Speaking in tongues

This comment might have some truth behind it, but it is irrelevant in the context of converted non-Jews as in Corinth.

Really ??!!
And what is your evidence that we are not speaking to God by praying in the Holy Spirit as commanded to.
Not opinion. Not unbelief. Not supposition.
Real evidence.

If there were a stinking dog turd on the ground and you insisted it was a gold nugget, would you think it were up to me to prove it wasn't gold? Pentecostal tongues stink and look like a dog turd. How would gibberish sound different? How would gibberish look different?

Go try to buy something that that dog turn you say is gold. Go try to communicate with someone with that gibberish you say is a language.

How diguesting it is to insist that something that looks and smells like a turd is of God.

I know it's a turd because it has no value, aside form what you want to imagine or pretend it has. I know it's a turd because Pentecostals gravitate toward all kinds of stinking doctrine, with an exceptional inability to detect the stench of turds. In other words, Pentecostals lack credibility and they lack evidence of benefit form these gifts.

I know it's a turd because I affirmatively recognize the stench of a turd. I recognize what Pentecostals are saying when they think they're speaking in tongues. I recognize that they're throwing out random syllables from the English language.

Your disgusting rant will be reported to the moderators.

Regardless of what you believe on this subject, there is no need to be so offensive to a large segment of sincere brothers and sisters in Christ who claim to have experienced speaking in tongues.

We are trying to take some measures to keep things civil and friendly here -- to actually practice love toward fellow Christians. In order to promote this kind of environment, it is necessary to remove persons who do the contrary.

Note to all our members: the banning of this member has nothing to do with his view on speaking in tongues -- it really doesn't matter to me what he believes on this particular subject. It is his manner of speaking in reference to many sincere brothers and sisters in Christ -- his very deliberate attempt to offend them -- that is the issue here. We may not be completely consistent in dealing with things but we're trying, as things are reported. Thanks for your help everyone.

The law pertaining to Tonges is still the same .I cannot see how men could get confused to what it reveals. (Wherefore tongues are for a sign, not to them that believe, but to them that believe not) It would seem the phrase beleive, and believe not must be ignored by the sign seekers

In the law it is written, With men of other tongues and other lips will I speak unto this people; and yet for all that will they not hear me, saith the Lord. Wherefore tongues are for a sign, not to them that believe, but to them that believe not: but prophesying serveth not for them that believe not, but for them which believe.1 Corinthians 14:21-22

Tongues is simply God speaking, not man speaking in other languages other than Hebrew alone . The sign of tongues is against those who refuse to hear the word of God .Therefore they make it to no effect so that they can keep the oral tradition of men.



God is no longer brining new prophecy in any language , What ever Christians do they do it in the power of the holy Spirit. Praying is no acceptation.. No outward sign as a gift that confirm anything of God. A contrite heart and a desire to do the will is all that is needed to belive God to the salvation of ones soul .Its not difernt than one of the newer assumed sign gifts falling back slain in the spirit . When will enough outward signs be enough to be a person has the Spirit of Christ? What's next, holy eating to confirm a person has the spirit.

I am convinced that where there is unbelief the Holy Spirit is absent.

I didn't ask for you post your unbelief, nor to post opinion and supposition.
I asked for real evidence in the real world.
What tangible evidence do you, or DJ2, or DDDo, or any other member, have that praying in tongues is not from
God and is not praying in the Holy Spirit (as we are commanded to do).
Real evidence, not opinion.

I can leap tall buildings in a single bound. Prove that I can't ?

The unbelieving Jews during the time of Christ sought proof of who Jesus was .. and He provided that proof over and over again. You demanding that others prove contrarily is backwards. The onus of proof is on you and others making a claim. This should be elementary.

I posted the law of God. How could that provide unbelief ?

Are you saying we can go above that which is written and call it tangible confirmation ?

What does not to them that believe but to those who believe not mean to you?

In the law it is written, With men of other tongues and other lips will I speak unto this people; and yet for all that will they not hear me, saith the Lord. Wherefore tongues are for a sign, not to them that believe, but to them that believe not: but prophesying serveth not for them that believe not, but for them which believe.1 Corithians 14:21-22

What men claim to experience does not validate the truth of the unseen spirit world. If it did then when the Son of man said for the third time again ….. as it is written It must be made to no effect .

Did Christ bow down to experience or did he walk by faith the unseen mixing faith in what he did se or hear?

I would suggest no man can serve two teaching masters . Which master are we to serve? Experience that some say, or as it is written alone as Christ says?

And when the tempter came to him, he said, If thou be the Son of God, command that these stones be made bread. But he answered and said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God. Then the devil taketh him up into the holy city, and setteth him on a pinnacle of the temple, And saith unto him, If thou be the Son of God, cast thyself down: for it is written, He shall give his angels charge concerning thee: and in their hands they shall bear thee up, lest at any time thou dash thy foot against a stone. Jesus said unto him, It is written again, Thou shalt not tempt the Lord thy God. Again, the devil taketh him up into an exceeding high mountain, and sheweth him all the kingdoms of the world, and the glory of them; And saith unto him, All these things will I give thee, if thou wilt fall down and worship me. Then saith Jesus unto him, Get thee hence, Satan: for it is written, Thou shalt worship the Lord thy God, and him only shalt thou serve. Then the devil leaveth him, and, behold, angels came and ministered unto him. Mathew 4:3-11

garee

what law pertains to tongues?

why do you seem to be ignoring the scriptures that instruct the use of tongues in a body of believers and seem to insist that tongues are only a sign for unbelievers?

I posted some time back with reference to that and you skipped over it

you know, ignoring the scriptures that do not give credence to what you write is not evidence that everyone else is mistaken

further, you continue to string together UNRELATED verses, taken out of context, and try to use them to lend support to your ...kind of strange, sorry to say...doctrine of tongues

it never was and is not now about people using or thinking tongues are a sign when they ask to be filled with the Holy Spirit

Christians are not using tongues for a sign

Wow, so many different views on speaking in tongues. One thing I do know is that God's word is true. "Heaven and earth will pass away, but his words will not pass away" (Matthew 24:35). The word of God plainly tells us that when we receive his spirit there will be evidence to prove that we have his spirit which is speaking in tongues. You can find this written within the new testament. I strongly believe that those who oppose it are those who have never seen it or lack the knowledge about it...

I would suggest as to the law of God .The whole bible is a perfect law not one word comes from a philosophical theory of men as a private interpretation .

Sorry I missed what you posted. Tongues is a sign to those who believe not, its seem clear according to that law . Prophecy provides no outward sign to confirm a person is filled with the Holy Spirit .

The verses I posted from Isaiah 28 are needed as the foundation of that law. Its there we can see the purpose of God bringing new revelation as prophecy in other languages other than Hebrew alone. (God mocking those who mock prophecy . trying to making it to no effect by the oral traditions of men .

Where do you find people asking to be filled with the Holy Spirit as if we were not filled when we first believed?

2 Corinthians 4:7 But we have this treasure in earthen vessels, that the excellency of the power may be of God, and not of us.

What does the phrase "filled with the Spirit" mean? Can it be fuller that Christ working in us to both will and do His good pleasure as a imputed righteousness? Is the treasure we have in these bodies of death half full?

Where does it say there will be outward evidence a person is filled with the Spirit being empty or partially full before?

We have evidence (God's word) we will receive our new incorruptible bodies. which all die having not received

And these all, having obtained a good report through faith, received not the promise:Hebrews 11:39

I don't see anyone walking around in a glorified new incorruptible body as the bride of Christ? We walk by faith the unseen eternal) Not by sight as that seen the temporal.

It makes me wonder according to the querry in Luke 18. When Christ comes on the last day will he find His faith working in the heart of men as that comes from hearing God through the scriptures or people walking after their own outward experiences after the imaginations of their own hearts as in the days of Noah

Luke 18:8I tell you that he will avenge them speedily. Nevertheless when the Son of man cometh, shall he find faith on the earth


Genesis 6:5 And God saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually ……………………………………... (No faith)


I would think...can't put the cart before the horse. That would be turning things upside down as did the unconverted Jews who refused to hear the word of God . God has given us a sign to beware of those who go above that which is written.

How do you define …..not to them that believe prophercy (the word of God) , but to them that believe not:? (no faith)

In the law it is written, With men of other tongues and other lips will I speak unto this people; and yet for all that will they not hear me, saith the Lord. Wherefore tongues are for a sign, not to them that believe, but to them that believe not: but prophesying serveth not for them that believe not, but for them which believe.1 Corithians 14:21-22

Please provide some support for this assertion. Jews require a sign. Gentiles seek knowledge. Unknown tongues cannot provide knowledge and are therefore unfruitful. So says the Holy Spirit through Paul in 1 Cor 14:14

For the cause of Christ
Roger

Salvation is based on grace and not works. All the works of unsaved people are a testimony against them and cannot get them into heaven. Only grace can and does save. Works of believers are judged but not in respect to them becoming saved.

Paul in Romans 3 gives a clear record regarding mans position in respect to God. Paul was always telling Jews who thought themselves righteous according to the law that the law was the very thing that was condemning them.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

Prior to the completion of the NT tongues were a sign of the presence of the Holy Spirit. The early church was authorized to witness of Jesus as the long promised Messiah and confirmed by the presence of the Holy Spirit through signs of which tongues was one.

With the completion of the NT scripture the Holy Spirit now ministered through the scriptures so the sign of tongues was no longer required. There is no written word known to man like the written word of God. No other manuscripts have the power of the Holy Spirit upon them. It is through the hearing of the word of God that men are given the faith to believe on Jesus Christ as Savior.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

It is a sign that believers have been filled with the Holy Spirit.

And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance. (Act 2:4 KJV)

While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word. And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost. For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter, (Act 10:44-46 KJV)

And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Ghost came on them; and they spake with tongues, and prophesied. Act 19:6

Lets take this one point you keep repeating over and over. You claim that tongues is God speaking. What do you use for proof, garee?

What does the Bible say?

1 Cor 14:
2) For he that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God: for no man understandeth him; howbeit in the spirit he speaketh mysteries.

When a person speaks in tongues, it is the person speaking TO God.

4) He that speaketh in an unknown tongue edifieth himself; but he that prophesieth edifieth the church.

When a person speaks in tongues, it is the person speaking.

6) Now, brethren, if I come unto you speaking with tongues, what shall I profit you, except I shall speak to you either by revelation, or by knowledge, or by prophesying, or by doctrine?

Paul says that when he speaks in tongues, HE is speaking.

14) For if I pray in an unknown tongue, my spirit prayeth, but my understanding is unfruitful.

Paul says that HE prays in tongues.

15) What is it then? I will pray with the spirit, and I will pray with the understanding also: I will sing with the spirit, and I will sing with the understanding also.

Paul says that HE prays with the spirit (speaks in tongues).

18) I thank my God, I speak with tongues more than ye all:

Paul says HE spoke in tongues more that the entire Corinthian church.

Speaking in tongues is not God speaking, it is people speaking TO God in a language he does not know (1 Cor 14:2, 14).

actually there is proof but that still is not the issue . The word of God says this gift is still operating today. have people abused them absolutely just as they have the Offices of Pastor and teacher, etc... Unknown tongues is in the Bible which means unlearned or not of ones native language . 1cor 12, 13, and 14 is very clear concerning the Gifts of the Holy Spirit which tongues is one of them. Human reasoning does not discredit the word of God nor does people who are operating in immaturity or ignorance . 1cor 14:38-40