Faith/Works...How much faith? How much works?

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J

John146

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#781
Jan 13, 2016
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Macabeus said:
That verse comes right after 1 Cor. 6:9-10. So you think Paul is saying that only their new nature is free from fornication, idolatry, adultery, homosexuality, sodomy, theft, coveting, drunkenness, reviling and extortion, but in actual practice they still do these things?

Because you said he was speaking of their new nature, not actual practice. That would kind of hint that they were still doing the things in 1 Cor. 6:9-10, but Paul said that those who do such things will NOT inherit the Kingdom of God.
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The Church of Corinth had many problems they were dealing with and because so, they were immature, not growing up in their faith.

Inheritance is not the same as entrance. One can be saved and enter the kingdom of God but yet lose out on inheritance because of selfish living.
 
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Macabeus

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#782
John146 said:
The Church of Corinth had many problems they were dealing with and because so, they were immature, not growing up in their faith.

Inheritance is not the same as entrance. One can be saved and enter the kingdom of God but yet lose out on inheritance because of selfish living.
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How do you enter the kingdom of God without inheriting it?
 
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John146

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#783
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#783
Macabeus said:
How do you enter the kingdom of God without inheriting it?
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Can someone receive eternal salvation and lose their inheritance on earthly living when judged at the JSOC? 1 Corinthians 3, 2 Corinthians 5
 
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John146

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#784
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#784
Macabeus said:
How do you enter the kingdom of God without inheriting it?
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Ephesians 5:5 For this ye know, that no whoremonger, nor unclean person, nor covetous man, who is an idolater, hath any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God.
 
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seed_time_harvest

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#785
Dec 9, 2011
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Macabeus said:
Thanks for being civil in your post. This is the issue I have with your argument

a. You believe in a dual nature of flesh and Spirit, which I agree with

b. You believe that the New Nature is sinless, cannot sin. Ok, don't have a problem with that.

c. You believe the believer can sin IN THE FLESH all he wants. This I take issue with.

Show me scripture that says a believer can sin all they want.

SO where are the OSAS people who were saying "Noone here teaches 'POINT C"?
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John 3:16
King James Version

16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
+++
Ephesians 4:28-30
King James Version


28 Let him that stole steal no more: but rather let him labour, working with [his] hands the thing which is good, that he may have to give to him that needeth.

29 Let no corrupt communication proceed out of your mouth, but that which is good to the use of edifying, that it may minister grace unto the hearers.

30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

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Dec 12, 2013
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#786
John146 said:
Ephesians 5:5 For this ye know, that no whoremonger, nor unclean person, nor covetous man, who is an idolater, hath any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God.
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Notice...he does not say they are not in the kingdom.....Just like the one that teaches and does not do..he is called the least in the KINGDOM.....NOTE>>>>DOES NOT DO but TEACHES IT.....
 
M

Macabeus

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dcontroversal said:
Notice...he does not say they are not in the kingdom.....Just like the one that teaches and does not do..he is called the least in the KINGDOM.....NOTE>>>>DOES NOT DO but TEACHES IT.....
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So fornicaters, idolaters, etc enter the Kingdom, but do not inherit all things. (see Revelation 21) Ok, if that's what you believe, so be it.
 
theanointedwinner

theanointedwinner

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#788
Nov 6, 2018
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#788
crossnote said:
I know, the Forum is glutted with these Faith/Works threads.

But I'm interested in those that say 'by faith'...how much faith?

And those that say 'by works'...how much works?
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To oversimplify, faith advocate will say, "all faith"

Work advocate will say, "all works"

Not as simplified will be far more complex than that
 
crossnote

crossnote

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#789
Nov 24, 2012
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#789
theanointedwinner said:
To oversimplify, faith advocate will say, "all faith"

Work advocate will say, "all works"

Not as simplified will be far more complex than that
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How about Christ Jesus (all Giver) is the Author of our faith (all receiving) which produces good works (all effects)?

Or to put it shorthand...

Christ>>>faith>>>fruit.
 
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Macabeus

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#791
crossnote said:
How about Christ Jesus (all Giver) is the Author of our faith (all receiving) which produces good works (all effects)?

Or to put it shorthand...

Christ>>>faith>>>fruit.
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Works for me.
 
J

John146

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Jan 13, 2016
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#792
Macabeus said:
So fornicaters, idolaters, etc enter the Kingdom, but do not inherit all things. (see Revelation 21) Ok, if that's what you believe, so be it.
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Have you sinned since being saved? Then you’ve broken the whole law. Believers should not do these things, I agree. And so much that we are to have nothing to do with brethren who commit these sins and do not seek help or forgiveness. Have nothing to do with them.
 
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Macabeus

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#793
John146 said:
Have you sinned since being saved? Then you’ve broken the whole law.
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This is somewhat of a red herring. Everyone has sinned since they were saved. But that is not the same as being in the categories of 1 Corinthians 6:9-11

Believers should not do these things, I agree. And so much that we are to have nothing to do with brethren who commit these sins and do not seek help or forgiveness. Have nothing to do with them.
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Yes, because they who do such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.
 
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Macabeus

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dcontroversal said:
Notice...he does not say they are not in the kingdom.....Just like the one that teaches and does not do..he is called the least in the KINGDOM.....NOTE>>>>DOES NOT DO but TEACHES IT.....
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There is no such thing as a person who enters the Kingdom but does not inherit. Scriptural proof

Revelation 21:7- He that overcomes shall INHERIT all things, and I will be his God and he will be my son.

1 John 5:5Who is he that overcometh the world, but he that believeth that Jesus is the Son of God?

a-All believers overcome the world through faith
b. All overcomers inherit all things by the Grace of God
c. Therefore, all believers INHERIT all things.
 
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John146

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#795
Jan 13, 2016
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#795
Macabeus said:
This is somewhat of a red herring. Everyone has sinned since they were saved. But that is not the same as being in the categories of 1 Corinthians 6:9-11



Yes, because they who do such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.
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If one is saved and commits adultery, do they lose their salvation?
 
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Hevosmies358

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#796
Macabeus said:
This is somewhat of a red herring. Everyone has sinned since they were saved. But that is not the same as being in the categories of 1 Corinthians 6:9-11



Yes, because they who do such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.
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Yup. Never got that reasoning. Not inherit means you aint in! This is clear in other languages, maybe english is different. Not inherit = you're not showing up.
"The greek" is also clear.

Now whether you want to make that descriptive or prescriptive, thats upto you.
 
J

John146

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Hevosmies358 said:
Yup. Never got that reasoning. Not inherit means you aint in! This is clear in other languages, maybe english is different. Not inherit = you're not showing up.
"The greek" is also clear.

Now whether you want to make that descriptive or prescriptive, thats upto you.
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I guess you would agree that if a believer commits adultery, they lose their "eternal" salvation.
 
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Hevosmies358

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#798
John146 said:
I guess you would agree that if a believer commits adultery, they lose their "eternal" salvation.
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I believe you lose your salvation by setting up questions like that. Obviously David didn't lose his salvation, so we got that thing going, but David also repented. (as do all born again believers)

Just joking... But seriously: You are just contending for adultery at this point here. Not a good look. How would you feel if people made (and they do) similar questions about your view? That you can live as you please now that you've got your ticket punched in? You wouldn't like it and would say its a strawman.
 
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John146

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Jan 13, 2016
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#799
Hevosmies358 said:
That you can live as you please now that you've got your ticket punched in?
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Do true born again Christians think like this? This is the flawed argument against OSAS. Believers don't have this thought. Believers sin, all the time, even commit adultery, get drunk, covet, theft, etc.., but eternal life is eternal life. It is up to the Lord to keep that what I have entrusted to him, not me. I don't want to sin, but I do.
 
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Macabeus

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#800
John146 said:
If one is saved and commits adultery, do they lose their salvation?
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if they repent, no.

If they say "it's cool, I can commit adultery and repent later, because grace has me covered", they are turning the grace of God into license to sin

if you approach ANY sin like that, you are turning grace into a license to sin
 
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