Once saved always saved? Or is salvation conditional on believing and following God's Word?

Amen!

Moses Paul and James make it clear. Break one command, no matter how small that sin might be,,or how or why it happened. And you are under the curse of the law. No excuses.

Thanks Dan,

You guys cannot see a good work done in the Holy Spirit is an eternal gift of Christ to another
individual. We are literally just the vessel of Gods good works of grace and love to the world.

You do not see we are perfected, pure, holy Gods Kingdom on earth to the praise of His glory.
Everything God is doing in us, is wonderful and brings glory to His name.

No wonder you devalue His work in your hearts and His experience of the Holy Spirit working
in power and authority to bring about His purposes. You think this is self justification before
the throne, rather than His love being expressed to His people and to the world.

Praise God He give light to His people and His ways.
Thank you Jesus, Amen

10 God is not unjust; he will not forget your work and the love you have shown him as you have helped his people and continue to help them.
11 We want each of you to show this same diligence to the very end, in order to make your hope sure.
12 We do not want you to become lazy, but to imitate those who through faith and patience inherit what has been promised.
Heb 6

10 And we pray this in order that you may live a life worthy of the Lord and may please him in every way: bearing fruit in every good work, growing in the knowledge of God,
11 being strengthened with all power according to his glorious might so that you may have great endurance and patience, and joyfully
12 giving thanks to the Father, who has qualified you to share in the inheritance of the saints in the kingdom of light.
Col 1

No one here devalues the Works of God in His children.

They fight against the lie that our walk defines wether or not we are His.

We are saved by grace through faith, born again, given a new heart which desires to conform to His will.

How effective you are does not keep or maintain salvation.

None who are His end up facing the just punishment we all deserve. We will be seen as perfect through the imputed righteousness of Jesus Himself.

It is interesting seeing believers standing round claiming Gods work in His people is a stinking mess
unacceptable to God. This is no different than the accuser of the brethren.

10 God is not unjust; he will not forget your work and the love you have shown him as you have helped his people and continue to help them.
11 We want each of you to show this same diligence to the very end, in order to make your hope sure.
12 We do not want you to become lazy, but to imitate those who through faith and patience inherit what has been promised.
Heb 6

10 And we pray this in order that you may live a life worthy of the Lord and may please him in every way: bearing fruit in every good work, growing in the knowledge of God,
11 being strengthened with all power according to his glorious might so that you may have great endurance and patience, and joyfully
12 giving thanks to the Father, who has qualified you to share in the inheritance of the saints in the kingdom of light.
Col 1

There are so many excuses people have in their minds to justify their sin, not repent, to rebel
against Gods word and condemn believers as self righteous hypocrites.

Tools of the enemy sums it all up 100%

All the evangelistic efforts to show how Christ changes us, to share His resurrection power, to
through good works demonstrate what a loving caring child of God can do, rather than an evil doer
who is eaten up with sin and self indulgence.

These guys would tear it down, discourage, deny, trample on, defame, lie about, call evil and satanic
the very work of God and His message through His people. My word is God help those who come in
His name, claiming to stand on His word and gospel and condemn the very people who are the product
of the Holy Spirit.

I won't lie, often what you write has merit to me. I like your desire to remain patient and loving. I so often think we are on the same page...BUT then i get the feeling it gets a little slippery.

I'm not attacking, just that no one, is saying works/fruits are not a major component made possible through faith in Him.

I think the difference is who do we trust to walk out our faith, Him or ourselves? I like that you appear to listen and gain perspectives. I can relate to that. I want to ask you something, though?

Do you believe in eternal security? Yes or no?

Do you believe it is He that does the saving and keeping?

In your response to me earlier, you said you did.

He is faithful or not?

I was raised by a Pentecostal preacher evangelist. I came to Lord when I was nine. I went way left and so did He, my dad, for long while. I was never settled, always tormented in my sin. He wooed me into the wilderness and not so gently, pulled my head out of my hiney bo. I know we can turn away, so does He.

BUT... He was faithful to stay with me as I grieved the spirit over and over, to the point of quenching. He never gave up on me and the foolishness of the ditch I kept running into. I hurt myself and was reckless, even as a mother of 2 beautiful girls, I put me and my sins before them.

One beautiful and powerful day, I felt such sorrow, like I have never felt before...it took me straight to sobbing, it literally took me to my knees. Finally, I begged Him for forgiveness and pleaded for Him to take the wheel.

I will always deeply regret my sins rooted in selfishness, rather than selflessness. I hurt my dearest loves.

I now take refuge now in Luke 7:36-50.

How can anyone truly rest in Him, if we are on slippery ground? He knows who He is dealing with, and He deals with His sheep accordingly.

So what if He had come and I was in the midst of running away instead of toward? I believe that deep sorrow, that came from deep within shows me that He was with me, every step of my broken way. He saved me all the way.

I agree that loving as we are called is obedience. I believe without Him in our hearts, it is impossible.

I am so grateful because of Him, I want to be pure, but know I never will be outside of Him. I am in Him...I am not Him. On my best most selfless days, on my own, there is NO hope. If my understanding is wrong, I pray He helps me.

I believe Home is in Him alone.

He gets ALL the Glory, every last drop of it!!!

God Bless you and yours.

They fight against the lie that our walk defines wether or not we are His.

11 Anyone who does what is good is from God. Anyone who does what is evil has not seen God.
3 John 1

8 He who does what is sinful is of the devil, because the devil has been sinning from the beginning. The reason the Son of God appeared was to destroy the devil's work.
9 No one who is born of God will continue to sin, because God's seed remains in him; he cannot go on sinning, because he has been born of God.
10 This is how we know who the children of God are and who the children of the devil are: Anyone who does not do what is right is not a child of God; nor is anyone who does not love his brother.
1 John 3

Hi OneOfHis,

John disagrees with you, so does Paul, so does Peter, so does Jesus.
At which point do you accept a clean heart produces clean works.

I know your problem and desire, but it is about focus and listening to God.
Someone said to me God does not speak to me.
They had a bible, yet those words needed to be spoken out loud spiritually to qualify.

Once you begin to see it is not God who has the problem is it is we are not prepared
to hear and act.
Are you prepared to listen to God or just make up your own faith,

God bless you

Beautiful testimony sister...
God never left you , He wooed you back to Him and steered you on the straight and narrow , it was His desire that called you to repentance , I love the way you cling to our LORD , even if sometimes we are hanging onto His hem , we are His , and He is ours...
God bless you sister...xox...

I have said before to someone I know that I feel like I do need a good shepherd. God being described as the Good Shepherd is one of my favorite pictures of him. I don't know about with someone staying lost. I tend to think about where would you draw the line and how lost is too lost? How can one measure that?

What I like about God as the Good Shepherd is that picture in Isaiah 40:11 of being carried close to his heart( NIV version) and also that picture of him seeking after the lost sheep and bringing them back and guiding the sheep on the right path.

I like those words. How lost is to lost.

I think of the law. And the requirmemnt of that law (perfection, if we stumble in even one part we are guilty of all)

So if we did not live up to Gods requirment before, and needed to be saved, and we can not live up to Gods standard after we are saved (if we say we have no sin we deceive ourselves and there is no truth in us) This, and John says a child of God can not live in sin, meaning we will never be as sinful as we were before salvation,

Then how can we ever be so lost we lose?

Amen, in the parable of the prodigal son... luke 15

The son had left... done horrible things... hit rock bottom... was PERCIEVED as dead (though still alive)

but he knew... his father was his only hope... because he was his son and knew his father

you know what happened...

he tried to walk back and didn't make it....

though percieved as dead

his father saw him afar off... was watching

and ran to him...


many see this story as an example of how to waste your inheritance or be cut off....

i believe God had a much different message....


Jesus gave this when being accused of sitting and eating with sinners RIGHT after explaining how the good shepard goes to find his lost sheep


that son reap what he sowed.... but still was his fathers son... and alive the whole time

Salvation can not be lost because when you are saved, you are already saved, you are saved from something (Eternal death). Eternal life can not be lost because it is eternal.
The lie comes when we deceive ourselves that we are already saved with an irrevocable salvation once we believe.

Abiding in Christ is more important and it is your personal effort and choice; if you don't abide in Christ by keeping His command, you are gone never to come back.


Rom 13:11And do this, understanding the present time: The hour has already come for you to wake up from your slumber, because our salvation is nearer now than when we first believed.

1 John is one of those books I have trouble understanding completely with some of what it says.

Whoops... I before E unless after C😬

Thank you Charli, I am truly touched by your openness.

Yes I have eternal security, and I believe we live each day in His hands.
We are His workmanship and He is faithful to us as we walk in Him and His ways.

Repentance and sin are two things there is no compromise over though.
I think we both know brokenness and resting in Christ through the cross.

You mentioned it gets a little slippery.

The difficulty is in exploring things of faith, is getting ones head in the right space and
the way we use language. Working faith, passive faith. Immortal spirit, born again, a new creation.
Spiritual death, physical death. Often when discussing such ideas, perspectives change, insights
occur, we grow and move forward.

I know how I express things and mean them, but is it useful to another.
I know I have this experience of faith, but in someone else situation, are the words the same.

This is why I love cc, to explore and challenge these perspectives, and in Christ see things we
can do to minister to others. I praise God how much He has blessed me.

God bless you dear Sister.

Arby's has the meats!

funny you should say that because I actually want to try a Reuben and they are looking good at Arby's

it is the Holy Spirit that convicts

the Holy Spirit convicts the world of sin

5Now, however, I am going to Him who sent Me; yet none of you asks Me, ‘Where are You going?’ 6Instead, your hearts are filled with sorrow because I have told you these things. 7But I tell you the truth, it is for your benefit that I am going away. Unless I go away, the Advocate will not come to you; but if I go, I will send Him to you. John 16

8And when He comes, He will convict the world in regard to sin and righteousness and judgment: 9in regard to sin, because they do not believe in Me; 10in regard to righteousness, because I am going to the Father and you will no longer see Me; 11and in regard to judgment, because the prince of this world has been condemned.

sinners are convicted, repent and turn to God

the Bible does not convict. only the Holy Spirit makes the words alive

you can find direction concerning the operation of the Holy Spirit and the word, in the New Testament

this is a gross example of taking a passage out of scriptural context and creating a false narrative

first of all Ezekiel, a mjor OT prophet, is NOT addressing salvation in Christ which is actually the basis for this op

people were operating under OT law which did not fulfill the righteousness in Christ that believers have today.

do we make sin offerings or has one sin offering been made on our behalf for all time?

this is an elementary understanding of the testaments

the fact you conflate the 2 and come up with death for sin is perhaps revealing of what you actually labor under

now look at sin and sinning of the believer under the New Covenant

My little children, I am writing these things to you so that you will not sin. But if anyone does sin, we have an advocate before the Father—Jesus Christ, the Righteous One. I John 2:1

written by someone who had exclusive access to Jesus

I pity the person who slaves away under law and has to get resaved every time they sin

you have actually misappropriated the law and attempt to put people back under fear

the right fear of God is good, but you propose something that God had set up on a temporary basis

you want to bring the law back. go ahead, but remember, that might very well be what you are judged by because your righteousness is not acceptable

I have the distinct impression you have take the opportunity to strike at people in the 'Not by Works' thread that you argue there with on a regular basis

I don't post in that thread but I sometimes take a look at it

pretty cheap thing to do IMO

apart from that, you are putting words in people's mouths

no I don't have you confused with someone else this time

I'm not going to address these jabs you have made, they are obvious and don't help you out one bit

sounds an awful lot like you are doing the condeming here

you know, I am well aware of all the warnings about believers in the NT loosing salvation

but rather than speak or write about that in a constructive manner, you bash people

I don't post in that thread because it seems to engender genuine dislike of others and I can do that already without feeding it

I don't want to be that person, but I have not lost my ability to read between the lines and like I said, this is not helping you