Not By Works

The demons believe in god, yet did not obey, you just destroyed your own argument

Man oh man, thank the Lord the Bible isn't literal slot of the time. No wonder legalism attached itself so inseperablly to the truth when you read things like that above. Heck, you'd think you may be damned to hell and an enemy of God to go to the movies or something.
I do know that I do not keep his commandments all the time. I know I enjoy the things of the world sometimes, and I know that even though I do the things I shouldn't, it does not affect my salvation. Nothing will.
I came to give you life, and life more abundantly. You grieve the Spirit you hinder abundance.
I tell you these things so that my peace and joy will remain with you.
You no listen, you no. Have peace and joy. But you always have salvation.

the anti-grace gospel breaks itself down



it is a shame so many pervert the gospel of Christ

but having been on deeply decieved by the doctrine of sinless perfection

i do believe that THEY believe their errors

Here is who Paul wrote the letter to the Romans and addressed:


Paul, a bondservant of Jesus Christ, called to be an apostle, separated to the gospel of God 2 which He promised before through His prophets in the Holy Scriptures, 3 concerning His Son Jesus Christ our Lord, who was born of the seed of David according to the flesh, 4 and declared to be the Son of God with power according to the Spirit of holiness, by the resurrection from the dead. 5 Through Him we have received grace and apostleship for obedience to the faith among all nations for His name, 6 among whom you also are the called of Jesus Christ;

7 To all who are in Rome, beloved of God, called to be saints:
Romans 1:1-7


and again

• but glory, honor, and peace to everyone who works what is good, to the Jew first and also to the Greek. For there is no partiality with God.

5 But in accordance with your hardness and your impenitent heart you are treasuring up for yourself wrath in the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God, 6 who “will render to each one according to his deeds”: 7 eternal life to those who by patient continuance in doing good seek for glory, honor, and immortality; 8 but to those who are self-seeking and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness—indignation and wrath, 9 tribulation and anguish, on every soul of man who does evil, of the Jew first and also of the Greek; 10 but glory, honor, and peace to everyone who works what is good, to the Jew first and also to the Greek. 11 For there is no partiality with God. Romans 2:5-11

• eternal life to those who by patient continuance in doing good seek for glory, honor, and immortality;

JPT

having been*

Observation - Interpretation - Application
A false interpretation = a false application, all of the time.

Hi Mcgee and welcome back from sinless perfectionism. This is why I continually harp on correct "Interpretation." If your interpretation is off then your application, which effects everyday life, will be off. I put this in my signature hoping some my pay head to their false doctrines. There are rules of interpretation that keep us from making false statements.

To trifle with Gods word and misuse its applications is a dark road to be on.

God bless you and welcome back from the abyss.....

Romans3:4
"Not at all! Let God be true, and every human being a liar. As it is written: "So that you may be proved right when you speak and prevail when you judge."

Hi Mcgee and welcome back from sinless perfectionism. This is why I continually harp on correct "Interpretation." If your interpretation is off then your application, which effects everyday life, will be off. I put this in my signature hoping some my pay head to there false doctrines. There are rules of interpretation that keep us from making false statements.

To trifle with Gods word and misuse its applications is a dark road to be on.

God bless you and welcome back from the abyss.....

Romans3:4
"Not at all! Let God be true, and every human being a liar. As it is written: "So that you may be proved right when you speak and prevail when you judge."

Well, there can only be one truth concerning the will of God and his redemptive plan for eternal life. Christ said to know the truth and the truth SHALL set you free. Now if he said that, then the truth must be pretty easygoing to the ear and will.
As a human being, I like things being done for me. I do not like to labor for what I desire. I lik the fact that Christ has totally completed the necessary deeds to secure my eternal salvation. That does set me free.

Obedience and disobedience

Isnt every one of Pauls letters addressed to specifics? I.e., The saints, to the church, to the beloved, called, etc? Never to the general public.

Are we talking 100% obedience here.
As is never sinning at all, as keeping all the commandments Jesus gave whilst on earth?
After all he gave more the the 2 greatest commandments.

If a person stands before God and says "You were 90% obedient and 10% obedient"

What then?

If a person sins, then they need to come before God and confess their sin, and they will be forgiven and cleansed of all unrighteousness.

BillG, TT says even if you get invited and you accept you are not saved. What do you think?

If a person sins, then they need to come before God and confess their sin, and they will be forgiven and cleansed of all unrighteousness.

No it does not mean you are saved and this is true at a wedding procession in our own time today.

Ezekiel 13:9
And my hand shall be on the prophets that see vanity, and that divine lies: they shall not be in the assembly of my people, neither shall they be written in the writing of the house of Israel, neither shall they enter into the land of Israel; and you shall know that I am the Lord GOD.

If Paul taught something other than Gods commands you have to throw him out.
he is a false Prophet.

Even tho I know he did nothing of the sort.
2 Peter 3:15-17
15 Bear in mind that our Lord’s patience means salvation, just as our dear brother Paul also wrote you with the wisdom that God gave him. 16He writes the same way in all his letters, speaking in them of these matters. His letters contain some things that are hard to understand, which ignorant and unstable people distort, as they do the other Scriptures, to their own destruction.

17Therefore, dear friends, since you have been forewarned, be on your guard so that you may not be carried away by the error of the lawless and fall from your secure position.

Why would someone listen to Paul over God or Yeshua(Jesus) anyway?

And for all you ant-Semitics out there if it was not for the Jews keeping the Tenak
We would have nothing!!

romans 4

4 Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt.

5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

6 Even as David also describeth the blessedness of the man, unto whom God imputeth righteousness without works,

7 Saying, Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered.

8 Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin.

9 Cometh this blessedness then upon the circumcision only, or upon the uncircumcision also? for we say that faith was reckoned to Abraham for righteousness.

10 How was it then reckoned? when he was in circumcision, or in uncircumcision? Not in circumcision, but in uncircumcision.

11 And he received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had yet being uncircumcised: that he might be the father of all them that believe, though they be not circumcised; that righteousness might be imputed unto them also:

12 And the father of circumcision to them who are not of the circumcision only, but who also walk in the steps of that faith of our father Abraham, which he had being yet uncircumcised.

13 For the promise, that he should be the heir of the world, was not to Abraham, or to his seed, through the law, but through the righteousness of faith.


praise God!


man the scriptures cut right through these lies and false gospels like butter every time


people can try to twist the word
(usually so blind they actually believe they are correct)


but for those with eyes to see....
the errors are very easy to notice

I'm grateful and thank God everyday for His free gift of salvation. In no way could I ever have done enough on my own to have earned it. No way can I keep it without His eternal seal.

I'm sure TT will explain what he means.

As I said in a previous post I believe everyone is invited to eat a the Lords table.
Not everyone will accept it therefore they are not saved.
Then we have those who seem to accept the invitation, yet when they do all they want is a free meal.

By that I mean they say a sinners prayer but have no intention of changing, they use it as an excuse to sin. Which Paul addressed.
On this point I feel very strongly that discipleship is needed.
What it actually means to be a follower of Jesus.
When I disciple people I do so on the basis of explaining who they are in Jesus, get some proper footings in place.
I do talk about it's not an excuse to sin, that Jesus wants us to be a shining light, do not limit God to what you want but be open to what God wants and so on.
I tell them they have the Holy Spirit in them, the helper, who helps conform us to the image of Jesus.
He speaks truth into our lives, of who we are in Jesus.
He will let us know when we sin, and when we do we have Forgiveness on account of Jesus.

People may disciple in different ways.

People get invited to church, they accept the invitation that doesn't mean they are saved though. They may stay in the church because they like affiliation.

In a sense we only have to look at Judas.
It seemed he accepted Jesus, the invite.
Would you say he was saved?

One thing I know for sure and I endeavour to do is never right anyone off.
To always be willing to walk with them should they need help.
If it is apparent they want to change and grow but are struggling to do so. Walk the walk with them.

If it becomes apparent that they have no desire to change then step back, but I would still say pray for them.

After all we have no idea what God can and will do in a person's life.

What we do need to bear in mind is that for wheat to grow or trees bear fruit is that it takes time.
I used to do the accounts for a farmer.
And he explained the process of cultivation, preparing the ground.
It's a process and hard work.
He said in his 50 years of farming he had never had a 100% crop.
He has always had to remove weeds.

For us to bear fruit, Jesus had to cultivate.
Even then we this side of eternity will never bear 100% fruit.
We also need to bear in mind the following

Mark 4:8
8 But other seed fell on good ground and yielded a crop that sprang up, increased and produced: some thirtyfold, some sixty, and some a hundred.”

So we have good ground with different produce.
But they are all on good ground, or should I say in good ground.

Those are my thoughts.

God bless
Bill (without the G)

The workers for, sinless perfectionists, law keepers, Pharisees and Lawyers cannot grasp these two simple truths.........