When did the church begin ?

to my thinking this doesn't contradict Ezekiel 2-3, instead, it makes Ezekiel 2-3 AMAZING

i just love how it reads, the Spirit entered him and set him on his feet!! ♥
how the Spirit enabled him to hear Who spoke to him. how in chapter 2, it's the LORD speaking to him - and in chapter 3 it's the Spirit speaking to him, equivocating His own words with the words of the LORD God.

we've always got to remember John 5:39 when looking in the OT -- all these things in addition to true historical records are testimonies of Jesus Christ

this is another trinitarian proof text, too

Did Cornelius start the church?

Stay on topic - which, I believe, is about when the church began.

Whose body/church was it? The Lord Jesus Christ.

Who started it? The Lord Jesus Christ.

When did it start? When Jesus was baptized - when he began his ministry - which was "all about" the church.

A lot of churches begin service at 11 AM.

You are definitely a funny man... (One of the things I like about you is your 'quip' humor.)

Does this mean that Jesus was baptized at 11:00 A.M.?

The Holy Spirit is not baptising people into the ' body ' until Acts 2 .

Are all aware that in the beginning was the Word and the Word was with God and the Word was God? Jesus-Yeshua is the Word; He is God.

The teaching of all begins with "In the Beginning."

If our teaching begins with this, we are learning from our Savior.

Now that is an interesting statement worth considering...

Is the answer here?
Corinthians 12:13

“For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.”

Says "on" in Acts.11:15. What does it say in Num.27:18?

There is a difference in that from that time onward the whole congregation received the Spirit. This does not mean that those Saints that received the Spirit in OT times were not also indwelt by the Spirit.

The Church began the moment the Holy Spirit entered the Apostles on the Day of Penticost..

What do ya make out of Acts 7:37-38?

They were not sealed UNTO the day of redemption. Evidenced by the Holy Spirit departing from them in numerous places .
1 John 4:13 - Hereby know we that we dwell in him, and he in us, because he hath given us of his Spirit.

The ' in Him ' The Holy Spirit baptising people into the ' body ' . Is a mystery not known before revealed to Paul. So to suggest that all this was happening in the OT is silly.
Colossians 1:27

“To whom God would make known what is the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles; which is Christ in you, the hope of glory:”

Thats not ' the body ' .

When someone asks, When did the church start.. I assume they are asking when did the Christian Church start.. And so i answered as i did..

In the context of John the baptist he was a prophet from God.. He looked forward to the fulfillment of prophecy and was Glad to see the Lamb of God who was to take away the sins of the World.. But He did not live to see the Christian Church founded on earth.. He was executed.. But as a man of faith in God he looked forward to the fulfillment of the promise of the Messiah and so believed and had faith in Jesus..

Yup.. Paul baptized by water immersion in reference to the local body he joined .. The Corinthians baptized by immersion in water in reference to the body at Corinth.

If we believe that a person is indwelt by the Holy Spirit the moment they are saved (indeed, it is the indwelling of the Holy Spirit that "seals" them unto salvation), then this statement is not true.

I am prayerfully considering it...

There is [at least] a partial answer here. I would even say most of it. However, it may be that the full [complete] answer (to the title question of this thread) is not here. I believe part of the answer may be found in the ministry of Christ.

For the same reason that Jesus did not violate the Law by eating corn on the Sabbath (neither did His followers who were with him that did the same - this is important), I believe 'the church' existed even before Pentecost - and that, Jesus Himself started it - beginning on the day of His baptism (as the 'head' of His church) - and continuing after that throughout His ministry.

I definitely believe in what the verse above is saying. The verse (and entire chapter) is included in a discussion regarding 'the church' here:

http://mywebsite.us/ABA/Topics/Local_New_Testament_Church.html

However, in terms of 'identity' - who and what the church is - I believe there is "more to it" than what is contained in the verse above.

I believe the verse above is referring to the indwelling of the Holy Spirit - into which we are all 'immersed' and caused "to drink" of.

The verse above is not referring to water baptism.

That word "church" should really have been translated as "congregation" or "assembly", since it was definitely NOT the church. While I do not subscribe to the ESV, it has translated the word correctly:

English Standard Version
This is the one who was in the congregation in the wilderness with the angel who spoke to him at Mount Sinai, and with our fathers. He received living oracles to give to us.

While God was speaking to Moses on Mount Sinai, the Israelites were worshiping the Golden Calf, and would have all bee wiped out, had it not been for Moses.

In every place in the Bible, the word 'church' literally means 'assembly'. You have to determine from the context what assembly it is referring to.

Another word is 'baptize' (and its various forms). It means 'immerse'. Context determines the nature of the immersion that is being referred to.

My thinking is that the church officially began when Paul returned from spending about 3 years at Mt Sinai.

The mysteries of the church age (the gospel of grace), hidden in the mind of God until it was revealed it to Paul (at Mount Sinai). for dispensation mainly to the gentiles.


(Mt. Sinai - Moses - Law - Nation of Israel)

The Cross

(Mt. Sinai - Paul - Grace - Gentile world)