits go into the Father's RESIDENCE (Jas.5:7), the general harvest in the Father's BARN (Matt.13:30), and the Gleanings help the poor on earth?

Think on these things.

Now I am nobody, just an old country boy. I have read Hal Lindsay's productions and I for one would not place myself in a position of saying.... " I also don't agree with him".

When you have written as much as he has, backed up all of his positions with Scripture, the I will agree with you.

This sir was a great example you gave. You gave:

Lastly, the problem of one or more Raptures is easily solved when we acknowledge that the end of the age is a HARVEST (Matt.13:39-40). If we study a harvest in nature, and in Leviticus 23, we immediately see that although it is one harvest, and one crop, it has THREE GATHERINGS. They are (i) the firstfruits, those ripe early, (ii) the general harvest after a while of more heat and dryness, and (iii) the Gleanings left for the poor.

This should quickly remind us of the three events that shall take place. First fruits - The Rapture, General harvest - The First Resurrection and The Gleanings - at the end of the Millennium.

I take your point. Who can stand against a prolific writer - especially when he brings good news? And since education is highly esteemed by men, who am I to question a Dallas Theological Seminarian, even if he did predict the turn of the age in the 1980's?

But for the sake of discussion between two "country boys", why not take just one of my points and show it to be wrong - for my points too were backed by scripture. And our esteemed brother Hal Lindsay, did not address one of the points I made. What do you think of that? They all pertain to the Rapture. Or have I missed something?

I am also a graduate of DTS!

My apologies brother but I did not take the time to read your points. What you said about Mr. Lindsey was what caught my attention.

Please, if you do not mind, re-post one of the "points" you made concerning the Rapture and I will be more than blessed to speak to it.

There are three scripture which indicate a pre-Tribulation Rapture. But you will notice that all three are CONDITIONAL.

1. In Philippians 3 the "out-resurrection" (literally, "the resurrection (out) of resurrection") must be "attained to" (v.11), and the subsequent "Upward Call" (lit. Gk.) is a "PRIZE" (v.14). Naturally, Paul's words are almost identical to 1st Thessalonians 4:15-18 which include a Resurrection and a Rapture
2. In Luke 21:36 the context is the the time of (i) the Fig Tree, (ii) the trial that comes on the WHOLE earth, (iii) the coming of the Millennial Kingdom, and (iv) the coming of the Son of man. Since Matthew 24:29-31 shows our Lord Jesus descending from the clouds "AFTER the Tribulation of those days", to "stand before the Son of man" means you must be in the clouds, for the trial is about to begin in Luke 21:36. But again, it is CONDITIONAL. One must be "accounted worthy".
3. In Revelation 3:10, the Church addressed is the only one of two Churches that was commended. It is indicated that the saints already have their crowns (for ruling the Nations - 2:27) as they "Overcame". The promise of Christ here is that "BECAUSE" the Philadelphian saints did something, He will do something - that is, CONDITIONAL. And the Promise is that they would be (i) "kept" FROM - not "IN", and (ii) kept FROM the HOUR of Tribulation. That is, they will not be PRESENT, nor will they be present during the TIME of Tribulation