Should a Christian tithe, what does the Bible say
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"Christian" can mean anyone, we have no way of knowing who Gods elect are. We do know that Jesus said that the majority are going to hell, I'm sure you've heard of the wide road and the many who travel on it and the narrow gate etc.
Those who come to Him on that day saying Lord, Lord are all "Christians" so you know what I mean when I say Christians, it means nothing these days
Those who come to Him on that day saying Lord, Lord are all "Christians" so you know what I mean when I say Christians, it means nothing these days
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I thought we already covered that!, why do you accuse successfully hard working believers of being wicked like Herod and Co.
Even a person with a very limited understanding like your good self would have to agree that a person who is lazy and good for nothing can't help the poor and starving.
The parable speaks about all of us who God gave talents to use them to make lots of money so you can bless lots of needy people. Please don't twist it and make lazy drug addicts, alcoholics and those who waste their talents and time out to be the good guys and the successful hard workers the bad guys.
All scripture must be spiritually discerned or it is utter foolishness
Even a person with a very limited understanding like your good self would have to agree that a person who is lazy and good for nothing can't help the poor and starving.
The parable speaks about all of us who God gave talents to use them to make lots of money so you can bless lots of needy people. Please don't twist it and make lazy drug addicts, alcoholics and those who waste their talents and time out to be the good guys and the successful hard workers the bad guys.
All scripture must be spiritually discerned or it is utter foolishness
We will be judged at the judgement seat of Christ ( only believers will be there ) for what we did AFTER we were saved
Im all for bearing fruit , of course we are called to do that , but its NOT what saves us or keeps us saved
And Christians ( i prefer to say Believers , cause alot of people say they are Christian when they havent trusted Christ alone for their salvation ) are NOT dead in their trespasses and sins , we have been redeemed
You need to rightly divide the word , and distinguish between the covenants
sorry renewed , put your post in there by mistake
Im all for bearing fruit , of course we are called to do that , but its NOT what saves us or keeps us saved
And Christians ( i prefer to say Believers , cause alot of people say they are Christian when they havent trusted Christ alone for their salvation ) are NOT dead in their trespasses and sins , we have been redeemed
You need to rightly divide the word , and distinguish between the covenants
sorry renewed , put your post in there by mistake
At the church i grew up in once a year - and inly once a year - the pastor would talk about money on sunday morning. That sunday night the budget for the church would be read and discussed with the while congregation, as many as showed up, and submitted before everyone for approval. Total transparency.
i was young and don't recall much of what the messages were about each year, but i do remember that he was always apologetic and almost a bit embarrassed to be bringing the subject up for a sermon, that he focused on stewardship, and that i never felt compelled or under pressure, obligation or command to 'pay up' as the plates went around.
i don't find fault with what i remember. i can't remember whether he used or abused the word tithe. i wouldn't have known better then, in my youth, if he did. If i were to hear a recording of one of those sermons now maybe i'd find things to criticize, but it's impressed upon me how far differently i come out of that than the attitude we see in Danny from his own experience after hearing a message on money from the preacher he admires.
i was young and don't recall much of what the messages were about each year, but i do remember that he was always apologetic and almost a bit embarrassed to be bringing the subject up for a sermon, that he focused on stewardship, and that i never felt compelled or under pressure, obligation or command to 'pay up' as the plates went around.
i don't find fault with what i remember. i can't remember whether he used or abused the word tithe. i wouldn't have known better then, in my youth, if he did. If i were to hear a recording of one of those sermons now maybe i'd find things to criticize, but it's impressed upon me how far differently i come out of that than the attitude we see in Danny from his own experience after hearing a message on money from the preacher he admires.
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yes
what that man said to you was a profound comment on the institutionalized church! i'd have never forgotten such a thing either.
it's true that the whole machination of what transpired is not explained in the text, and it's also true as you say that there are a number of object lessons for us in the account.
what i'm seeing in this though, is that there are clues in how Peter describes what they've done, using the word 'conspiracy' and clues in the placement of the account directly after the run-in with the Sadducees, and the context of what was going on in the city as the Spirit was working drawing together the church. the odd mention of a Levite who sold land. the detail of the young men who carried the bodies away. the significant display of the power of the Spirit and the authority with which Peter spoke.
it's not uncommon for the Bible to give scant information about an event which, if we were writing a history book or a newsreel, we'd include much more detail - for example here:
how did Er err? ((see what i did there lol))
the Bible doesn't say. the thing significant to the purpose of the narrative isn't Er's error, but the fact that Er erred.
here, the depth of Ananias & Sapphira's plot isn't explored. the most significant thing is that they lied, that they conspired together to do so, and that the Spirit was in no way deceived by it. but putting this together with all the surrounding text there's actually a lot of information for us to piece together what may have been happening. God wants us to study, to think, to dive into the word and swim in it, to seek Him out in it -- there are certainly moral lessons taught by this event, but treating it like it's 'just about greed' is IMO like only sticking our toes in the water.
it's similar, in a way, about the sabbath, and the Law, where you and i have spent a year throwing sparks. i've never said anyone should not keep it -- just that no one should be judged over it, whether for keeping or for not. observation of it by resting from physical labor is just like sticking our toe in the pool; it's only the surface, and i figure we ought to get all wet. i guess your point has been that we have to get our toes wet before we can get the rest of ourselves in, but you know, if i went ahead and dove, my toe would actually be the last thing that touches the water
ain't it funny how now that we're talking about Sadducees instead of Pharisees we're basically on the same page together hahaha
♥
what that man said to you was a profound comment on the institutionalized church! i'd have never forgotten such a thing either.
it's true that the whole machination of what transpired is not explained in the text, and it's also true as you say that there are a number of object lessons for us in the account.
what i'm seeing in this though, is that there are clues in how Peter describes what they've done, using the word 'conspiracy' and clues in the placement of the account directly after the run-in with the Sadducees, and the context of what was going on in the city as the Spirit was working drawing together the church. the odd mention of a Levite who sold land. the detail of the young men who carried the bodies away. the significant display of the power of the Spirit and the authority with which Peter spoke.
it's not uncommon for the Bible to give scant information about an event which, if we were writing a history book or a newsreel, we'd include much more detail - for example here:
Now Judah took a wife for Er his firstborn, and her name was Tamar. But Er, Judah’s firstborn, was evil in the sight of the LORD, so the LORD took his life.
(Genesis 38:6-7)
how did Er err? ((see what i did there lol))
the Bible doesn't say. the thing significant to the purpose of the narrative isn't Er's error, but the fact that Er erred.
here, the depth of Ananias & Sapphira's plot isn't explored. the most significant thing is that they lied, that they conspired together to do so, and that the Spirit was in no way deceived by it. but putting this together with all the surrounding text there's actually a lot of information for us to piece together what may have been happening. God wants us to study, to think, to dive into the word and swim in it, to seek Him out in it -- there are certainly moral lessons taught by this event, but treating it like it's 'just about greed' is IMO like only sticking our toes in the water.
it's similar, in a way, about the sabbath, and the Law, where you and i have spent a year throwing sparks. i've never said anyone should not keep it -- just that no one should be judged over it, whether for keeping or for not. observation of it by resting from physical labor is just like sticking our toe in the pool; it's only the surface, and i figure we ought to get all wet. i guess your point has been that we have to get our toes wet before we can get the rest of ourselves in, but you know, if i went ahead and dove, my toe would actually be the last thing that touches the water
ain't it funny how now that we're talking about Sadducees instead of Pharisees we're basically on the same page together hahaha
♥
I see no difference between Sadducees, Pharisees, and "many" of the mainstream religions of today.
As for the Sabbath or any commandment, my focus is what the Scriptures say or don't about them.
I will be judged if I kill someone, steal from someone, lie to someone, in rebellion to Him and His instructions. Of this there is no doubt. I must, with His help, refrain from doing these things.
1 Cor. 6:9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,
10 Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.
For me, I see no power given to me to judge one of God's Commandments over another. I am the purchased, not the purchaser. I know it is mainstream religious tradition to reject His Sabbath, just as it is mainstream religious tradition to create images of God after the likeness of man, and to create "Feasts unto the Lord". All of which are forbidden by the "Word which became Flesh" just as killing is forbidden, and stealing is forbidden.
For this Biblical reason I believe the Sabbath is just as important as any other "Word of God", and can find no Biblical reason to judge it as a commandment unworthy of my respect and honor. I am not a judge of his Word, but strive to be a "doer" of His Word as He instructs. I believe this is the message He promoted.
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J
exactly, king Herod and the roman emperors had financial success, exactly what your selling, no mix up.
and why does this message always lead to mansions, private jets and dancing on money?
money and material possessions are of this world, Satans world. why would you want to root yourself so deep into that?
and why does this message always lead to mansions, private jets and dancing on money?
money and material possessions are of this world, Satans world. why would you want to root yourself so deep into that?
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What Scripture actually teaches about Christians is this:
Ephesians 2:1-5 "As for you, you were dead in your transgressions and sins, 2 in which you used to live when you followed the ways of this world and of the ruler of the kingdom of the air, the spirit who is now at work in those who are disobedient. 3 All of us also lived among them at one time, gratifying the cravings of our flesh[a] and following its desires and thoughts. Like the rest, we were by nature deserving of wrath. 4 But because of his great love for us, God, who is rich in mercy, 5 made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in transgressions—it is by grace you have been saved. "
We were (past tense) dead, but we have been saved.
Ephesians 2:1-5 "As for you, you were dead in your transgressions and sins, 2 in which you used to live when you followed the ways of this world and of the ruler of the kingdom of the air, the spirit who is now at work in those who are disobedient. 3 All of us also lived among them at one time, gratifying the cravings of our flesh[a] and following its desires and thoughts. Like the rest, we were by nature deserving of wrath. 4 But because of his great love for us, God, who is rich in mercy, 5 made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in transgressions—it is by grace you have been saved. "
We were (past tense) dead, but we have been saved.
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Here are a few quotes from you that tell the real story...
“The rest of us sheep including yourself don't have that gift” (post 127)
“most "Christians" are offended by Gods Word so your not alone” (post 141)
“You obviously worship in a false Church that doesn't preach the Word of God.” (post 183)
“You obviously don't even know what a Church is supposed to do,” (post 183)
“You're in the same boat as those blind self appointed experts who came up with 40,000 sects and cults” (post 186)
“You want to be your own shepherd” (post 205)
“You all went and read the Bible using your fallen carnal and sinful minds and you came up with thousands of stupid assumptions” (post 208)
“You obviously don't believe in the God of the Bible, so it's obvious you serve the god of mammon.” (post 223)
I could go on, but I have adequately proved the error of your claim.
“The rest of us sheep including yourself don't have that gift” (post 127)
“most "Christians" are offended by Gods Word so your not alone” (post 141)
“You obviously worship in a false Church that doesn't preach the Word of God.” (post 183)
“You obviously don't even know what a Church is supposed to do,” (post 183)
“You're in the same boat as those blind self appointed experts who came up with 40,000 sects and cults” (post 186)
“You want to be your own shepherd” (post 205)
“You all went and read the Bible using your fallen carnal and sinful minds and you came up with thousands of stupid assumptions” (post 208)
“You obviously don't believe in the God of the Bible, so it's obvious you serve the god of mammon.” (post 223)
I could go on, but I have adequately proved the error of your claim.
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Yes,
There is now, and I believe has always been religions which claim the name of the Christ, but His Spirit is not directing them. We are in the New Covenant, we don't need preachers to filter the Word anymore. Sadly, many folks like it that way. It's much easier to let someone else "Seek the Kingdom" for them.. Jeremiah prophesied of this exact same thing.
Jer. 5:
26 For among my people are found wicked men: they lay wait, as he that setteth snares; they set a trap, they catch men.
27 As a cage is full of birds, so are their houses full of deceit: therefore they are become great, and waxen rich.
28 They are waxen fat, they shine: yea, they overpass the deeds of the wicked: they judge not the cause, the cause of the fatherless, yet they prosper; and the right of the needy do they not judge.
29 Shall I not visit for these things? saith the LORD: shall not my soul be avenged on such a nation as this?
30 A wonderful and horrible thing is committed in the land;
31 The prophets prophesy falsely, and the priests bear rule by their means; and my people love to have it so: and what will ye do in the end thereof?
There is now, and I believe has always been religions which claim the name of the Christ, but His Spirit is not directing them. We are in the New Covenant, we don't need preachers to filter the Word anymore. Sadly, many folks like it that way. It's much easier to let someone else "Seek the Kingdom" for them.. Jeremiah prophesied of this exact same thing.
Jer. 5:
26 For among my people are found wicked men: they lay wait, as he that setteth snares; they set a trap, they catch men.
27 As a cage is full of birds, so are their houses full of deceit: therefore they are become great, and waxen rich.
28 They are waxen fat, they shine: yea, they overpass the deeds of the wicked: they judge not the cause, the cause of the fatherless, yet they prosper; and the right of the needy do they not judge.
29 Shall I not visit for these things? saith the LORD: shall not my soul be avenged on such a nation as this?
30 A wonderful and horrible thing is committed in the land;
31 The prophets prophesy falsely, and the priests bear rule by their means; and my people love to have it so: and what will ye do in the end thereof?
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