Sabbath

oy vey

amen!

the servant even offered to pay in full, asking for patient mercy - - but the Master made it so that he owed nothing! what began as a loan was declared a gift

in the same place it says whoever has ceased from his own works has indeed entered His rest, and that the Hebrews did not enter rest because of unbelief, not because of failure to physically observe a sign. it also makes clear in the same place that His rest of which is being spoken is not the physical observance of the sabbath ordinance - because the author calls it the same as what is written, another day, called "today" - which is true every day of every week.

the intent is not physical. it is spiritual, as the worship also of His true worshippers, not on this mountain or some other.

Matthew 19:17-19
And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? [there is] none good but one, [that is], God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments. He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Honour thy father and [thy] mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.


notice anything conspicuously absent..?

Those who do guard the Sabbath don't do it because of the physical command. They who keep it do so spiritually. Though there is an actual observance it is because they have been redeemed and are being set appart through their sanctification. Obedience doesn't come because of the letter it comes by way of the Spirit. In other words if you keep the Sabbath day, do it because you are redeemed and hoping for the certain salvation to come.
Nullifying the Sabbath is not what Messiah came to do. He didn't come to move or change it either.

so consider two people. One considers all days alike, the other considers Saturday above the other six.

what is the alleged benefit of the one who regards Saturday? Are they more righteous? There is no condemnation for anyone who was in Christ Jesus. a person in Christ is the righteousness of God. so it can't be some kind of righteousness level.

Perhaps a reward? if it's a reward in this life it must be invisible. I look at the people who I know in real life that regard Saturday and they have the same issues and struggles as all other kinds of Christians that I know of.

some reward in the life to come? I guess that would be a wait and see issue.

Yes, we can now see what this Priesthood, who were in charge of the Temple and performed, as Paul described, ""Deeds of this Law" for the "errors" of the people, foreshadowed.

A better way of cleansing our rebellion towards God's Instructions than by a Priesthood who offered the blood of animals (works of the law) for justification.


1 For the law having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect.
2 For then would they not have ceased to be offered? because that the worshippers once purged should have had no more conscience of sins.
3 But in those sacrifices there is a remembrance again made of sins every year.
4 For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins.

13 For if the blood of bulls and of goats, and the ashes of an heifer sprinkling the unclean, sanctifieth to the purifying of the flesh:
14 How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God?

Very nice John,

I love how you put this.

I am reminded:

Rom. 8:6 For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.

8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.

But the Messiah came to save us from our enemy, (our own mind) if we would only let Him.

Eph. 2:15 Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;
16 And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby:

It is the Spirit which takes man's natural hatred for God's Instructions away from the repentant. Our "flesh" is crucified with Him, and we are free from it's bounds to "Serve the Living God".

I am encouraged by your posts John. Thank you

There are two men who are thieves. They both are introduced to God's Word and they both "Drink of that Rock which is Christ".

But one submits Himself to God's instruction and quits stealing, while the other claims God's reward but continues to steal.

"what is the alleged benefit of the one who regards stealing ? Are they more righteous? Is there no condemnation for those who proclaim "Lord, Lord, but refuse to do what He says?

Yes I do.

2 I am the LORD thy God, which have brought thee out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage.
3 Thou shalt have no other gods before me.

You place quotes before the word what, but where are the close quotes for that?

There is no condemnation for those who are in Christ. It's not the human way of doing things, that's for sure!

I do not see the phrase "Deeds of this Law" in the King James version.

the phrase "Deeds of the Law" occurs twice here
19 Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God.

20 Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.

21 But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets;

22 Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:

23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;

24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:

25 Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;

26 To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus.

27 Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith.

28 Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.

29 Is he the God of the Jews only? is he not also of the Gentiles? Yes, of the Gentiles also:

30 Seeing it is one God, which shall justify the circumcision by faith, and uncircumcision through faith.

31 Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.

I don't think it's referring to things that the priest did, but to the actions of evil people showing that they could not keep the law.

No disrespect to you however you want me to consider something that I have already studied a long time.
Scripture teaches us that every day is Holy. It doesn't teach Sabbath or any feast day has changed.
There are many people who guard the Sabbath day and the feasts of Messiah. Many of them do not agree on what day a feast starts. It is these people who have come to understand that the feast days are meant for the assembly that the writing is for. The scriptures are not pointing to a way to justify not being on guard.
More or less righteous should not be in a believer's vocabulary because there is no condemnation for those who have trusted. To trust and do is were a person receives righteousness. If I do and do not trust the one who the Father sent I am not righteous. If I trust and do not do I am not righteous.
According to the testimony of Messiah we should do the will of his Father if we trust him. If we say we know Elohim, (God) and don't confirm the instruction we don't know the son or the Father.
Friend consider that what you have been taught is in error because there are many on the path to death and few that find the path to life and stay on it.

Yes, I understand what you preach. I asked once if you believed God instructed Moses to set forth specific "deeds" or "works" that were specifically designed to atone for the sins of the people. You never answered.

if a person does not consider using special names for Christ and believing that one day they hold in esteem exalts them over other believers, then why make such a fuss?

huh?

you are actually taking backwards steps in returning to what JESUS says cannot save you

I cannot, truly truly, cannot, understand how such a spin of deception is woven when the New Testament never tells even the Jews to keep the law!

and please do not bother me with the prattle of how I should be careful blah blah blah

what is up with all the Judaizers lately?

no disrespect taken. my saying consider two people was a literary device.

"To trust and do is were a person receives righteousness." I think that's where we diverge. I think a person is considered righteous by God if they believe that Jesus died for their sins, was buried, and came back to life on the third day, and that he was seen by many witnesses. what a person does, the doing, doesn't enter into it. because a person is considered righteous by God, it is proper for them to do good works.

the path of trying to be considered righteous by God by trying to do good works, even if they are just part of the system, is the path to death, because no one does good, not even one, not you and not me.

if you feel that you are considered righteous by God based even in part on your actions, then you have something to boast about! You can be glad that you have received salvation because you have chosen to do good works!

Galatians 3:10-11
10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them.

11 But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith.

How do you decide to have a Saturday Sabbath but decide you are not working at the law? And then quote OT law to show why you should "keep" a Saturday sabbath?

Hebrews 7:15-19
15 And it is yet far more evident: for that after the similitude of Melchisedec there ariseth another priest,
16 Who is made, not after the law of a carnal commandment, but after the power of an endless life.
17 For he testifieth, Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec.
18 For there is verily a disannulling of the commandment going before for the weakness and unprofitableness thereof.
19 For the law made nothing perfect, but the bringing in of a better hope did; by the which we draw nigh unto God.

I'm not sure how to make this any more clear than the scriptures already do.

Galatians 3:2-3
2 This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?
3 Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?

The legalists and judaizers answer is 'yes, we really are that foolish'.

I believe I did answer, but the confusion may come from the fact that the word atone doesn't appear until middle English. Moses did talk about things like sin offerings, yes. now, do those sin offerings make a person righteous in the sense that Abraham was reckoned righteous by God? or do they just keep God from destroying the people the way that he instructed the Israelites to destroy the Canaanites? I lean towards the latter.

but the phrase "Deeds of the law" occurs in the King James Bible only in Romans chapter 3, where it refers to actions prescribed by the law such as slaying bulls, paying tithes, attending a holy assembly on the Sabbath, properly draining the blood out of an animal before you eat it.

here's a much more readable version
So no one will be considered right with God by obeying the law. Instead, the law makes us more aware of our sin.

We firmly believe that a person is made right with God because of their faith. They are not saved by obeying the law.

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Romans+3&version=NIRV

The fascinating thing about your reply is the "works" part. You do works every day. As so as you wake up you do works. Every Saturday you do works, every Sunday you do works. You preach on this forum, that is works.

The Bible said we will be judged by our works.

Rom. 2:
6 Who will render to every man according to his deeds:
7 To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life:

8 But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath,

9 Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile;

10 But glory, honour, and peace, to every man that worketh good, to the Jew first, and also to the Gentile:

11 For there is no respect of persons with God.

Since Abraham, Zechariahs, Caleb, Abel, Noah and the perfect Man Jesus, along with all other righteous examples of Faith in the Bible, chose God's Works (good, just and holy) over their own works (filthy rag), shouldn't we also choose God's way over the religious ways of man?

Doesn't the Bible say to love others "As Jesus Loved us". Doesn't the Bible say to "walk even as He walked"? Didn't He say to "be ye perfect even as your Father in Heaven is perfect"? Are we not to mirror the "Faith of Abraham"? Are we not to by admonished by the Examples given us in his Word?

1 John 3:7 Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.

So Jesus followed a lifestyle, created by the God of the Bible, and He was considered Righteous BECAUSE of His Walk, and He commanded that I "walk even as He Walked". If I "do as He says", when the Judgment comes, does God see "my work" or the Work's of His Son?

What if I have been convinced as Eve was, that God's instructions are a burden, that they are "against us"? Was Eve punished because she "chose" God's instructions? Or because she chose her own works, what she saw?

If I deny myself, and Follow Jesus as instructed, is this offensive to God or pleasing to God?

I think you are in error because you have been convinced that the argument is Works VS. No Works, when the Bible teaches the argument is between Man's Works VS. God's Works.

8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
9 Not of (mans) works, lest any man should boast.
10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

26 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.