Broken families, broken kids

Lanolin said:

I didnt I just referred to some. If the mother cant be with child maybe on drugs or something then its generally the dad leaves.

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Perhaps you don't mean to, but you are still displaying gender bias when it comes to the reasons for parents being single. To get past this, you will need to start replacing "dad" and "mom" with "parent" when you're calling out specific behaviours. Neither gender holds exclusive claim to any cause for marital breakdown.

Lanolin said:

Split parents arent SOLO there are many parents that claim they are single when actually they are married and living apart and the children go back and forth between them.

A Solo parent is quite different from single or shall we say split parenting.

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This is a rare situation. Much more common is the divorced couple who share custody. If you prefer not to classify these as "single parents", then so be it, but I don't think you will get much agreement. The term "single parent" normally refers to a parent with primary (but not necessarily sole) custody.

Lanolin said:

James dobson isnt any help in this area for solo mothers who bring up boys. He just ranted and said they need to have father figures, which is why, solo mothers then try and have boyfriends, but stepfathers can be hit and miss with children who arent their own.

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Unfortunately, the single mom who just wants a boyfriend is probably at least as common as the single mom who is genuinely seeking a suitable stepdad.

Dino,
Thanks for your thoughts in this thread. They have been helpful.

Lanolin said:

I just call them split parents.

Anyway are you going to be any help to these children or just spiltting hairs? I dont actually find your comments helpful sorry.

This isnt an argument. This is REALITY and something people deal with every day at school.

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I don't write these comments to "split hairs". I write them to address real bias that is poisoning our legal systems and making it difficult if not legally impossible for dads to participate in raising their own children. You come along and complain about children whose fathers are absent from their lives. If you don't acknowledge a key issue at the root of the problem, you can't fix it.

How can you help these children? Speak well of both their parents, regardless of the custody situation. Uphold the value of having both parents involved in their lives, even if they live apart. Curate the library content so that it restricts material that elevates mothers, especially single mothers, above fathers. Every time someone comes along and wants to celebrate single mothers, speak up for fathers. Resist the leftist narrative that attempts to remove fathers or make them irrelevant.

Dino246 said:

Perhaps you don't mean to, but you are still displaying gender bias when it comes to the reasons for parents being single. To get past this, you will need to start replacing "dad" and "mom" with "parent" when you're calling out specific behaviours. Neither gender holds exclusive claim to any cause for marital breakdown.


This is a rare situation. Much more common is the divorced couple who share custody. If you prefer not to classify these as "single parents", then so be it, but I don't think you will get much agreement. The term "single parent" normally refers to a parent with primary (but not necessarily sole) custody.

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I totally agree with you Dino. 6 years ago I fell ill and after 16 years at the company for which I worked let me go. ( insurance reasons ). I could no longer afford the home in Denver where my daughter and I lived for 9 years. We moved to a smaller town 120 miles away with no complaints from her mother. After 1 year her mother filed a court order claiming that I took my daughter without her permission ( My daughter's mother never attempted to visit in this time. ). In an attempt to punish me, or force me to move back to Denver, The J.A. Judge left our original custody the same, which was that I had my daughter every Wednesday thru Friday and every other weekend. My daughter was attending school in Denver. I was on the phone with my daughter constantly being that she was 10 years old and was left alone nights when her mother did'nt come home. after driving 400 miles on the weekends for 2 years ( and 20,000 miles later ), My daughter was of age and was old enough to decide where she wanted to live which was home with me. I know from personal experience that the courts are entirely biased toward mom's. My daughter's mother has not been in contact with her since. I really appreciate you for pointing this out. This really strikes a nerve with me when society always assumes that when there is a break-up, The father is always to blame. This is simply not true! By the way, my daughter is a freshman in high school, participates in sports, theatre, and has a 3.7 G.P.A. in advanced studies. If I had to do it all again I would. My daughter is gift from God! Sorry for the rambling but I am glad that I got this out. Been stirring in me for a long while...

1christian1 said:

I totally agree with you Dino. 6 years ago I fell ill and after 16 years at the company for which I worked let me go. ( insurance reasons ). I could no longer afford the home in Denver where my daughter and I lived for 9 years. We moved to a smaller town 120 miles away with no complaints from her mother. After 1 year her mother filed a court order claiming that I took my daughter without her permission ( My daughter's mother never attempted to visit in this time. ). In an attempt to punish me, or force me to move back to Denver, The J.A. Judge left our original custody the same, which was that I had my daughter every Wednesday thru Friday and every other weekend. My daughter was attending school in Denver. I was on the phone with my daughter constantly being that she was 10 years old and was left alone nights when her mother did'nt come home. after driving 400 miles on the weekends for 2 years ( and 20,000 miles later ), My daughter was of age and was old enough to decide where she wanted to live which was home with me. I know from personal experience that the courts are entirely biased toward mom's. My daughter's mother has not been in contact with her since. I really appreciate you for pointing this out. This really strikes a nerve with me when society always assumes that when there is a break-up, The father is always to blame. This is simply not true! By the way, my daughter is a freshman in high school, participates in sports, theatre, and has a 3.7 G.P.A. in advanced studies. If I had to do it all again I would. My daughter is gift from God! Sorry for the rambling but I am glad that I got this out. Been stirring in me for a long while...

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Thanks for sharing!

Lanolin said:

Hands up if you look after broken kids...how do you effectively reach out to them?

It might be their dads in jail or they dont even know their dad. They may have dozens of half siblings they may not even know about. They seem rebellious and always talking back. Maybe they are just hungry. They take up more of your time than the well behaved children and are disruptive, attention seeking or just plain rude.

How do you handle them? What can we pray for them? Or do we just separate them from other children?

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I like this OP because sometimes I am at a loss for what to do in this situation. Specifically, I serve with 3rd graders from lower income, troubled families in a Wednesday night church program. There have been times after a child has behaved unacceptably that I did not know what to do. I hope others will contribute ideas from their experience!
I know that children require lovingkindness and discipline both; but at times it is challenging to know exactly which approach to take. What recourse does their action warrant?
I have witnessed other adults respond in a harmful way, and that causes a hesitancy in me. Of course, I know that the adult must not allow the child(ren) to run over them... I just get to thinking about how these young ones probably receive little genuine love in their homes. I want to be different. I want to be their safe place.
But, too, I think when children know the bounds of appropriate behavior (as clarified by the adult), then that can give a sort of reassurance. It can be a positive factor when the child knows what is expected of them and the adult relays their belief in the child.

I'm hoping to learn more as I go. I give lots of smiles and pats on the back/arm. Sometimes I take a child aside and discuss their behavior with them. Sometimes I firmly address them, making solid eye contact.
One response I need to implement more is moving a disruptive child to a new seat. Another response I may need to consider more is removing privileges when behavior is unacceptable.

Something I have learned that has perplexed me is that sometimes a child will intentionally act badly for the purpose of getting attention- even negative attention. Bearing this in mind, sometimes the best course of action might be to ignore them depending on the extent of their actions/words.

Lanolin said:

I think with some children you need to allow them to take a break.
give them a few minutes to go off somwhere to calm down, think about what they are doing and then come back when they are settled.

It doesnt do any good to be angry with children. If youve got a whole class, you just wait till they are quiet. even if it takes a few minutes, dont say anything, just wait. close your eyes even. say you are going to your happy place. They will soon learn you cant be ruffled.

I found some strategies in the a book I found in the library and later it was withdrawn so Im keeping it. Its called 101 Principles for Positive Guidance with Young Children. Creating responsive teachers. by Katharine C Kersey and Marie L masterson.

another thing is routines are good with children, they know that one thing follows another. when youve done this, we will go on to this. Give them some idea of how long it may take. Generally children arent aware of time but if you make it a challenge see if you can do this in five minutes your time starts now..children will respond as they want to beat the clock.

Children from broken homes are usually lost because they have no idea whats happening. Adults may not even tell them or keep secrets from them. You need to give cues and signals so they know what to do, they dont have to guess. Within this also be a bit spontaneous and flexible so its not too boring, have fun acitivites that engage them.

thats as much as I can tell you!

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Awesome! Good points. Thanks, Lanolin.

Safety comes first so sometimes physical separation is necessary, either apart in another seat or a buddy room. If a child is upset, acknowledge their feelings, like "You seem/sound angry," listen to them, and then try to problem-solve. Reason with them when possible. Knowing reasons behind the rules will make them more meaningful and it's especially helpful if they help create the rules before you start off than if they all come top down. Use specific feedback (not just a general "good job") but "I like that you have your hands in your lap and are facing forward. That shows me you are ready." Praise the positive like "I noticed you threw away a wrapper someone else dropped. Thank you, that was so helpful!"

My favorite technique is to use two positive choices. That way you show clear expectations but they have some control. Like "You can sit by X or Y" and if they say something else just re-emphasize "that's not a choice right now. Wait for them to choose and if they don't, make the choice for them. Next time they will probably make the choice themselves. Hopefully. It can be challenging, but I think all we can do is to keep learning and doing our best.

Good thread Lanolin. Also, I think pointing out potential bias is good in order to overcome it as for many it's not intentional. You are a caring librarian in a challenging environment and are expressing concern for the wellbeing of the children. Nobody wants to make things worse for children that especially need our love and positive attention. You wanted to know what you could do to be more effective when the conversion seemed to focus on something that seemed either irrelevant to your original post or minor. However, we can correct one another with gentleness. It's nice to add new information, considerations, or experiences. They are more aware and sensitive to those issues just like we individually become more aware of issues based on our own experiences. This provides good motivation too, such as an ex-con being aware of the challenges after prison and deciding to volunteer in a prison ministry. Cancer survivors may later help fundraise. People involved with organizations like Easter Seals or Autism Speaks often have friends or family members with autism or other disabilities.

We all bring different things to the table and talking to parents can give teachers and librarians new insights. There were good points made and yes, single fathers should not be forgotten. A biological mother is also not always a mom. Some do abandon their children, though even that doesn't mean they were uncaring or unloving. They could be homeless, a teen, an addict, etc. Here's a link to a video about how an abandoned boy was adopted by a loving family. He had emotional challenges to overcome, but wow the new family is amazing and he has made a lot of progress.

Lanolin said:

its important to share your experiences.

I dont know about the judges bias but seems to me the judge wants children to not have to be constantly go back and forth since they cannot drive if its too far, and to stay in the same school if possible.

Of the split parents I know of, they tend to stay in the same area, or one half goes back to live with their parents or rents close by, but maybe a cheaper apartment or flat or something.

Some parents cannot visit because they dont drive or have a car, I dont know why that is but some people just dont drive, they rely on public transport. I do know there are orders that some split parents arent allowed to take a child out of the country, without at least telling or commicating that with the other parent. If someone did do that, the court might see it as kidnapping, since they literally dont know where you are.

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You did Read the part where I said about my daughter and I had been living in this town a year before we went before him ... And the part where I got her permission. Anyhow, I think this is what Dino was talking about when he said that instead of looking at statistics and real life, People tend look at the hypothetical.

EliBeth said:

I like this OP because sometimes I am at a loss for what to do in this situation. Specifically, I serve with 3rd graders from lower income, troubled families in a Wednesday night church program. There have been times after a child has behaved unacceptably that I did not know what to do. I hope others will contribute ideas from their experience!
I know that children require lovingkindness and discipline both; but at times it is challenging to know exactly which approach to take. What recourse does their action warrant?
I have witnessed other adults respond in a harmful way, and that causes a hesitancy in me. Of course, I know that the adult must not allow the child(ren) to run over them... I just get to thinking about how these young ones probably receive little genuine love in their homes. I want to be different. I want to be their safe place.
But, too, I think when children know the bounds of appropriate behavior (as clarified by the adult), then that can give a sort of reassurance. It can be a positive factor when the child knows what is expected of them and the adult relays their belief in the child.

I'm hoping to learn more as I go. I give lots of smiles and pats on the back/arm. Sometimes I take a child aside and discuss their behavior with them. Sometimes I firmly address them, making solid eye contact.
One response I need to implement more is moving a disruptive child to a new seat. Another response I may need to consider more is removing privileges when behavior is unacceptable.

Something I have learned that has perplexed me is that sometimes a child will intentionally act badly for the purpose of getting attention- even negative attention. Bearing this in mind, sometimes the best course of action might be to ignore them depending on the extent of their actions/words.

Click to expand...

You know the difference between right and wrong. And after all, you are the adult... This is the approach I've taken with minors and it has worked thus far. Even with my children...