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Joh 20:21 Then said Jesus to them again, Peace be unto you: as my Father hath sent me, even so send I you.
Joh 20:22 And when he had said this, he breathed on them, and saith unto them, Receive ye the Holy Ghost.
Jesus told the disciples to receive the Holy Ghost, which He was not in a glorified body, but in the flesh, and was before He ascended to heaven from the Mount of Olives.
Joh 7:38 He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water.
Joh 7:39 (But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet given; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.)
When Jesus appeared to the disciples at this time was He glorified yet, for if He was not then the disciples did not receive the Spirit the same as at the day of Pentecost.
Joh 20:17 Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God.
This is after the resurrection of Jesus but He had not ascended to heaven yet, and He appeared to the disciples in flesh, which Jesus probably could not be touched until He put the blood on the mercy seat in heaven.
Joh 20:27 Then saith he to Thomas, Reach hither thy finger, and behold my hands; and reach hither thy hand, and thrust it into my side: and be not faithless, but believing.
Joh 20:28 And Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God.
Here Thomas touched Jesus so He must of ascended to heaven first, and then came back and showed Himself in flesh.
So was Jesus glorified when He went to heaven, and came back at this time, for it appears like He was not seeing He showed Himself in flesh, and it would seem like if Jesus was glorified He would have His glorified body, and would never appear in flesh again, but will always remain in a glorified body, and no need to be back in the flesh.
Act 1:2 Until the day in which he was taken up, after that he through the Holy Ghost had given commandments unto the apostles whom he had chosen:
Act 1:3 To whom also he shewed himself alive after his passion by many infallible proofs, being seen of them forty days, and speaking of the things pertaining to the kingdom of God:
Act 1:4 And, being assembled together with them, commanded them that they should not depart from Jerusalem, but wait for the promise of the Father, which, saith he, ye have heard of me.
Act 1:5 For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence.
When Jesus came back from heaven He appeared to the disciples in the flesh, and stayed with them for 40 days.
Which He said they would be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence, so if they had to be baptized with the Holy Ghost then when Jesus breathed on them earlier it was not all He had for them concerning the Spirit.
Act 1:6 When they therefore were come together, they asked of him, saying, Lord, wilt thou at this time restore again the kingdom to Israel?
Act 1:7 And he said unto them, It is not for you to know the times or the seasons, which the Father hath put in his own power.
Act 1:8 But ye shall receive power, after that the Holy Ghost is come upon you: and ye shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judaea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth.
Act 1:9 And when he had spoken these things, while they beheld, he was taken up; and a cloud received him out of their sight.
Jesus was in the flesh at this point in time, and told the disciples that they shall receive power after the Holy Ghost is come upon them, so when Jesus breathed on them earlier, and said receive the Holy Ghost it must of not been given that would save them, and regenerate them, for they would not receive power until after Jesus ascended to heaven from the Mount of Olives, and was glorified, at the day of Pentecost, and not beforehand.
So it must of been when Jesus ascended to heaven from the Mount of Olives that He was glorified, which the Bible says the Holy Ghost would not be given until He was glorified, so it could not be given until the day of Pentecost.
Which Jesus was glorified when He ascended to heaven in Act 1, for once Jesus is glorified He will never be in the flesh again at any time, for that glorified body is a part of Him forever, but He appeared to the disciples in flesh.
So when Jesus told them to receive the Spirit earlier when He was in the flesh, and not glorified yet, then it must of been to help them, or give them strength while Jesus was in heaven away from them, but they did not receive the Spirit at that time to regenerate them to be in a saved condition until Pentecost, for the Spirit was not given until after Jesus was glorified when He ascended from the Mount of Olives.
Luk 1:15 For he shall be great in the sight of the Lord, and shall drink neither wine nor strong drink; and he shall be filled with the Holy Ghost, even from his mother's womb.
Mat 11:10 For this is he, of whom it is written, Behold, I send my messenger before thy face, which shall prepare thy way before thee.
Mat 11:11 Verily I say unto you, Among them that are born of women there hath not risen a greater than John the Baptist: notwithstanding he that is least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than he.
John the Baptist was filled with the Spirit from his mother's womb, which is why Jesus said born of women there has not been a greater than John the Baptist, but a person that is least in the kingdom of God is greater than him.
Luk 17:20 And when he was demanded of the Pharisees, when the kingdom of God should come, he answered them and said, The kingdom of God cometh not with observation:
Luk 17:21 Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you.
Jesus said that the least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than John the Baptist, and that is because John the Baptist was not saved the whole time he was on earth, because John the Baptist did not receive the Spirit from the womb to save him, but to only give him power to live right, and prepare the way for Jesus.
But John the Baptist was not saved until after Jesus was glorified, and then he received the Spirit to save him.
So it must also be the case with the disciples that when Jesus breathed on them it was not to save them at that time, for the Spirit was not given until Jesus was glorified, but it must of been to give them power like John the Baptist, but they were not saved yet, and then when the day of Pentecost was come then they had the Spirit that saved them at that point, and gave them power by the Spirit to live right, and do miracles, and wonders.
Joh 20:22 And when he had said this, he breathed on them, and saith unto them, Receive ye the Holy Ghost.
Jesus told the disciples to receive the Holy Ghost, which He was not in a glorified body, but in the flesh, and was before He ascended to heaven from the Mount of Olives.
Joh 7:38 He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water.
Joh 7:39 (But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet given; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.)
When Jesus appeared to the disciples at this time was He glorified yet, for if He was not then the disciples did not receive the Spirit the same as at the day of Pentecost.
Joh 20:17 Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God.
This is after the resurrection of Jesus but He had not ascended to heaven yet, and He appeared to the disciples in flesh, which Jesus probably could not be touched until He put the blood on the mercy seat in heaven.
Joh 20:27 Then saith he to Thomas, Reach hither thy finger, and behold my hands; and reach hither thy hand, and thrust it into my side: and be not faithless, but believing.
Joh 20:28 And Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God.
Here Thomas touched Jesus so He must of ascended to heaven first, and then came back and showed Himself in flesh.
So was Jesus glorified when He went to heaven, and came back at this time, for it appears like He was not seeing He showed Himself in flesh, and it would seem like if Jesus was glorified He would have His glorified body, and would never appear in flesh again, but will always remain in a glorified body, and no need to be back in the flesh.
Act 1:2 Until the day in which he was taken up, after that he through the Holy Ghost had given commandments unto the apostles whom he had chosen:
Act 1:3 To whom also he shewed himself alive after his passion by many infallible proofs, being seen of them forty days, and speaking of the things pertaining to the kingdom of God:
Act 1:4 And, being assembled together with them, commanded them that they should not depart from Jerusalem, but wait for the promise of the Father, which, saith he, ye have heard of me.
Act 1:5 For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence.
When Jesus came back from heaven He appeared to the disciples in the flesh, and stayed with them for 40 days.
Which He said they would be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence, so if they had to be baptized with the Holy Ghost then when Jesus breathed on them earlier it was not all He had for them concerning the Spirit.
Act 1:6 When they therefore were come together, they asked of him, saying, Lord, wilt thou at this time restore again the kingdom to Israel?
Act 1:7 And he said unto them, It is not for you to know the times or the seasons, which the Father hath put in his own power.
Act 1:8 But ye shall receive power, after that the Holy Ghost is come upon you: and ye shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judaea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth.
Act 1:9 And when he had spoken these things, while they beheld, he was taken up; and a cloud received him out of their sight.
Jesus was in the flesh at this point in time, and told the disciples that they shall receive power after the Holy Ghost is come upon them, so when Jesus breathed on them earlier, and said receive the Holy Ghost it must of not been given that would save them, and regenerate them, for they would not receive power until after Jesus ascended to heaven from the Mount of Olives, and was glorified, at the day of Pentecost, and not beforehand.
So it must of been when Jesus ascended to heaven from the Mount of Olives that He was glorified, which the Bible says the Holy Ghost would not be given until He was glorified, so it could not be given until the day of Pentecost.
Which Jesus was glorified when He ascended to heaven in Act 1, for once Jesus is glorified He will never be in the flesh again at any time, for that glorified body is a part of Him forever, but He appeared to the disciples in flesh.
So when Jesus told them to receive the Spirit earlier when He was in the flesh, and not glorified yet, then it must of been to help them, or give them strength while Jesus was in heaven away from them, but they did not receive the Spirit at that time to regenerate them to be in a saved condition until Pentecost, for the Spirit was not given until after Jesus was glorified when He ascended from the Mount of Olives.
Luk 1:15 For he shall be great in the sight of the Lord, and shall drink neither wine nor strong drink; and he shall be filled with the Holy Ghost, even from his mother's womb.
Mat 11:10 For this is he, of whom it is written, Behold, I send my messenger before thy face, which shall prepare thy way before thee.
Mat 11:11 Verily I say unto you, Among them that are born of women there hath not risen a greater than John the Baptist: notwithstanding he that is least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than he.
John the Baptist was filled with the Spirit from his mother's womb, which is why Jesus said born of women there has not been a greater than John the Baptist, but a person that is least in the kingdom of God is greater than him.
Luk 17:20 And when he was demanded of the Pharisees, when the kingdom of God should come, he answered them and said, The kingdom of God cometh not with observation:
Luk 17:21 Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you.
Jesus said that the least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than John the Baptist, and that is because John the Baptist was not saved the whole time he was on earth, because John the Baptist did not receive the Spirit from the womb to save him, but to only give him power to live right, and prepare the way for Jesus.
But John the Baptist was not saved until after Jesus was glorified, and then he received the Spirit to save him.
So it must also be the case with the disciples that when Jesus breathed on them it was not to save them at that time, for the Spirit was not given until Jesus was glorified, but it must of been to give them power like John the Baptist, but they were not saved yet, and then when the day of Pentecost was come then they had the Spirit that saved them at that point, and gave them power by the Spirit to live right, and do miracles, and wonders.
Here is what I asked you:
How did you come up with the idea that being baptized in the Holy Spirit is the same as being "full of the Spirit"? It seems that is what you say in your statement. Also you say "there is receiving the Spirit, and then there is being baptized . . ." - Do you mean that receiving the Spirit and being baptized with the Spirit are two different things? If so, where does the text say this?
You replied:
How I came to that conclusion was that I read the 20th chapter of John the first through I think eight chapter of Acts and the 1st Corinthians 12 13 and 14 over and over and over trying to make sense of it.
So I assume you do not have a text that says that being baptized with the Spirit is the same as the filling of the Spirit? And I also assume that you do not have a text that says that the baptizing of the Spirit comes after the receiving of the Spirit?
Please let me know if I am wrong? I am just trying to figure out how you came to your conclusions? But you said it was reading it over and over and trying to make sense of it . . . That is OK, and you may do doctrine and interpretation that way - I am just wondering if the text says that anywhere?
How did you come up with the idea that being baptized in the Holy Spirit is the same as being "full of the Spirit"? It seems that is what you say in your statement. Also you say "there is receiving the Spirit, and then there is being baptized . . ." - Do you mean that receiving the Spirit and being baptized with the Spirit are two different things? If so, where does the text say this?
You replied:
How I came to that conclusion was that I read the 20th chapter of John the first through I think eight chapter of Acts and the 1st Corinthians 12 13 and 14 over and over and over trying to make sense of it.
So I assume you do not have a text that says that being baptized with the Spirit is the same as the filling of the Spirit? And I also assume that you do not have a text that says that the baptizing of the Spirit comes after the receiving of the Spirit?
Please let me know if I am wrong? I am just trying to figure out how you came to your conclusions? But you said it was reading it over and over and trying to make sense of it . . . That is OK, and you may do doctrine and interpretation that way - I am just wondering if the text says that anywhere?
L
I read things in context and in relationship to the other texts.
In John 20 Jesus breathed on them and said receive the Holy Spirit.
Acts 1:5 Jesus tells them not many days from now you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit
Acts 1:9 Jesus ascends
Acts 2:2-4 not many days later
Tongues of fire
And they are filled with the Holy Spirit.
In John 20 Jesus breathed on them and said receive the Holy Spirit.
Acts 1:5 Jesus tells them not many days from now you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit
Acts 1:9 Jesus ascends
Acts 2:2-4 not many days later
Tongues of fire
And they are filled with the Holy Spirit.
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S
Something I learned shortly after I began reading post on this forum---
Regardless of the subject, there will be 10 different beliefs presented, each backed by specially chosen Scripture that supports their belief, every one is correct in their mind, and everyone who disagrees has no understanding of Scripture.
Regardless of the subject, there will be 10 different beliefs presented, each backed by specially chosen Scripture that supports their belief, every one is correct in their mind, and everyone who disagrees has no understanding of Scripture.
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Nothing wrong with your observations above . . .
The disciples received the Spirit in John 20, and then were baptized with the Spirit and were filled with the Spirit at Pentecost. Yes and amen! Exactly correct!
But nothing in the text even remotely hints that we today we receive the Spirit, and then at a later point are baptized with the Spirit. Nor does the text anywhere say that being filled with the Spirit and being baptized with the Spirit are the same thing. My opinion . . .
The disciples received the Spirit in John 20, and then were baptized with the Spirit and were filled with the Spirit at Pentecost. Yes and amen! Exactly correct!
But nothing in the text even remotely hints that we today we receive the Spirit, and then at a later point are baptized with the Spirit. Nor does the text anywhere say that being filled with the Spirit and being baptized with the Spirit are the same thing. My opinion . . .
L
Nothing wrong with your observations above . . .
The disciples received the Spirit in John 20, and then were baptized with the Spirit and were filled with the Spirit at Pentecost. Yes and amen! Exactly correct!
But nothing in the text even remotely hints that we today we receive the Spirit, and then at a later point are baptized with the Spirit. Nor does the text anywhere say that being filled with the Spirit and being baptized with the Spirit are the same thing. My opinion . . .
The disciples received the Spirit in John 20, and then were baptized with the Spirit and were filled with the Spirit at Pentecost. Yes and amen! Exactly correct!
But nothing in the text even remotely hints that we today we receive the Spirit, and then at a later point are baptized with the Spirit. Nor does the text anywhere say that being filled with the Spirit and being baptized with the Spirit are the same thing. My opinion . . .