Not By Works

So is it ok for you to fire away with the questions, but when you get hit with one...then leave it alone.

I seriously, just asked you a question and you became defensive and said I was arguing.

I am not at all directing my comments at you. Not at all. But this reminds me of an account I heard from a Speaker. He was talking about the difference between men and women in their Responses. He said that men do not tend to take remarks personally, that is, being directed at them but more think of them as General comments. He said then that women tend to take many remarks that are not personal at all and get very offended taking them as directed at them personally. A woman stood up in the Group rather upset and said, "I do not!"

I have posted scripture on it..scroll back and you will find it.

If you scroll back you will find another lady who was extremely upset by how people were addressing her....their fruit was appalling.

When a dogma is outside of scripture I think we can be quite certain that there is no adequate truthful answer in scripture I think?

People have their own interpretation of scripture.

One on here didn’t view the fruit of the Spirit the same as me....whereby scripture is very clear..that you will know them by their fruit.

Amen and thanks for answering.

IOWs Jesus is being deceptive when He says if we believe in Him we shall have eternal life. Is that what you’re saying?

Agree

Hi Jackrosie,

Well, it might fall logically that we received faith from God but that it's not what the bible is saying to us, when it pertains to salvation, that's the slight twist from Calvinistic view perhaps it cannot asserted in the Bible. Let's take a look at what may the basis of of such belief. They have taken primarily John 1:12 but what John 1:12 is actually the basis where it says we will able to know what faith is, is it a resultant or the cause and this is to remember "for by grace through faith" that we are saved. So it is by and through grace and faith inseparable (Romans 4:16) is the means, the manner or the way we get saved. John 1:12 as allegedly the proof text of receiving faith falls short of what the Bible says. It does mean it is receiving Christ. Let's take a look at the verse say:

John 1:12 King James Version (KJV)
12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:


If you'll ever noticed the bible says "Received him" is in equivalent to "believe on his name" mainly "him" refers to Christ. That does nothing to do with receiving our faith. Faith comes when we hear the words of God, faith moves towards to those who hear God's word and with the conviction of the Holy Spirit, a person may respond to what he heard and receiving Christ is the right response. Moreover, the word says "even" simply means equal, hence, giving the very definition of what belief means as to receive. Does the bible says here to receive faith? No, plain and simple we need to received Christ and the subtlety slips in when a Calvinist viewed this simple and plain scripture as put it as resultant and not the means or the cause. God bless as you study his words.

Not sure what the disagreement was but here is my thoughts on the judging.
People sometimes fall short....One day someone may not be as joyous as another....so can we say that because that person was not joyful that day that they weren't saved? Same goes with all the fruits...sometimes we fall short. We do not know what others are going through and we don't see their heart. God does and he is the judge.

Believe means more than agreeing you got eternal life.

I think the important matters are not being jolly or such but how one reacts in challenging situations.

.


Over a long period of time...you shall know them by their fruit...I don’t agree with your post...I said nothing about them not being saved so please don’t misquote me.

I quoted scripture...God’s word.

I agree with that.

There is nothing special about them. Study unconditional election. Study 1 Corinthians 1:26-31.

If you study conditional election, that's where "special" comes in.

What does God being a God of justice have to do with election? If He were to exercise justice in saving, none would be saved. This is about God exercising grace and mercy, electing according to his counsel, will, and purpose. Ephesians 1:11 &c.

you forgot the terms term which is applicable to salvation

Love and faith. (God so loved the world - by grace through faith)

Hi again,

Probing without scriptural basis fall short. We received the Holy Spirit when we believe and this is quite contrary to the notion of Calvinism. Jesus said that faith or believing is the way of receiving the Holy Spirit. What actually we received after the holy Spirit is power. The Holy Spirit then empower us.

John 7:39
(But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet given; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.)

Acts 1:8
But ye shall receive power, after that the Holy Ghost is come upon you: and ye shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judaea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth.

No, my post wasn't meant to be exhaustive so I didn't forget anything.

Is that not what the atonement did...Doesn't the scripture teach that he died for any, all, whosoever will?

Limiting atonement and saying any, all men, the world, whosoever etc., does not mean exactly that ...Is this not limiting God and the sacrifice of of his Son?

God is a God of justice in that he would have all men come to repentance and sent his son to die for all, however some do not accept this gift, and so they will face the judgement. Is this not what the scripture teaches?