IT'S 1948! IT'S A MIRACLE!

Well I believe the land is holy because the Almighty put His name there. But the government that's there isn't. I mean it's the current capitol of the LGBTQ parades and celebrations.

It was prophesied that the land would be trampled down by the gentiles until the time of the gentiles be fulfilled.

When Jesus abolished circumcision on the cross, nothing remained to make one a physical Jew or physical member of Israel. Gentiles today who practice Talmudic Judaism are now the gentiles trodding Jerusalem underfoot.

In fact: Gentiles today who practice Rabbinical Judaism are the synagogues of Satan, who say they are Jews but are not; but are liars.
Revelation 2:9. Revelation 3:9.

Well that's just it. I don't believe those cutrently in government in the land are even physical Jews. The government ruling over those people in the land is the mountain of Edom; Esau...the twin...as prophesied to happen in Ezekiel 35.

I believe that land is a mixture of many different people, some physical descendants and some in name only upon conversion to Talmudism. But all are living there under Esau's rule right now, while the remaining 11 tribes are still scattered.

A remnant of natural Israel *must* return and redraft with Messiah-believing gentiles, because of the promises the Almighty made to their forefathers (Romans 11), but that hasn't happened yet.

In the mean time, Esau is ruling now in fulfillment of the blessing given to him by Isaac, which - if you notice - was almost the same exact blessing given to Jacob...almost exact...but Esau would have his rule *with the sword*, after he removed Jacob's yoke from him.

Israel ruled over the Edomites during their height. Edom even served in the temple. But ever since Isaac blessed Jacob, the Edomites believed Jacob's inheritance (the land, the name, etc) was rightfully theirs.

During the time of the Messiah, king Herod who ruled over the Jews was actually Idumean (Edomite). The pharisees were also descendants from the former edomites who served in the temple. They rose to power because they retained the knowledge of the temple service when Judah returned from Babylon. Why? Because they were never carried away. These and other gentiles were allowed to continue caring for the land.

Edom always seeks to reclaim their "stolen" heritage and rule over Israel.

During this current time of the gentiles, scripture says Israel is supposed to be scattered until the Messiah gathers all to him...but we have a government over there claiming to be Israel who's constantly at war, yet scripture also says when Israel returns to the land it's supposed to be at peace and a land of "unwalled villages"...yet they're building walls constantly and warring constantly.

So no, that ain't Israel. Many people there may be Jews but the government surely isn't Israel.

Denying Gods Word, promises, prophecies and love toward Israel is the recipe for disaster. Your own personal, eternal disaster.

The Church has not replaced Israel it is an extension of Israel. The problem is in seeing Israel as only an earthly, nationalistic ethnic entity. Paul was a Jew and at the start of his ministry he entered synogoues wherever he went and preached the Gospel of Christ to Jews. They rejected the Gospel and are still doing so. He abandoned them and preached only to the Gentiles. You can read about it in Acts. He said that a true Jew is someone who believes in Christ as lord and Messiah not necassarily someone who has a Jewish Mother
as defined by Jewish tradition. People quote Paul when he said all Israel will be saved. They never seem to consider who Paul thought was actually part of Israel.

God is not a man.

The word Israel denotes born again salvation. It cannot be more than one born again experience?

A person would have to define the word Israel seeing it is God who named her and changed her name to Christian a more befitting name for the bride of all nations . One bride, one gospel. No corrupted flesh and blood .

Jacob .. . . the deceiver. One who grasps the heel of another twin he grasped Esau's the first born . Flesh and blood against flesh and blood. No peace of faith. Those who consume themselves devouring each other "who is the greatest" ..

Israel . . . Prince of peace. . . those who experience wrestling against flesh and blood, the things seen and Israel the bride can overcome because the Spirit of Christ in their bodies of death empowering to overcome the things of the flesh.

And Jacob was left alone; and there wrestled a man with him until the breaking of the day. And when he saw that he prevailed not against him, he touched the hollow of his thigh; and the hollow of Jacob's thigh was out of joint, as he wrestled with him. And he said, Let me go, for the day breaketh. And he said, I will not let thee go, except thou bless me. And he said unto him, What is thy name? And he said, Jacob. And he said, Thy name shall be called no more Jacob, but Israel: for as a prince hast thou power with God and with men, and hast prevailed.Geneis 32: 24: 28

Did his flesh change or is flesh not subjectable to change seeing it is dead? Something is missing . . in the description of that name. Perhaps the unseen eternal Spirit that binds all good things together. ?

Christian. . . residents of a eternal city prepared as the bride named by the Lord after her founder Christ.

Sounds like a befitting name to me?

There was a popular book at the time that talks about a huge debate in the "Jewish" community. Some believed Israel should become a nation at that time. Others said they should weight until the return of the Messiah and then Israel would become a nation. Today they still go by the prophecy. in Zechariah 14:4 "On that day his feet will stand on the Mount of Olives, east of Jerusalem, and the Mount of Olives will be split in two from east to west, forming a great valley, with half of the mountain moving north and half moving south." Today with what we know about plate tectonics we know that this is exactly what is going to happen. Not only east and west but the ground fault lines run north and south also.

You lost me. Your point of rebuttal is what exactly?

Words have meaning applied to them If we desire to find the interpretation of God .then we cannot add new meaning to a single word. it could change and diminish the authors intent or add to it . In that way it would seem the Holy Spirit has Given two laws similar to protect the integrity of his word. One in Deuteronomy 4 and the other at the end prophecy making the book of law perfect. Not to add or subtract from the whole. It is all as one word coming from one God one work of His faith.

O Israel = born again believers.

Deuteronomy 4 King James Version (KJV) Now therefore hearken, O Israel, unto the statutes and unto the judgments, which I teach you, for to do them, that ye may live, and go in and possess the land which the Lord God of your fathers giveth you. Ye shall not add unto the word which I command you, neither shall ye diminish ought from it, that ye may keep the commandments of the Lord your God which I command you.

Both working together as the 7 seals of his authority.

For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book: And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book. He which testifieth these things saith, Surely I come quickly. Amen. Even so, come, Lord Jesus. The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you all. Amen.Revealtion 22:18-21

If we would make O Israel a fleshly shade on a paint chart . Then I think we could somehow compare it to the word Israel .

There was a LOT more going on when God stepped in and began bringing the prophecies of scripture show in our world. One of them was the dead sea scrolls were found that had been hidden for 2,000 years. As they were pieced together and read it bridged the gap of understanding of what the OT scripture meant to express. We had lost track of how the men who wrote what God spoke to them understood. It resulted in the roots movement.

I have attended a Messianic Synagogue. They are believers in scripture. Scripture tells us that kosher diet and circumcision is no longer to be used to guide us to obeying the Lord, the Holy Spirit is to be used.

There is a difference in the Messianic Synagogue and the other churches. Churches preach that Christ changed things, they teach that God is eternal with the same principles, Christ is God and fulfilled and put in the finishing touches to God's plan for our salvation. Churches dwell on the changes, they dwell on the eternal qualities of God. The churches are acting like the Catholics did with Luther's time.

Hi Dave, hope you don't mind if I jump in. I don't practice Talmudic Judaism, but I am a Levite. I don't practice Christianity either, as Iv'e never been to Church. That said, I love our Heavenly Father and our Lord Jesus with all my heart and soul. Good to hear from you.

Judaism and Christianity.

Jesus abolished all you claim to be. Not one shred of NT scripture backs your claim.

Dave, perhaps you misunderstood, I don't claim to be anyone or anything except a servant of our Lord Jesus Christ. I'm also assuming you were not at my Levite Bar Mitzvah in 1959.

“Who has heard such a thing? Who has seen such things? Can a land be born in one day? Can a nation be brought forth all at once? As soon as Zion travailed, she also brought forth her sons.” (Isaiah 66:8)

Butterfly, I may not have fully gotten the context/background of your response, I found the notion of giving us troubling because it seems to evoke a sense of tribal or spiritual superiority which I suppose is not the case . While I understand that God chose the Israelites( Jews) in the OT to be the vehicle of blessings to the rest of the world, it was not a tribal favour against the rest as in giving us the Bible and Saviour. Christ came as a response to satisfy the righteous demands of God the Father by paying the penalty of death that consequent upon adam and Eve disobeying God. We are commanded to love everybody as you rightly said bearing in mind that it is only through the shed blood of Christ that any, even the unbelieving Jews can be saved. Find below an attachment of someone who dealt briefly on that subject.
https://www.journals.uchicago.edu/doi/pdfplus/10.1086/470676

Cool...thanks... God bless😊

They exist because God is preserving them for future redemption according to prophecy for the glory of His Name and their good. Bottom line God keeps his promises.