Not By Works

Hey guys. Lost and lose implies 'by accident.' I think 'discard' it; (Salvation. that is.) Might be more appropriate.

You're right.
We discard it...
and so we lose it.

Jesus said to hold on to it, Paul also, and all the other writers.

Some believe it's not possible to discard our love for God once we know its beauty.

But then why would the N.T. speak to this?
Just look at 2 Peter 2:20-22

Why would Paul give us so many warning?
All those IF's, CONTINUE's, FALLING AWAY's, HOLDING ON's.

Jesus said we are the salt of the earth...BUT if the salt BECOMES TASTELESS,
it is good for nothing but to be THROWN OUT and trampled on by men.
Mathew 5:13

It would be interesting to have an explanation of this by the OSAS believers.

P.S. I use the expression lost because Jesus did.
Luke 16:24

Actually he calls them yet carnal and babes in Christ....regardless......the bible does not peddle us embracing and coddling a person or group just because they name JESUS.....most religions peddle false gospels where one must HELP JESUS do that which he said he will do.........I am under no obligation to enter into fellowship with one that devalues Christ, his work and or his promises while trampling his blood and faith under their feet.....

My catholoc

Shaking the dust of off our feet of people we don't discern as members of the body of Christ without slandering them as liars may be acceptable even if the board is in our own eye, as its the slander that disrupts our Love relationship with the Lord. They may be the ones with the speck that they cant pull out themselves and we should have no trouble seeing the board and getting it out ourselves. It may enrage us to see the Lord have compassion on such scum of the earth. The apostles were able to reckonise themselves as "The scum of the earth," and how great compassion the Lord showed them. I still grieve over having had a board in my eye from pride of achievement and not discern others accepted in the name of Jesus. This happened in the book of Acts after Paul shook the dust off a city off his feet, one year, and was received the following year had he slandered them it may not be so, and he may have lost his job, just kidding though. As obviously He was called and chosen and faithful to the point of death many times. This is the kind of patient endurance we need with one another, and I agree there are times to walk away. I experienced it here as well. As for me I don't see a difference of eternal security anywhere as its of God, but like you people here I struggle with those needing to enforce the law on others to feel better about themselves as Paul also mentioned. This is the worst nightmare and I also don't consider them lost but unable to grow up in their present condition, remaining as babes, and calling them babes isn't slander, but going beyond is. and we are better to walk away as you said shaking the dust of our feet, saying I can't fellowship with you it enrages me, would be fine but then walk away. Thanks for provoking me to answer and express. The Lord bless you on your Journey.

this is 100% possible- people can CLAIM to be a believer, a Christ follower, but in reality not be.

this is something folks like you ignore- not everyone who claims to be a Christian is.

that is why we do not need to judge.

which is the end result of your theology- to judge.

what is the difference between a true Christ follower struggling with sin and a faker claiming to be a true believer who is just giving lip service?

Assessing a person must be done in our Christian journey. That is not judgement or slander.......it is the required process if we are to do G-d's work. Yes...G-d's work!!!

Eternal life or eternal death happens AFTER we die depending on whether or not we're saved or lost.

You misunderstand a lot.

Hey guys. Lost and lose implies 'by accident.' I think 'discard' it; (Salvation. that is.) Might be more appropriate.

If Jesus states when we are born again we receive eternal life, Here ^^^^^^^^ you are stating that being born again is not in this life.





So actually I misunderstand nothing

You're right.
We discard it... and so we lose it.

It would be interesting to have an explanation of this by the OSAS believers.

Amen decon, "Assurance of Salvation" is a proven doctrine of the Church; here are just a few verses in support of "Assurance of Salvation", from God's truth.


Romans 8:16

John 5:24 - "has eternal life"
Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me 'has eternal life'. He does not come into judgment, but has passed from death to life.
John 3:36 - "has eternal life"
Whoever believes in the Son 'has eternal life'; whoever does not obey the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God remains on him.
Ephesians 2:8-9 - "have been saved"
For by grace you 'have been saved' through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one may boast.
John 10:28 - "never parish"
I give them eternal life, and they will 'never perish', and no one will snatch them out of my hand.
1 John 5:13 - "that you may "know" that you have "eternal life."
I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God 'that you may know that you have eternal life."
Romans 8:1 - "no condemnation"
There is therefore now 'no condemnation' for those who are in Christ Jesus.
Romans 10:13 - "will be saved"
For “everyone who calls on the name of the Lord 'will be saved.”
John 3:16 - "have eternal life"
“For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but
'have eternal life."
Romans 10:13-14 - "will be saved"
For “everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.” How then will they call on him in whom they have not believed? And how are they to believe in him of whom they have never heard? And how are they to hear without someone preaching?
John 10:27-30 - "I give them eternal life"
My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me. 'I give them eternal life', and they will never perish, and no one will snatch them out of my hand. My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all, and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father's hand. I and the Father are one.”
John 6:37 - "I will never cast out"
All that the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me 'I will never cast out."
John 14:16 - our advocate "The Holy Spirit", will be with us "forever"
"And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another advocate to help you and 'be with you forever.
Romans 8:38-39 - "nothing will separate us from the love of God."
For I am sure that neither death nor life, nor angels nor rulers, nor things present nor things to come, nor powers, nor height nor depth, nor anything else in all creation, will be able to separate us from the love of God in Christ Jesus our Lord.

slandering them as liars

I don't see a difference of eternal security anywhere as its of God,

Study some theology UG.
I'm not here to teach YOU.

You'll receive your ETERNAL LIFE OR DEATH after you die. (wrong theology)
Right now, YOU ARE NOT eternal,,, You are mortal.

Study some theology UG.
I'm not here to teach YOU.

You'll receive your ETERNAL LIFE OR DEATH after you die.
Right now, YOU ARE NOT eternal,,, You are mortal.

Here is an "explanation", why we believe in "Assurance of Salvation" which you call OSAS.

But as everyone on this thread understands that you, "discard", biblical proof so that you can support your counterfeit gospel.

The bible say's God raised us up with Christ in Heavenly realms; you are wrong again and again and your fake gospel is the worst I have ever heard. If the bible disagrees with your "fake gospel" you just discard what the bible say's.

Ephesians 2:6
And God "raised us up with Christ and seated us with him in the heavenly realms" in Christ Jesus

Study some theology UG.

Also how do you reconcile predestination and foreknowledge?
I have reconciled these two concepts, but I'd like to hear how you believe it's possible to believe in both.

My point is you have contradicted yourself, scripture and jesus

Jesus has made it very clear when we are born again here on earth we receive eternal life.

This is the heart of the Gospel.

"Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever hears my word and believes the one who sent me has eternal life and will not enter into judgment, but has moved from death to life"

"Truly, truly, I say to you, the one who believes has eternal life"

The bible say's God raised us up with Christ in Heavenly realms; you are wrong again and again and your fake gospel is the worst I have ever heard. If the bible disagrees with your "fake gospel" you just discard what the bible say's.

Ephesians 2:6
And God "raised us up with Christ and seated us with him in the heavenly realms" in Christ Jesus

They are two sides of the same coin. If you believe God knows everything beforehand, that means God has predestinated everything.

I have heard all the philosophical arguments aboutt knowing something is not the same as causing it, and I know all that. But if I know that putting an apple will guarantee my brother will eat it, and I put it there, then I through secondary causes predetermined he was going to do it. I already knew it, no chance he would choose otherwise, yet his choice to do so was FREE, no compulsion involved.