Not By Works

I thought I addressed this in a post a page or so back. Maybe you haven't read it.
Please go see it.
One thing I do know about you is that you do respond to replies to your posts.
But I have not seen a response to it.

I believe we are positionally sanctified based on genuine faith.
This side of eternity we will not be ultimately sanctified because we can't.
But I do believe that as a result of genuine faith in Jesus and set apart we seek to be like Jesus.

My prayers every day and focus is "Jesus I want to be like you"

Nothing more or nothing less.

Righteousness through the law and righteousness through the love of Jesus are 2 different things. One is not going to save, the other is part of the practical sanctification process. You must be fully sanctified in order to be saved.

Precisely. BUT doing good works for the purpose of getting, keeping or maintaining salvation, are works that are done in vain. Works don't and will not save us.

We are to do them for the purpose of obeying God and His command to show HIS love to OTHERS, through US. That is why we do good works.

But if we do good works for the selfish purpose of getting or keeping salvation, then those works are moot in the eyes of God.

So do you need to be ultimately sanctified in order to be saved?

I have always agreed with your statement. My only position which seems to oppose you is that if you don't do good works for the purpose of obeying God and His command to show his love to others, through us, then the person is deceiving themselves that they were truly saved in the first place.

So to me, good works in a way, is the arbitrator of being saved or not. Remember it is not good works that try to save us, but good works for the purpose of obeying God, and His command to show his love to others, through us. That is the good woks arbitrator.

Hi benhur, no mountain there. It is this; if you are putting your works out in front of your salvation it is not a good thing, why, because salvation is by grace through faith, "Not By Works" works are evidence of faith. If you are depending on your works to get you into heaven forget it.

From "Faith to Faith", it is by God's grace and mercy we are saved, our practice, sanctification, is our daily Christian growth. This is taught all throughout mainstream Christianity, these are not my ideas.

What I hear people talk about in your "soteriology", the doctrine of salvation, is that you, "mix" Positional sanctification, (justified), with Practical sanctification, (works). Your justification and your good works are meant to be separate parts of our Christian walk.

Justification by God and the Holy Spirit is our guarantee He will bring us safely home, "the security of the believer, eternal salvation, is a gift of God, you cannot work for it.

I understand you may or may not believe in some of what I say.

John10:28
I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one will snatch them out of my hand.

If you could clarify ultimately sanctfied then I can answer, because I have no idea what your saying

Repent for the kingdom of God is st hand.


The only command is Repent.


Repent means to turn to God in submission to His kingdom and rule as Lord.

If we are called to turn to God, then by default we are called to turn from Satan as our lord and master.

Repent is the call of God to join His kingdom, whereby we are transferred out of the domain of darkness into the kingdom of His dear Son, if we obey and repent.

Because God loves us and wants none of us to perish, He calls us according to His grace to repent, turn to Him and become sons of God.


Repent is the most beautiful word in the Bible because it leads us to be reconciled with God, in which we our sins are forgiven and we are cleansed of all unrighteousness because of the blood of Christ Jesus, whereby we are justified; made just as if we had never sinned.


JPT

Because I said the only way we are saved is by obeying the Gospel.




JPT

I did not say, "obeying the gospel is foolish", more of passingthrough's lies.

Thank you BillG, this is just more of passingthrough's "nonsense" and twisting peoples words to say what they did not say. Even you know that I would not say such a thing. Be careful or you may fall for his "nonsense"

Thank you and God bless BillG

Yeah, I think I want to ask if it isn't time he moved on? He has said a number of things about what we believe, and very little of it is actually the truth. I wish people would not assume that what we believe is that false opinion of there Pastor, who did not even know what we teach.

I know, it says we would be persecuted as HE was persecuted. Did you get time to read the Doctrinal Statement of Faith that I was so impressed with? That link in is my post #66,173. That is a profound doctrinal statement, and that leaves NO DOUBT what that Church's BELIEFS really are.

For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ, for it is the power of God to salvation for everyone who believes, for the Jew first and also for the Greek. 17 For in it the righteousness of God is revealed from faith to faith; as it is written, “The just shall live by faith.”
Romans 1:16-17

• I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ, for it is the power of God to salvation

JPT

Isaiah 5 : 20-24
20 Woe to those who call evil good and good evil, who put darkness for light and light for darkness, who put bitter for sweet and sweet for bitter.
21 Woe to those who are wise in their own eyes and clever in their own sight.
22 Woe to those who are heroes at drinking wine and champions at mixing drinks,
23 who acquit the guilty for a bribe, but deny justice to the innocent.
24 Therefore, as tongues of fire lick up straw and as dry grass sinks down in the flames, so their roots will decay and their flowers blow away like dust; for they have rejected the law of the LORD Almighty and spurned the word of the Holy One of Israel.


Malachi 3 : 13-18
13 "You have said harsh things against me," says the LORD. "Yet you ask, 'What have we said against you?'
14 "You have said, 'It is futile to serve God. What did we gain by carrying out his requirements and going about like mourners before the LORD Almighty?
15 But now we call the arrogant blessed. Certainly the evildoers prosper, and even those who challenge God escape.'"
16 Then those who feared the LORD talked with each other, and the LORD listened and heard. A scroll of remembrance was written in his presence concerning those who feared the LORD and honored his name.
17 "They will be mine," says the LORD Almighty, "in the day when I make up my treasured possession. I will spare them, just as in compassion a man spares his son who serves him.
18 And you will again see the distinction between the righteous and the wicked, between those who serve God and those who do not.

Mark 7 : 6-13
6 He replied, "Isaiah was right when he prophesied about you hypocrites; as it is written: "'These people honor me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me.
7 They worship me in vain; their teachings are but rules taught by men.'
8 You have let go of the commands of God and are holding on to the traditions of men."
9 And he said to them: "You have a fine way of setting aside the commands of God in order to observe your own traditions!
10 For Moses said, 'Honor your father and your mother,' and, 'Anyone who curses his father or mother must be put to death.'
11 But you say that if a man says to his father or mother: 'Whatever help you might otherwise have received from me is Corban' (that is, a gift devoted to God),
12 then you no longer let him do anything for his father or mother.
13 Thus YOU NULLIFY THE WORD OF GOD by your tradition that you have handed down. And YOU DO MANY THINGS LIKE THAT."

That would be the text book example for Universal Reconciliation.

The doctrine that all people will be ultimately saved whether they believe or not.


Only those who obey the Gospel are saved; born again.

22 Since you have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit in sincere love of the brethren, love one another fervently with a pure heart, 23 having been born again, not of corruptible seed but incorruptible, through the word of God which lives and abides forever, 1 Peter 1:22-23



JPT

Jesus, I beg You to teach us how to LOVE one another through ALl
of our trials and tribulations,.,

Jesus, I beg (placing our faith) You to teach us (God is wisdom) how to LOVE one another (obedience that comes from the Holy Spirit dwelling in you) through ALL
of our trials and tribulations,., (we all fall short of surrendering, and trials and tribulations usually exposes our weakness)

did I see the deeper meaning in the Word?

1 Timothy 1 : 7-11
7 They want to be teachers of the law, but they do not know what they are talking about or what they so confidently affirm.
8 We know that the law is good if one uses it properly.
9 We also know that law is made not for the righteous but for lawbreakers and rebels, the ungodly and sinful, the unholy and irreligious; for those who kill their fathers or mothers, for murderers,
10 for adulterers and perverts, for slave traders and liars and perjurers--and for whatever else is contrary to the sound doctrine
11 that conforms to the glorious gospel of the blessed God, which he entrusted to me.

Isaiah 5 : 20-24
20 Woe to those who call evil good and good evil, who put darkness for light and light for darkness, who put bitter for sweet and sweet for bitter.
21 Woe to those who are wise in their own eyes and clever in their own sight.
22 Woe to those who are heroes at drinking wine and champions at mixing drinks,
23 who acquit the guilty for a bribe, but deny justice to the innocent.
24 Therefore, as tongues of fire lick up straw and as dry grass sinks down in the flames, so their roots will decay and their flowers blow away like dust; for they have rejected the law of the LORD Almighty and spurned the word of the Holy One of Israel.

Revelation 3 : 1-3
1 "To the angel of the church in Sardis write: These are the words of him who holds the seven spirits of God and the seven stars. I know your deeds; you have a reputation of being alive, but YOU ARE DEAD
2 Wake up! Strengthen what remains and is about to die, for I have not found your deeds complete in the sight of my God.
3 Remember, therefore, what you have received and heard; obey it, and repent. But if you do not wake up, I will come like a thief, and you will not know at what time I will come to you.

James 2 : 26
26 As the body without the spirit is DEAD so FAITH WITHOUT WORKS IS DEAD.

WAKE UP!!!!!

From VCO, example of a Church Doctrinal Statement.
https://www.fellowshipforward.org/doctrine.html

Yes I did read it and believe as you do, here is one example maybe some will like to read.

• Sanctification

We believe sanctification, a setting-apart unto God, involves both the work of God and the will of man (Phil. 2:12-13). Sanctification is threefold: positional, progressive, and ultimate. It is positional, for every believer is in Christ and therefore identical with Christ's position before God (1 Cor. 6:11; Col. 3:1-4; Heb. 10:10). We believe, however, that he retains his sin nature (flesh), which cannot be eradicated in this life. Therefore, while the standing of the believer in Christ is perfect, his present state is no more perfect than his experience in daily life. Therefore, a believer experiences progressive sanctification, growing in grace and becoming changed by the unhindered power of the Spirit (John 17:17; Rom. 6:19; 2 Cor. 7:1). Ultimate sanctification will occur when the believer sees the Lord and becomes "like Him" (1 Thess. 5:23; 1 John 2:28-3:3).

Amen wonderful post BillG