Not By Works

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Hevosmies

Well-known member
Sep 8, 2018
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So what was the yes or no question?

If it was do you still sin daily? My answer is yes.

NEXT
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
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Oh, I wanted to clear the air regarding a quote I posted from John Calvin about there being "babies a span long in hell." Though I've heard it repeated many times, even in sermons from various well known preachers, I could not locate a valid source for the quote. So I retract it, and apologize for the erroneous quote.
Capture.JPG

just for the sake of completeness, how many babies would that be, anyway?
 

Hevosmies

Well-known member
Sep 8, 2018
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If anyone says that they dont sin what they are engaging in is REDEFINITION of the terms.

Meaning they are redefining what sin is, and thats how they "get away with it".

I know some people who would NEVER watch filth on TV or internet, who would NEVER for no amount of money take a puff on a cigarette, wouldnt drink a beer, wouldnt fornicate, buddy they wouldnt do this and they wouldnt do that..... BUT they are so mean to their wives and family members.

Oy vey!

They are backslid and dont even know about it
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
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For we are the Body of Christ the Temple of GOD. It is HE that works in us both to will and do HIS good pleasure; Not I but Christ the Rock in we stand.

I suppose you think Paul was incontinent? Or that maybe we are? That He sinned because he could not help himself even through Christ.
now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me
(Romans 7:20)
_____________________________:unsure:
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
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The definition of span meant in the (unsubstantiated) quote: "the full extent of something from end to end; the amount of space that something covers."
hmm..

it was "a span long" rather than "the span" -- span in the sense of the full breadth would be in a singular sense, i think, tho if we consider hell to occupy a three dimensional space, it ((the totally not an actual quote)) could be taken to mean that babies 'span' the volume of hell in the x direction, but not in y or z.. which is to say, we don't have stacked babies there, but babies laid end-to-end

but it seems to me that the language indicates we're talking about an arbitrary span, not a particular span, so the other definition of span, being a unit of distance, is a more natural choice of interpretation. if that's the case, the question remains whether it is saying that all babies in hell are approx. 9" long, or if there is just one baby in hell, at most 2, because unless they were premies, it's hard to imagine fitting any more than that in a breadth of less than a foot.

:LOL:
 

TruthTalk

Senior Member
Jul 17, 2017
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Oh, I wanted to clear the air regarding a quote I posted from John Calvin about there being "babies a span long in hell." Though I've heard it repeated many times, even in sermons from various well known preachers, I could not locate a valid source for the quote. So I retract it, and apologize for the erroneous quote.
Amen Budman, may truth and justice prevail always, God bless.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
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MAYBE we sin daily? I don't think so. I KNOW we sin daily. :)
yes

i meant, 'maybe' is sometimes why people can't give simple yes/no answers.

i could, for example, point at Romans 7:20 and make a big deal about who is the "real" me, the eternal me of the new creation in Him, the part that endures - the "me" that will remain is without sin, hidden in Him, but the "me" that is put to death, that i am to consider dead, is the "me" that sins. the corpse-tent i dwell in here on earth, that, being subject to the law of sin and death, sins, and dies. i could go in circles around it for many paragraphs and muddle up an answer that eventually distills down to the reconciliation of Romans 7:20 and 1 John 1:8 without ever explicitly stating it, like hiding the simple confession under a pile of words.

honestly tho, i ought to just confess it: yes, daily, and with brutal honesty, moment by moment. because, i can take 'all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God' to give me a definition of sin, 'to fall short of the glory of God' and there is nary a millisecond that goes by i do not match His glory. in that sense, i've never done anything but sin - and any good that has ever been in me, even for a second, isn't me, but Christ dwelling in me!
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
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It is interesting and annoys me intensely.

If we believe we are saved by grace through faith then the attack on it is 3 fold.

Obviously the first is works save.
Then it's "We use it as an excuse to sin and do what we want" antinomianism
Then the 3rd I think relates to your point above.

That we do not have to do good works as such.
As you say "Sit on our Duff's"

Am I a Calvinist?
I really do not know.
I would say I am.

I certainly believe the following

Sola Scriptura
Sola Fide
Sola Gratia
Solus Christus
Soli Deo Gloria

I believe in perseverance of the saints.

So with regards to my 3rd point.
I don't sit in my fat ass and nothing.
I have no idea who will be saved and who will not.
I cannot judge who will be saved.
Only God knows and only he will judge.
That being the case I will endeavour to be the child that I am and walk in the way he has asked me to.

After all if he can save a wretch like me then he can save the person he has put in my way.
i meant to say yesterday, but got caught up doing other things --

Bill, i love how succinctly you put all this. and i was thinking, wow, look back a year ago, and would you have put all this down so concisely? this is a blessing that many of us who've been involved in this enormous thread in some continuing capacity have received, as i see it. that even tho there has been a lot of very ugly talk and bickering in here, there have also been some absolutely wonderful gems, and through it all, we've grown -- being able now to thrust the sword with accuracy, cutting right into the target in this way.
when i look back to things i posted 12, 24, 36 months ago i can really see the result of the iron sharpening the iron :)

**thankful**
 

BillG

Senior Member
Feb 15, 2017
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If anyone says that they dont sin what they are engaging in is REDEFINITION of the terms.

Meaning they are redefining what sin is, and thats how they "get away with it".

I know some people who would NEVER watch filth on TV or internet, who would NEVER for no amount of money take a puff on a cigarette, wouldnt drink a beer, wouldnt fornicate, buddy they wouldnt do this and they wouldnt do that..... BUT they are so mean to their wives and family members.

Oy vey!

They are backslid and dont even know about it
Don Francisco
"Steeple Song"
[Verse 1]
I don't care how many buses you own
Or the size of your sanctuary
Doesn't matter how steep
Your steeple is, if it's sittin' on a cemetery

I don't care if you pave your parking lot
Or put pads upon your pews
What good is a picture perfect stage
If you're missin' all the cues

I don't care if your pastor is super powered
And your program's always new
What you need is love and truth
And men are gonna come to you

It doesn't matter if you know the Bible
If it's all just in your head
But the thing I need to ask you
Is have you done the things I said?

[Chorus]
Do you love your wife?
For her and for and for your children
Are you layin' down your life?
What about the others?

Are you livin' as a servant
To your sisters and your brothers?
Do you make the poor man beg you for a bone?
Do the widow and the orphan cry alone?

[Verse 2]
I don't care if you pray for miracles
I don't care if you speak with tongues
I don't care if you've said you love Me
In every song you've sung

It doesn't matter if your sacrifice of praise
Is loud enough to raise the dead
The thing I need to ask you
Is have you done the things I said?

[Chorus]
Do you love your wife?
With all you've got inside you
Are you layin' down your life?
What about the others?

Are you livin' as a servant
To your sisters and your brothers?
Do you make the poor man beg you for a bone?
Do the widow and the orphan cry alone?

[Tag]
Lord, when were you a prisoner
But we did not come to you
When was it that we saw you sick
That we didn't follow through

Every time you turned your head
And pretended not to see
When you did it not to the least of these
You did it not to Me

It's amazing how people don't do the things they know they should not do but neglect the things they should do yet don't bat an eyelid.

James 2:14-18

Faith Without Works Is Dead
(cf. Gen. 22; Josh. 2)
14 What does it profit, my brethren, if someone says he has faith but does not have works? Can faith save him? 15 If a brother or sister is naked and destitute of daily food, 16 and one of you says to them, “Depart in peace, be warmed and filled,” but you do not give them the things which are needed for the body, what does it profit? 17 Thus also faith by itself, if it does not have works, is dead.
18 But someone will say, “You have faith, and I have works.” Show me your faith without your works, and I will show you my faith by my works.
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
11,995
4,615
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this is in fact the first imperative in the whole book of Romans!

definitely not the last, but 6 chapters into the book is the first time it tells us to "do" something, as a command:
consider yourselves dead to sin, and alive to God through Christ!


((btw my avatar makes sense, right?)) :)



And all this time I thought it was a Reference, to the Jewish Tradition of: "Get your bones moving as you pray to GOD."


Psalm 35:10 (KJV)
10 All my bones shall say, LORD, who is like unto thee, . . .


 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,801
13,551
113
And all this time I thought it was a Reference, to the Jewish Tradition of: "Get your bones moving as you pray to GOD."


Psalm 35:10 (KJV)
10 All my bones shall say, LORD, who is like unto thee, . . .


equivalent :D
 
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,402
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I think satan got ahold of this thread the past few days. Although it goes to show how important this thread is. (If not he would not continually try to attack it) I fear it also has caused some damage, as we had two groups where were in the fight against legalism and the dangerous gospel which sadly convinces people they are walking toward God when they are not. And fighting each other. It split that group so bad, it even had a few from one group calling the other group unsaved, Not to mention the attacks and what I would consider unchristian like behavior from certain people,
In doing this, I fear he has caused a severe roadblock in thr fight against legalism, at least in this thread. Which may be difficult to overcome. Some peoples reputations have also been severely affected. It is sad that we can let satan get in here and do this.

The bible says God can take all things and turn them into good. I just pray he can take what has happened here. And somehow turn it to goof for HIS purpose in the fight against the false gospel of works which leads people to hell.. Lets pray for healing..
Amen......the biggest fundmantal point of the bible.....Human Choice......found through and through the bible....From Adam to the last man.....Choose who you will serve......!