Has the second coming occurred already?

Second coming happen after great tribulation, Jesus come oN the air and rapture happen

Than follow by 1000 years kingdom.

Okay lets say you're right, since you come at this as if it's such a silly notion, that without one single question or any kind of accurate representation of a well presented case for any of these things on your "list of offhand dismissal" to be seen. Lets say you've convinced me with your very well thought out and loving rebuttal saying that anyone that holds these views is unintelligent, dishonest, and without any integrity. Nice way to represent our King by the way and I personally appreciate the direct attack on my character brother. So please all wise elder let me understand the "right" belief from you. Is this Abomination of Desolation spoken of in Daniel, Matthew, and Luke going to take place in the future?

The A of D is referenced by Jesus ONLY in Matt and Mark (on the MofO and to P, A, J and J)...........and is unequivocally a future event. In Luke....the speech is probably made in the Temple to disciples, ("Jesus, looking up") and only speaks to the destruction of the city and Temple)......no A of D....and is foretelling 70AD. The key phrases are "BEFORE THESE THINGS" vs "AFTER THESE THINGS".

I posted an excellent video a few posts back. Do yourself a big favor and hear it. Pls get a grip people.

You say that, but I believe differently and do not understand how you make these distinctions. Like I said the difference between Luke and Matthew being different intended audiences is clear and I see no reason at all to think they happen in different times other than assertion, and please don't take anything I'm saying as sarcasm, maybe if you can show me where these distinctions are made outside of a presupposed belief and charts, but where in His word does it makes these distinctions and time references? If you show me then I do want to hear them out and consider. First what makes you say they are different events when what they where talking about was the same thing, and second where do you see when these things are to happen?
I see what you're saying about "Before & After" these things, but that does not nail down the kinds of things you're saying here about these being different events nor the timing of anything. In my opinion of course. I'm also not just trying to throw a bunch of questions at you just as if that ends the discussion either, I know that's often the M.O. here, but I do honestly want to know why you believe these things are so, and not only that I will also answer and defend the position I'm taking as well, I mean everything I'm saying with respect and sincerity so please don't think I'm trying to attack you or be ugly in any way.

I just saw the remark about the video and did not see it. Is it posted in this thread?

Hello Jackson123,

I rearranged your post to the correct chronological order:

Jesus come on the air and rapture happen. Second coming happen after great tribulation.

* Jesus appears in the air and gathers His church

* Tribulation period

* Second Coming (Jesus returns to the earth to end the age and establish His millennial kingdom)

Here is the Chuck Missler link Sir. Please pass it along. This preterism heresy must cease and desist once and for all.

Okay lets say you're right, since you come at this as if it's such a silly notion, that without one single question or any kind of accurate representation of a well presented case for any of these things on your "list of offhand dismissal" to be seen. Lets say you've convinced me with your very well thought out and loving rebuttal saying that anyone that holds these views is unintelligent, dishonest, and without any integrity. Nice way to represent our King by the way and I personally appreciate the direct attack on my character brother. So please all wise elder let me understand the "right" belief from you. Is this Abomination of Desolation spoken of in Daniel, Matthew, and Luke going to take place in the future?

@Dc
By the way I love you use the "heavens rolled up like a scroll" example as having not have taken place when it was the same language used in Isaiah 34 to describe the coming judgement on Babylon-
3Their slain will be left unburied, and the stench of their corpses will rise; the mountains will flow with their blood. 4All the stars of heaven will be dissolved. The skies will be rolled up like a scroll, and all their stars will fall like withered leaves on the vine, and foliage on the fig tree. 5When My sword has drunk its fill in the heavens, then it will come down upon Edom, upon the people I have devoted to destruction.

So I guess that didn't happen yet either right? Or maybe you don't understand Apocalyptic Literature as well as you maybe could. Just saying.

Is this guy a joke or what? Desolation 1 and desolation 2 lol, the guy is a whack job.

For those with an attention span of more than 45 seconds, one must opine that Chuck Missler has indeed mastered the correct exegesis of end-time prophecy. For all of us to behold. Those who have ears to hear.....let him hear!

The guy is twisting scripture to fit his view.

Hello brother

I think we do not have agreement in These verse

2 Thessalonians 2 King James Version (KJV)

2 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,

2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.

3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

There are 2 thing mention by Paul in verse 2

He warn about second coming and our gathering oN the SIT

So the subject is both rapture and second coming

Verse 3 say that day

That day mean both mention in verse 2 Paul not change the subject yet.

If Paul mean only second coming in verse 3 he Will explained it

1). "Now concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our being gathered together to Him"

2). "alleging that the Day of the Lord has already come"

First, the second coming is when the Lord returns to the earth to end the age and establish His millennial kingdom. In opposition, the coming of our Lord and our being gathered to Him is referring to the resurrection of the dead in Christ and the living being changed and caught up with them to meet the Lord in the air. When Jesus appears to gather the church, He will not be returning to the earth, but will meet us in the air and take us back to the Father's house according to His promise in John 14:1-3.

The "Day of the Lord" mentioned in verse two, is referring to the time of God's wrath which takes place after the church has been gathered. Here is a better translation of that scripture:

"Now concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our being gathered together to Him, we ask you, brothers, 2not to be easily disconcerted or alarmed by any spirit or message or letter seeming to be from us, alleging that the Day of the Lord has already come."

The coming of our Lord and our being gathered to Him, is a blessed event, the removal of the church prior to the beginning of God's wrath. In opposition, the Day of the Lord will not be a bless event, but represents the time of God's wrath.

Our being gathered to the Lord takes place first and is then followed by the Day of the Lord. Many do not recognize the change Paul makes regarding these two events. Though these events are closely link together, they are not the same.

The Thessalonians knew Paul's teachings, that the Lord would descend and with the trumpet of God the dead in Christ would rise first. And immediately following that, the living would be changed and caught up together with them. This is what Paul is speaking about in verse 1. The Thessalonians knew that after the gathering of the church had taken place that "The Day of the Lord" would immediately follow.

Since there were some there in Thessalonica teaching that "the Day of the Lord" had already come, the Thessalonians were concerned because they knew that if that were true, then they would have missed being gathered to the Lord and were now concerned about now being trapped in the Day of the Lord, the time of God's wrath. In other words they were saying, "Hey Paul, there are some here saying that the Day of the Lord has already come, so why are weren't we caught up to the Lord first according to your teachings? Then Paul comforts them by saying "not to be easily disconcerted or alarmed by any spirit or message or letter seeming to be from us, alleging that the Day of the Lord (the time of God's wrath) has already come." Paul didn't say, "not to be easily disconcerted or alarmed by any spirit or message or letter seeming to be from us, alleging that our being gathered to the Lord has already come." Do you see the difference? Paul starts off in Verse 1 with "the coming of our and our being gathered to Him" and then changes to "the Day of the Lord" calling it "that day." Then Paul says "Let no one deceive you in any way, for that day (Day of the Lord) will not come until the rebellion occurs and the man of lawlessness—the son of destruction—is revealed.

In order to understand what Paul is saying, t is important to discern the difference between the coming of Lord and our being gather vs. The Day of the Lord. It is also important to understand what "the Day of the Lord" is, which I've listed below:

===========================================================================
The great Day of the LORD is near—near and coming quickly.

Listen, the Day of the LORD!

Then the cry of the mighty will be bitter.

That day will be a day of wrath, a day of trouble and distress,

a day of destruction and desolation, a day of darkness and gloom,

a day of clouds and blackness, a day of horn blast and battle cry against the fortified cities, and against the high corner towers.

I will bring such distress on mankind that they will walk like the blind, because they have sinned against the LORD.

Their blood will be poured out like dust and their flesh like dung.

Neither their silver nor their gold will be able to deliver them on the Day of the LORD’s wrath.

The whole earth will be consumed by the fire of His jealousy.”

For indeed, He will make a sudden end of all who dwell on the earth.
==================================================================================

The event of the coming of our Lord and our being gathered to Him is a different event and takes place prior to the Day of the Lord.

Our being gathered to the Lord is a blessing which takes place first. While the Day of the Lord will be the time of God's wrath, which follows our gathering.

I am not agree with this analysis.

3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

The topic is the coming of the Lord and our gathering oN the air

Verse 3 say that day

So that day mean the coming of the Lord and rapture.

Let compare with matt 24

29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

You say appear the sign of the son in heaven or Jesus come oN the air before tribulation

Matt 24 say It is immediately after tribulation.

Matt.24:29-30 is referring to the second coming where Jesus returns to the earth to end the age. Where 2 Thess.2:1 is referring to the church being caught up to be taken back to the Father's house.

To me It is the same.

Some sects of Christianity believe that Christ’s second coming had already occurred. This is in conjunction with the Olivet Discourse and specifically with chapter 24 from Matthew’s Gospel(Christ returned around 70 AD prior to the destruction of Jerusalem). Is there validation to any of this? Is there any historical evidence to support such? Has the revelation of Christs second coming being a future event based on tradition and misinterpretation? Is Preterism correct?

Thoughts?

This post also reeks of ignorance and the fact that GOD blends future prophetic utterances with the CURRENT events listed in the day they took place.....YOU know what......you are one of the biggest hypocrites on this site.....YOU constantly portray yourself as this super duper believer and then MAKE worse mouthy comments that what other do in their initial posts....at least everyone KNOWS I get a little mouthy once in a while.......you on the other hand in pretence fire away while flatly ignoring the fact that you are as bad or worse in the way you come across.....

Listen carefully migo......JESUS and the 2nd coming did not take place 1st century AD......it is one of the most idiotic fallacies presented on this site.....and if you can honestly read the the word of GOD, especially Matthew 24, Luke 21, Mark 13, 1st Thessalonians 4 and 5, 1st Corinthians 15, 2nd Thessalonians 2, 2nd Peter 3 and Revelation and then conclude it happened in the 1st century AD you are not being honest with the word of GOD........and your mouthy remarks above belie that you have presented the same attitude that you are accusing me of hypocrite.......good day PAL......!!

Here is the Chuck Missler link Sir. Please pass it along. This preterism heresy must cease and desist once and for all.

Isn't this the sort of thing that Paul was warning the church in Thessaloniki about? At the beginning of 2 Thessalonians 2.
It seems as if these kinds of rumours were going around even in the lifetime of the apostles.

I would also bear in mind how Jesus warned us of many false messiahs and false teachings.
He said the Gospel would be preached in all nations, before the end. They still had a long way to go in 70AD

He warned
23 Then if anyone says to you, ‘Look, here is the Christ!’ or ‘There he is!’ do not believe it. 24 For false christs and false prophets will arise and perform great signs and wonders, so as to lead astray, if possible, even the elect. 25 See, I have told you beforehand. 26 So, if they say to you, ‘Look, he is in the wilderness,’ do not go out. If they say, ‘Look, he is in the inner rooms,’ do not believe it. 27 For as the lightning comes from the east and shines as far as the west, so will be the coming of the Son of Man.
(Math 24 ESV)

When he comes there won't be any doubt. The whole world will witness it.

I think Preterists have that absurd notion that we are currently in the millennial reign.
1000 years of peace despite 2 world wars, The Armenian genocide, Bubonic plague, Islamic terrorism, Pol Pot, Idi Amin etc etc.