THE NEED TO BE BAPTIZED BY WATER & THE SPIRIT

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
MyrtleTrees

MyrtleTrees

Junior Member
#1
Sep 5, 2014
804
317
63
#1
Jesus said both are necessary.
John 3:5-7

5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.
KJV
 

Attachments

Blik

Blik

Senior Member
#2
Dec 6, 2016
7,312
2,428
113
#2
It is impossible for our fleshly being to comprehend all this means. We can understand water, but God uses what we know of water to explain the spirit. We use water in many ways, those ways are of the flesh. We have to blindly trust the Lord to use it for the spirit and reach the Holy Spirit within us to explain how it can show us the spirit.
 
KJV1611

KJV1611

Banned
#3
Nov 23, 2013
13,684
1,212
113
#3
MyrtleTrees said:
Jesus said both are necessary.
John 3:5-7

5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.
KJV
Click to expand...
I did not see the word baptize in any of those verses. What do you mean by this?

I see those verses like this. Water birth is the amniotic fluid of the womb and the spiritual birth is the birth of our new man, the Christ in us.
 
wattie

wattie

Senior Member
#4
Feb 24, 2009
3,229
1,126
113
New Zealand
#4
Yeah, in John 3, as KJV1611 posted.. the water is associated with water of the womb.

Reason being is Jesus is asked by Nicodemus 'how can a man enter his mother's womb a second time'..

Jesus doesn't correct him but adds being born of water AND the Spirit.

So the water is of the womb.
 
KJV1611

KJV1611

Banned
#5
Nov 23, 2013
13,684
1,212
113
#5
wattie said:
Yeah, in John 3, as KJV1611 posted.. the water is associated with water of the womb.

Reason being is Jesus is asked by Nicodemus 'how can a man enter his mother's womb a second time'..

Jesus doesn't correct him but adds being born of water AND the Spirit.

So the water is of the womb.
Click to expand...
Wattie the most interesting part of all that is what spirit causes the second birth.

1Pe 1:23 (KJV) Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.
 
Benadam

Benadam

Banned
#6
Aug 14, 2019
1,374
307
83
#6
KJV1611 said:
I did not see the word baptize in any of those verses. What do you mean by this?

I see those verses like this. Water birth is the amniotic fluid of the womb and the spiritual birth is the birth of our new man, the Christ in us.
Click to expand...
If it were the fluids in the womb it makes what Jesus said to Nicodemus redundant. Nicodemus thought He was talking about the womb. Jesus didn't say ' you don't have to return to the womb the ritual immersion in water will symbolize the womb.
Everyone must be born again. If it were birth from the womb why even mention something that no one chooses nor avoid. One must be born to be saved doesn't make sense to me.
 
KJV1611

KJV1611

Banned
#7
Nov 23, 2013
13,684
1,212
113
#7
Benadam said:
If it were the fluids in the womb it makes what Jesus said to Nicodemus redundant. Nicodemus thought He was talking about the womb. Jesus didn't say ' you don't have to return to the womb the ritual immersion in water will symbolize the womb.
Everyone must be born again. If it were birth from the womb why even mention something that no one chooses nor avoid. One must be born to be saved doesn't make sense to me.
Click to expand...
We are born once into this world through water, that is the first birth. Then we are born again, the second birth, this is the birth of the spiritual man.
 
Blik

Blik

Senior Member
#8
Dec 6, 2016
7,312
2,428
113
#8
KJV1611 said:
I did not see the word baptize in any of those verses. What do you mean by this?

I see those verses like this. Water birth is the amniotic fluid of the womb and the spiritual birth is the birth of our new man, the Christ in us.
Click to expand...
You need to spend some time looking up all the references in scripture to water. It has great symbolic meaning and nowhere does it refer to the womb.
 
KJV1611

KJV1611

Banned
#9
Nov 23, 2013
13,684
1,212
113
#9
Blik said:
You need to spend some time looking up all the references in scripture to water. It has great symbolic meaning and nowhere does it refer to the womb.
Click to expand...
Ok show me where I’m wrong with scripture.
 
Benadam

Benadam

Banned
#10
Aug 14, 2019
1,374
307
83
#10
KJV1611 said:
Ok show me where I’m wrong with scripture.
Click to expand...
The water is introduced by John the Baptist by order of the Holy Spirit. His was a Baptism of repentance and this is flesh giving birth to flesh. This prepares the soul to receive the washing in the form of words from the Lord Jesus.
 
KJV1611

KJV1611

Banned
#11
Nov 23, 2013
13,684
1,212
113
#11
Benadam said:
The water is introduced by John the Baptist by order of the Holy Spirit. His was a Baptism of repentance and this is flesh giving birth to flesh. This prepares the soul to receive the washing in the form of words from the Lord Jesus.
Click to expand...
How does getting dunked in filthy river water prepare our souls to receive the washing of the word of God?
 
K

Kim82

Guest
#12
#12
KJV1611 said:
How does getting dunked in filthy river water prepare our souls to receive the washing of the word of God?
Click to expand...
I am not aware that anyone gets baptized in filthy water.:rolleyes:
 
K

Kim82

Guest
#14
#14
That maybe. But there are other places one can get baptized.
 
KJV1611

KJV1611

Banned
#15
Nov 23, 2013
13,684
1,212
113
#15
Kim82 said:
That maybe. But there are other places one can get baptized.
Click to expand...
Ok so let’s say it’s clean water, how does that prepare us to be washed by the word of God?
 
K

Kim82

Guest
#16
#16
KJV1611 said:
Ok so let’s say it’s clean water, how does that prepare us to be washed by the word of God?
Click to expand...
I don't know how it does. I only know we are told in the scripture to get baptized.
 
K

Kim82

Guest
#17
#17
The man was not too pleased when Elijah told him to go dip in the water. He wanted Elijah to come and wave his hand over him. But Elijah did not even come out to meet him.

And Jesus took mud from the ground and put it in a blind person's eyes and they were able to see after that.
 
Blik

Blik

Senior Member
#19
Dec 6, 2016
7,312
2,428
113
#19
Benadam said:
The water is introduced by John the Baptist by order of the Holy Spirit. His was a Baptism of repentance and this is flesh giving birth to flesh. This prepares the soul to receive the washing in the form of words from the Lord Jesus.
Click to expand...
I guess you are using good human logic. We are told in the last days man would be very intelligent with lots of logic. But if you think of scripture and
God as using the entire bible to explain His ways, then you need to check the OT to get the entire picture of how God uses water to explain His ways. Water was used in washing clean, and for God's ways that isn't washing the mud off but washing sin off.

The OT explains the NT, and the NT fulfills the OT.
 
Blik

Blik

Senior Member
#20
Dec 6, 2016
7,312
2,428
113
#20
Kim82 said:
I don't know how it does. I only know we are told in the scripture to get baptized.
Click to expand...
I surely like this post. You aren't questioning God, just trusting God to be right. It is right on!!
 
You must log in or register to reply here.