GOD'S SABBATH AND THE REAL TRUTH OF COL 2:14-17 WHO DO WE BELIEVE GOD or MAN?

posthuman · Jun 9, 2018

This is my commandment, that you love one another as I have loved you.

(John 15:12)

It does not dishonor others, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs.

(1 Corinthians 13:5)

For what the Law was powerless to do in that it was weakened by the flesh, God did by sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful man, as an offering for sin. He thus condemned sin in the flesh, so that the righteous standard of the Law might be fulfilled in us, who do not live according to the flesh but according to the Spirit. Those who live according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh; but those who live according to the Spirit set their minds on the things of the Spirit.

(Romans 8:3-5)

I do not set aside the grace of God, for if righteousness could be gained through the Law, Christ died for nothing!

(Galatians 2:21)

Studyman · Jun 9, 2018

justpassinthrough said:

I'm not sure how this addresses anything I posted.

Jesus is the High Priest now. Is that not the truth? There are no more Levite Priests to perform duties of the Priesthood which included performing "Works of the Law" for atonement of sins on His Sabbath and also administer God's word's to the People.

He changed the Priesthood didn't He?. We no longer need to rely on God's Word being filtered through carnal man. Each of us have access to His Word and can have a personal relationship with The Christ and His father "apart" from the Priesthood. Why would you want to go back to having man filter God's Word?

When did He say for some man to create a religious franchise, build million dollar buildings, call it a church. Create a business in the name of God that allows franchise members to own multiple million dollar homes and marble toilets. The Pharisees created a business of the Priesthood and Jesus whipped then with a scourge.

This is the New Covenant is it not?

"And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them.

Who in Western Civilization doesn't have access to God's Word? Is this an accident, or fulfillment of the New Covenant Jesus promised?

The New Covenant replaced the Priesthood, changed the Priesthood with God's Word's written directly on our minds. What I posted was the Christ's Words in respect to honoring God through His Instructions He created for mankind for "their own good".

You didn't even address them.

Were we not warned about satan disguising itself as Apostles of Christ and "ministers of Righteousness" to deceive? But how can it deceive us if we live by Every Word of God like Jesus said, and not religious man?

Col. 2:8 Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.

What did the Christ tell me in Isaiah and Jeremiah, and again what did this same Christ tell me in John:

23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.
24 He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings: and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father's which sent me.

After reading how the Mainstream Church of Christ's time had corrupted the Word's of the Christ, why would I return to listening to these religious men when I have the Word which became Flesh in my house, on my desk, in my mind?

I have escaped the deception and hypocrisy of religious man by the mercies of God. Why would I reject the Word's of the Christ and go back to the weak and beggarly elements of religious man?

posthuman · Jun 9, 2018

Then the Lord spoke to Moses, saying,

“Command the sons of Israel and say to them, ‘You shall be careful to present My offering, My food for My offerings by fire, of a soothing aroma to Me, at their appointed time.’ You shall say to them, ‘This is the offering by fire which you shall offer to the Lord: two male lambs one year old without defect as a continual burnt offering every day. You shall offer the one lamb in the morning and the other lamb you shall offer at twilight; also a tenth of an ephah of fine flour for a grain offering, mixed with a fourth of a hin of beaten oil. It is a continual burnt offering which was ordained in Mount Sinai as a soothing aroma, an offering by fire to the Lord. Then the drink offering with it shall be a fourth of a hin for each lamb, in the holy place you shall pour out a drink offering of strong drink to the Lord. The other lamb you shall offer at twilight; as the grain offering of the morning and as its drink offering, you shall offer it, an offering by fire, a soothing aroma to the Lord.

‘Then on the sabbath day two male lambs one year old without defect, and two-tenths of an ephah of fine flour mixed with oil as a grain offering, and its drink offering: This is the burnt offering of every sabbath in addition to the continual burnt offering and its drink offering.

(Numbers 28:1-9)

why two lambs daily, with a grain and a drink offering? why by fire?
how does this testify of Christ?
why two additional lambs with additional grain & drink offerings on sabbaths?
how does this testify of Christ?

this is the sort of thing i think we should be doing on sabbath: looking for Jesus Christ in the scripture.
not engaging in petty little wars, bickering over words, and thinking about the flesh.
i realize that Numbers 28 is probably not going to be discussed here, even though we could probably dive into it for years without exhausting its depths. i realize that it'll probably just get buried, but i wanted to put it anyway. who knows, maybe my pessimism is misplaced

Studyman · Jun 9, 2018

posthuman said:

This is my commandment, that you love one another as I have loved you.

(John 15:12)

1 John 5:2 By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments.
3 For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.

Titus 1:

9 Holding fast the faithful word as he hath been taught, that he may be able by sound doctrine both to exhort and to convince the gainsayers.
10 For there are many unruly and vain talkers and deceivers, specially they of the circumcision

Mainstream church)

11 Whose mouths must be stopped, who subvert whole houses, teaching things which they ought not, (Like Jesus teaches differently than the Word) for filthy lucre's sake.

Heb. 10:4 For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins.

14 For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.

Eph. 4:

22 That ye put off concerning the former conversation the old man, which is corrupt according to the deceitful lusts;

23 And be renewed in the spirit of your mind;
24 And that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness.

25 Wherefore putting away lying, speak every man truth with his neighbour: for we are members one of another.

Heb. 7:11 If therefore perfection were by the Levitical priesthood, (for under it the people received the law,) what further need was there that another priest should rise after the order of Melchisedec, and not be called after the order of Aaron?

posthuman · Jun 9, 2018

Studyman said:

interesting choice of words

. . how turn ye again to the weak and beggarly elements,

whereunto ye desire again to be in bondage?

Ye observe days, and months, and times, and years!

I am afraid of you, lest I have bestowed upon you labour in vain.
(Galatians 4:9-11)

does it say they're observing "the wrong" days? or does it say "days" ?
are we talking about completely human, non-scriptural traditions, or are we talking about the Law?
what's the context?

Tell me, ye that desire to be under the Law, do ye not hear the Law?
(Galatians 4:21)

hmm.

Dan_473 · Jun 9, 2018

posthuman said:

wait a minute, I never thought about that.

The Ten Commandments are usually thought of as the "top" ones.

But one of the 10 is actually set aside to do things related to the levitical priesthood.

Studyman · Jun 9, 2018

="posthuman,

Two identical Lambs. The sacrifice is the same in the morning as it is in the evening. Abel and Abraham's sin is forgiven by the same Sacrifice as the last person whose name is written in the Book of Life.

Meat offering in the morning, drink offering in the evening. (Drink My Blood and Eat My Flesh)

Fire refines and purifies in nature. This represents the testing of our faith and the testing of Christ's faith. It is most Holy.

James 1:1 James, a servant of God and of the Lord Jesus Christ, to the twelve tribes which are scattered abroad, greeting.
2 My brethren, count it all joy when ye fall into divers temptations;
3 Knowing this, that the trying of your faith worketh patience.
4 But let patience have her perfect work, that ye may be perfect and entire, wanting nothing.

1 Peter 1:
6 Wherein ye greatly rejoice, though now for a season, if need be, ye are in heaviness through manifold temptations:
7 That the trial of your faith, being much more precious than of gold that perisheth, though it be tried with fire, might be found unto praise and honour and glory at the appearing of Jesus Christ:

11 I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire:
12 Whose fan is in his hand, and he will throughly purge his floor, and gather his wheat into the garner; but he will burn up the chaff with unquenchable fire.

Fine flour is wheat seeds that have been crushed to no longer resemble their former self, but can now be used for food.

Imagine Jesus being born into a religion that had been hijacked by satan. He studied the Word and followed it with all His Heart, He learned obedience by the things He suffered. But Almost the entire God of Abraham preaching people on the planet had corrupted His Fathers teaching and created religious doctrines from "commandments of men".

He could have "joined them" in their religion. But He didn't, He risked His own well being, and His own Life telling them the truth which was sometimes uncomfortable for them to hear.

They hounded Him, and killed His Friends. Told lies about Him and ultimately convinced themselves to torture and then murder Him as they did those Prophets who came before Him.

3 He is despised and rejected of men; a man of sorrows, and acquainted with grief: and we hid as it were our faces from him; he was despised, and we esteemed him not.
4 Surely he hath borne our griefs, and carried our sorrows: yet we did esteem him stricken, smitten of God, and afflicted.

This is what the reference to flour, and oil beaten finely, and burnt offerings and the such foreshadowed.

It is a fascinating study and most Holy. Surely a good thing to dwell on this Holy Sabbath.

gb9 · Jun 9, 2018

Studyman said:

I know God has cleansed some men, and that eating with unwashed hands wasn't a Law, and didn't defile a man. I also understand that disobedience and rebellion comes from within a man and defiles them. But when did He destroy the difference between what He created for food and what He created for other things? I wish it were so, but I can't find where swine was ever considered clean for food. Not then, not now, and not in the future Isaiah describes.

Did I miss something?

most of the New Testament.

Wall · Jun 9, 2018

posthuman said:

Not talkin bout the law for sure posthuman

GAL.4 [8] Howbeit then, when ye knew not God, ye did service unto them which by nature are no gods.[9] But now, after that ye have known God, or rather are known of God, how turn ye again to the weak and beggarly elements, whereunto ye desire again to be in bondage? [10] YE OBSERVE DAYS, AND MONTHS, AND TIMES, AND YEARS.[11] I am afraid of you, lest I have bestowed upon you labour in vain.

Galatians 4 says nothing about sabbaths or feast days. Its speaking of those who observe times.

DEUT.18 [9] When thou art come into the land which the LORD thy God giveth thee, thou shalt not learn to do after the abominations of those nations.[10] There shall not be found among you any one that maketh his son or his daughter to pass through the fire, or that useth divination, OR AN OBSERVER OF TIMES, or an enchanter, or a witch,[11] Or a charmer, or a consulter with familiar spirits, or a wizard, or a necromancer.

The same thing goes on to this very day. Its speaking of the occult. Those who observe certain days by use of horoscopes?

2 CHR.33 [3] For he built again the high places which Hezekiah his father had broken down, and he reared up altars for Baalim, and made groves, and worshipped all the host of heaven, and served them.[4] Also he built altars in the house of the LORD, whereof the LORD had said, In Jerusalem shall my name be for ever.[5] And he built altars for all the host of heaven in the two courts of the house of the LORD.[6] And he caused his children to pass through the fire in the valley of the son of Hinnom: ALSO HE OBSERVED TIMES, and used enchantments, and used witchcraft, and dealt with a familiar spirit, and with wizards: he wrought much evil in the sight of the LORD, to provoke him to anger

Enchantments, witchcraft, familiar spirits, and wizards. Its speaking of the occult. Not following sabbath days.

LEV.19 [26] Ye shall not eat any thing with the blood: neither shall ye use enchantment, NOR OBSERVE TIMES.[27] Ye shall not round the corners of your heads, neither shalt thou mar the corners of thy beard.[28] Ye shall not make any cuttings in your flesh for the dead, nor print any marks upon you: I am the LORD.[29] Do not prostitute thy daughter, to cause her to be a whore; lest the land fall to whoredom, and the land become full of wickedness.[30] YE SHALL KEEP MY SABBATHS, and reverence my sanctuary: I am the LORD.

I guess this scripture says it all. You shall not observe times BUT you will keep my sabbaths.

Studyman · Jun 9, 2018

posthuman said:

8 Howbeit then, when ye knew not God, ye did service unto them which by nature are no gods.

Rom. 1:21 Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.
22 Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,

9 But now, after that ye have known God, or rather are known of God, how turn ye again to the weak and beggarly elements, whereunto ye desire again to be in bondage?

10 Ye observe days, and months, and times, and years.

For the Pharisees and Jews this might be returning to "Teaching for Doctrines, the Commandments of Men" or "binding heavy burdens and grievous to be borne, and lay them on men's shoulders" that they called "God's Law".

But one thing is absolutely for sure, it wasn't "returning Again" to following the Commandments of a God they didn't know as you and "many" preach.

You seem to hold on to the deception that it is God's Commandments that are the burden of the world. The Bible doesn't teach this, and certainly Paul didn't.

11 I am afraid of you, lest I have bestowed upon you labour in vain.
12 Brethren, I beseech you, be as I am; for I am as ye are: ye have not injured me at all.

1 cor. 5:6 Your glorying is not good. Know ye not that a little leaven leaveneth the whole lump?
7 Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened. For even Christ our passover is sacrificed for us:

8 Therefore let us keep the feast, not with old leaven, neither with the leaven of malice and wickedness; but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth.

beta · Jun 9, 2018

justpassinthrough said:

Observed in the way God originally gave it before the law of Moses was added.

Which is the Sabbath was made for man to rest one day a week.

Is it right for those who work in full time ministry, serving the Church, to work on the Sabbath to has a Church service, to honor a man made command, when the Sabbath was made for man to rest?

Observed in the way God originally gave ? why, what do you mean ? Has not Jesus/Yashua been given all authority in heaven and earth after His resurrection ? we should keep it the way HE teaches in the NT, allowing much more freedom than originally.
Of course it is allowed for Ministers to work on the Sabbath just as we can now do many GOOD works for God !

JPT

Jackson123 · Jun 9, 2018

lightbearer said:

We are to have the Faith of Jesus working in us. We are to be dead nevertheless alive yet not us but Christ living in us. And the life we are to be living is to be by the Faith OF Jesus Christ.

Abraham and John the Baptist are not our examples of what is available to us through GOD's Spirit; Jesus is.
Stop looking for and promoting an excuse for sin.

There is no excuse for sin through Christ.
Through Him we can do all things because He strengthens us.

With the mind set you are proclaiming you set the man of GOD up for a fall immediately. Because It is not of Faith; it is sin from the start.

That is right through Faith.
For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.

And the righteousness which is of faith speaketh on this wise, Say not in thine heart, Who shall ascend into heaven? (that is, to bring Christ (the word; the law) down from above: ) Or, Who shall descend into the deep? (that is, to bring up Christ (the word; the law) again from the dead.) But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach;

For Christ (the word; the Law in our hearts and mouths) is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.
(Rom 1:15-17; 10:6-8, 4)

Do we then make void the Law through Faith? Nay we finally establish it through Christ. Because it is GOD that works in us both to will and do HIS good pleasure. Not us but Christ. He doeth the work because He is the vine and we are the branches. Without Him we can do nothing. But with Him all things are possible!

Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes we were healed. He condemned sin in the flesh that the righteousness of GOD be fulfilled in us that walk after Spirit and not after the flesh.

So go and sin no more lest something worse happen to us. For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning. For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them. For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins, But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries. He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses: Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace? For we know him that hath said, Vengeance belongeth unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people. It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.
(1Pe 2:24; 2Pe 2:20-22; Heb 10:26-31)

Seem to me you believe after accept Jesus, a man will perfect never sin again. The fact is Paul criticized Peter, it tell Peter not perfect

posthuman · Jun 9, 2018

Wall said:

who all observes times?

Speak to the sons of Israel and say to them,

'The LORD'S appointed times which you shall proclaim as holy convocations -- My appointed times are these:
(Leviticus 23:2)

the LORD appoints times.

Is anything too difficult for the LORD? At the appointed time I will return to you, at this time next year, and Sarah will have a son.
(Genesis 18:14)

He does His will in them

When I select an appointed time, it is I who judge with equity.
(Psalm 75:2)

do those who wait for Him observe times?

For the vision is yet for the appointed time; it hastens toward the goal and it will not fail. Though it tarries, wait for it; for it will certainly come, it will not delay.
(Habakkuk 2:3)

He appointed a time:

Again He appoints a certain day, “Today,” saying through David so long afterward, in the words already quoted, “Today, if you hear his voice, do not harden your hearts.”

(Hebrews 4:7)

He made it

This is the day the Lord has made;

we will rejoice and be glad in it.
(Psalm 118:4)

posthuman · Jun 9, 2018

Studyman said:

no,

The accompanying drink offering is to be a quarter of a hin of fermented drink with each lamb. Pour out the drink offering to the Lord at the sanctuary. Offer the second lamb at twilight, along with the same kind of grain offering and drink offering that you offer in the morning.

(Leviticus 28:7-8)

meat, grain, and fermented drink both in the morning and at twilight.
by fire, and poured out.

posthuman · Jun 9, 2018

posthuman said:

doubled on seventh days.

on the first of each month - the new moon appointed time/festival - two bulls, with grain and fermented drink, 3 times the grain and double the fermented drink as the daily offering. and a goat.
a goat for a sin offering. atonement. ((re: vv 11-15))

next in the Law the Passover is described.

Wall · Jun 9, 2018

posthuman said:

Do you hear His voice?

DEUT. 27 [8] And thou shalt write upon the stones all the words of this law very plainly. [9] And Moses and the priests the Levites spake unto all Israel, saying, Take heed, and hearken, O Israel; this day thou art become the people of the Lord thy God . [10] Thou shalt therefore OBEY THE VOICE of the Lord thy God, and DO HIS COMMANDMENTS and his statutes, which I command thee this day.

DEUT. 4 [12] And the Lord spake unto you out of the midst of the fire: ye heard THE VOICE of the words, but saw no similitude; only ye heard a voice. [13] And he declared unto you his covenant, which HE COMMANDED YOU TO PERFORM, EVEN TEN COMMANDMENTS; and he wrote them upon two tables of stone.

The voice...The 10 commandments. No doubt about it

ZEPHANIAH 3 [1] Woe to her that is filthy and polluted, to the oppressing city! [2] SHE OBEYED NOT THE VOICE; she received not correction; she trusted not in the LORD; she drew not near to her God. [3] Her princes within her are ROARING LIONS; her judges are evening WOLVES; they gnaw not the bones till the morrow. [4] Her prophets are light and treacherous persons: her priests have polluted the sanctuary, THEY HAVE DONE VIOLENCE TO THE LAW.

Youll find those lions and wolves mentioned in the new covenant scriptures. The bad guys

JOHN 10 [27] MY SHEEP HEAR MY VOICE, and I know them, and they follow me: [28] And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.

Also Gods sheep shall also hear His “voice”.

HEBREWS 4 [6] Seeing therefore it remaineth that some must enter therein, and they to whom it was first preached entered not in because of unbelief:[7] Again, he limiteth a certain day, saying in David, To day, after so long a time; as it is said, TO DAY IF YE WILL HEAR HIS VOICE, harden not your hearts.

Was this prophecied to happen?

DEUTERONOMY 4 [26] I call heaven and earth to witness against you this day, that ye shall soon utterly perish from off the land whereunto ye go over Jordan to possess it; ye shall not prolong your days upon it, but shall utterly be destroyed. [27] And THE LORD SHALL SCATTER YOU AMONG THE NATIONS, and ye shall be left few in number among the heathen, whither the LORD shall lead you. [28] And there ye shall serve gods, the work of men's hands, wood and stone, which neither see, nor hear, nor eat, nor smell. [29] But if from thence thou shalt seek the LORD thy God, thou shalt find him, if thou seek him with all thy heart and with all thy soul. [30] When thou art in TRIBULATION, and all these things are come upon thee, even in THE LATTER DAYS, if thou turn to the LORD thy God, and shalt be OBEDIENT UNTO HIS VOICE; [31] (For the LORD thy God is a merciful God

he will not forsake thee, neither destroy thee, nor forget the covenant of thy fathers which he sware unto them.

Yup

Studyman · Jun 9, 2018

posthuman said:

Daniel 7:25 And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.

26 But the judgment shall sit, and they shall take away his dominion, to consume and to destroy it unto the end.

27 And the kingdom and dominion, and the greatness of the kingdom under the whole heaven, shall be given to the people of the saints of the most High, whose kingdom is an everlasting kingdom, and all dominions shall serve and obey him.

Studyman · Jun 9, 2018

Wall said:

Beautiful,

Duet 30:
1 And it shall come to pass, when all these things are come upon thee, the blessing and the curse, which I have set before thee, and thou shalt call them to mind among all the nations, whither the LORD thy God hath driven thee,
2 And shalt return unto the LORD thy God, and shalt obey his voice according to all that I command thee this day, thou and thy children, with all thine heart, and with all thy soul;

3 That then the LORD thy God will turn thy captivity, and have compassion upon thee, and will return and gather thee from all the nations, whither the LORD thy God hath scattered thee.

15 See, I have set before thee this day life and good, and death and evil;
16 In that I command thee this day to love the LORD thy God, to walk in his ways, and to keep his commandments and his statutes and his judgments, that thou mayest live and multiply: and the LORD thy God shall bless thee in the land whither thou goest to possess it.

19 I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing: therefore choose life, that both thou and thy seed may live:

Jer. 6:16 Thus saith the LORD, Stand ye in the ways, and see, and ask for the old paths, where is the good way, and walk therein, and ye shall find rest for your souls.

But they said, We will not walk therein.

As it is to this day.

Studyman · Jun 9, 2018

posthuman said:

Yes, you are correct, Same sacrifice and offering in the morning as in the evening.

Studyman · Jun 9, 2018

Dan_473 said:

The Sanctification of the 7th Day came long before Levi?

GOD'S SABBATH AND THE REAL TRUTH OF COL 2:14-17 WHO DO WE BELIEVE GOD or MAN?

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