Not By Works

Everyone who uses this verse to support the heresy of "thou shalt not SURELY die" forgets a very important component of 2 Corinthians 5 - the part Paul mentions about being "naked" and "unclothed" - a state of which the dead are without a body...and at what time is that? Dead and in the grave and awaiting our heavenly body which is given when Jesus descends with "the trumpet of God". This same Paul knew full well this when he wrote to the Corinthians "at the last trump, for the trumpet shall sound and the dead shall be raised incorruptable, and we shall be changed...for this corruptable (fleshly body) must put on incorruption (spiritual body)..."

People take Paul's desire to skip the part about waiting "unclothed" and "naked' in the grave and instead go straight to be in the presence of Jesus as a discounting of what he already knew full well...by his OWN testimony, he plainly teaches that he did not expect to put on eternal life until the trumpet sounds.

I thought you were explaining things to yourself.

Guess you missed that part about "...in Christ's power..." huh?

I finally figured it out...You OSAS folks think salvation grants divine status...that we become Omnipresent, right?

OSAS essentially says I can simultaneously walk further and further away from God while remaining safe and secure in the palm of His hand.

OSAS doesn't know the least thing about living faith. It teaches that we may by dead faith obtain that which can only be obtained by living faith: eternal life. OSAS wants to show us faith without works, but Righteousness by Faith agrees with James..it's demonstrated by works.

You seem too have missed "First set fire to their synagogues..." at the very least.

God only keeps those who allow Him to keep them. He's a Shepherd, not a Cattle Driver.

Is that in "On The Jews And Their Lies"? If so, which page? It's not there.

Small wonder a works to earn, and or maintain Salvation guy, doesn't see THIS as hateful writings against Jewish people:

On the Jews and Their Lies[edit]
Main article: On the Jews and Their Lies
In 1543 Luther published On the Jews and Their Lies in which he says that the Jews are a "base, whoring people, that is, no people of God, and their boast of lineage, circumcision, and law must be accounted as filth."[14] They are full of the "devil's feces ... which they wallow in like swine."[15] The synagogue was a "defiled bride, yes, an incorrigible whore and an evil slut ..."[16] He argues that their synagogues and schools be set on fire, their prayer books destroyed, rabbis forbidden to preach, homes razed, and property and money confiscated. They should be shown no mercy or kindness,[17] afforded no legal protection,[18] and these "poisonous envenomed worms" should be drafted into forced labor or expelled for all time.[19] He also seems to advocate their murder, writing "[w]e are at fault in not slaying them".[20] Luther claims that Jewish history was "assailed by much heresy", and that Christ swept away the Jewish heresy and goes on to do so, "as it still does daily before our eyes." He stigmatizes Jewish Prayer as being "blasphemous" and a lie, and vilifies Jews in general as being spiritually "blind" and "surely possessed by all devils." Luther has a special spiritual problem with Jewish circumcision.[21][self-published source?][22] The full context in which Martin Luther advocated that Jews be slain in On the Jews and Their Lies is as follows in Luther's own words:

I find this song encouraging. Particularly the part referring to a parable Jesus told of the lost sheep in Luke 15.

Page? I'm not sure the treatise has standardized pages, but it's in there. And it's just one of a long list of similar vitriol. How did you read it?

Sorry dude, I've spent years on other forums trying to discuss the bible with 7th Day Ads. No point while you have the Ellen White specs glued to ya face.

You'd be better on an SDA forum patting yaselves on the back while attempting to keep the sabbath.

Not the dreaded SS argggh

DON'T YOU KNOW, THE SEVEN FEASTS OF ISRAEL ARE PICTURE PROPHESIES OF JESUS CHRIST, AND CHRIST WILL HAVE FULFILLED EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THE THEM.

You can not be a Sheppard without having sheep

And the day my will override God's will I won't need Him

I never said the thread is satanic, I said in a moment of weakness we can all be instruments of death. There are only two choices in life; one you are adding to the Kingdom of God and the other is death / Satan. No grey area. If I read some of the replies on this thread I can’t always see Jesus… Jesus did not run away after he rebuked Peter. If you want me to run away you can get somebody to ban me.

My friend, from getting to know you over the years I know your heart is in the right place… but also that you wear it on your sleeve .

I don’t believe in numerous gospels. Show me one post where I said your works can safe you (unless you are perfect)? I will put it on record that once you have Christ your works will change for the better, but without Christ even our good works are filthy rags. We have one gospel, I just read both Testaments and look for treasures in the Old as well as the New. We have people that think to read Leviticus is a waste of time. I don’t. I try to see what God is teaching us and incorporate it in my life. If that is wrong then I am wrong, but from what I have learned the last couple of years I know I am not wrong and therefor won’t be deterred by outburst like this.

Like I said, we are either building God’s Kingdom by the way we act or we are trying to destroy it. I know I was guilty of being wrong before in saying things I shouldn’t. This was not one of the times. Maybe we have the perfect few on this website, I know I am not one of them and therefor I need grace.

I have said it before and will say it again and again and again; grace is not a New Testament concept. It was there from the first second God created the heaven and earth.

Biblical salvation? The word teaches us that everything is about Christ. Even the Old Testament. If we can’t find Him there we are reading it wrong. He is in everything. Even the brazen altar in the tabernacle. Every detail in the Old Testament is shouting Jesus, Jesus, Jesus.

God bless friends.

The law of Christ is not your adversary and form part of the true gospel. If you don't see it, you are reading it wrong.

God bless

Amen! In the parable of the unforgiving, unmerciful servant in this hypothetical situation, forgiveness of the enormous debt by the master who was moved with compassion was given despite the condition of the wicked servant's heart, but that is not how it works with our Master, Jesus Christ. The Lord isn't going to forgive unmerciful, unforgiving, wicked hearts no matter how much we beg and plead, then take back the gift and He also doesn’t order that our wife and children be sold in order to pay off the debt either. (vs. 25) We could fall to our knees all we want asking the Lord to be patient with us and we will pay back our enormous sin debt (vs. 26) but it's too huge to pay back, so that isn't going to work either.

Forgiveness of the huge debt was taken back by the master in the parable, who did not infallibly know that his servant had a wicked heart until it was later exposed, yet he was willing to show mercy and forgiveness just as our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ is willing to show mercy and forgiveness and the huge debt of the wicked servant was forgiven of his huge debt until his unforgiving nature was discovered. His master in this parable was a man who did not infallibly know his wicked servant's heart (unlike the Lord, Jesus Christ who infallibly knows our hearts) and did not realize that his servant was wicked until his heart was exposed by refusing to forgive his fellow servant in such a small matter. (vvs. 32-34) The moral of the parable is forgiveness and the condition of our heart and not salvation by grace through begging and pleading or type 2 works salvation.