Its what the word of God informs us . New knowledge has ceased because God is no longer brining any new revelations. The Elect will not be deceived by the lying signs and wonders gospel coming from the father of lies. Because the elect will not go above that which is written. He warns them before time.
Baptism and holy spirit
- Thread starter soberxp
- Start date
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
Its what the word of God informs us . New knowledge has ceased because God is no longer brining any new revelations. The Elect will not be deceived by the lying signs and wonders gospel coming from the father of lies. Because the elect will not go above that which is written. He warns them before time.
New knowledge has ceased because God is no longer bringing any new revelations???? God tells me stuff all the time - driving in my car, he may direct me in another direction to avoid an accident. He lets me know what I should pray for in a given situation in a person's life. He tells me lots of things! In fact, I believe that is what enables me to walk by the Spirit. Sometimes our situations are not directly answered in God's word and therefore, we ask and he speaks to us - revealing to us what we need to do in that situation/circumstance.
What do we do with - "BUT the manifestation of the Spirit is given to all for the common good." . . . Manifestation is NOT the same as a gift. Gifts are given individually - those gifts listed in Romans 12:6-8 are the "distributions" in 1 Cor. 12:4,5 as are the gift ministries listed in Ephesians 4:11,12. No one is saying that there are not gifts for there are many gifts, e.g. some may be gifted in edifying the body, one may be gifted with teaching within the body, one may be gifted in serving the body - But there is a distinction between a manifestation and a gift. A manifestation is a perceptible, outward or visible expression of what we have received inwardly - the gift of holy spirit.
1 Cor. 12 starts out: Now concerning spiritual gifts, brethren, I would not have you ignorant. . . gifts is in italics and therefore added. The word "spiritual" is pneumatikos meaning spiritual things, spiritual matters or things of God. We are not to be ignorant of these things . . . v4 - there are different kinds of gifts but the same Spirit distributing them. There are different kinds of service, but the same Lord. There are different kinds of working, but in all of them and in everyone it is the same God at work (energizing). v4 is speaking of gifts, v5 is speaking of service and v6 is saying that it is God that energizes each. Then v7, the subject changes to "manifestation of the Spirit given to each believer for the common good" and list the manifestations - nine in all.
1 Cor. 12 starts out: Now concerning spiritual gifts, brethren, I would not have you ignorant. . . gifts is in italics and therefore added. The word "spiritual" is pneumatikos meaning spiritual things, spiritual matters or things of God. We are not to be ignorant of these things . . . v4 - there are different kinds of gifts but the same Spirit distributing them. There are different kinds of service, but the same Lord. There are different kinds of working, but in all of them and in everyone it is the same God at work (energizing). v4 is speaking of gifts, v5 is speaking of service and v6 is saying that it is God that energizes each. Then v7, the subject changes to "manifestation of the Spirit given to each believer for the common good" and list the manifestations - nine in all.
If Mark 16:15-20 is not authentic then what else of Mark is not authentic?
What else is also not authentic? Hebrews? James? 1Corinthians?
And if Mark 16:15-20 is not authentic then how can I trust the word of God as being truth?
How can God claim that the scriptures are inspired and Spirit breathed; inerrant?
And in any case many a good Bible scholar have proved that the so-called long ending of Mark is
authentic; is true. God is not a Mormon.
Only unbelievers have a problem with Mark 16:15-20.
What else is also not authentic? Hebrews? James? 1Corinthians?
And if Mark 16:15-20 is not authentic then how can I trust the word of God as being truth?
How can God claim that the scriptures are inspired and Spirit breathed; inerrant?
And in any case many a good Bible scholar have proved that the so-called long ending of Mark is
authentic; is true. God is not a Mormon.
Only unbelievers have a problem with Mark 16:15-20.
I agree that he was using hyperbole in that instance. He did this same thing in another place, where he said it anyone comes preaching some different good news to you, even if it's an angel, don't listen. We don't run with this hyperbole and say that when someone preaches a different gospel it means they are an angel, and neither should we run with his hyperbole in another place and say that men can speak the language of angels.
i it's very odd to see this, where someone makes an odd supposition from one hyperbolic statement and runs w onky with it and insists on it despite having no other witness. You don't know quite what to say to someone who proceeds in that manner with Paul's words...
i it's very odd to see this, where someone makes an odd supposition from one hyperbolic statement and runs w onky with it and insists on it despite having no other witness. You don't know quite what to say to someone who proceeds in that manner with Paul's words...
-
3
- Show all
The same can be said concerning the words cease, vanish and fail..............as well as the fact that the only church that had issues with the aforementioned subject was spiritually immature with some 15 errors......and the fact that when Mark was written the bible as a whole was not COMPLETE.....
-
1
- Show all
I clearly stated that ecstatic utterances are not biblical tongues. You have added to what I have said. I never said that tongues spoken in the body of Christ are pagan. I only stated that pagans spoke in ecstatic utterances. Vain repetitions of ecstatic utterances to be more precise.
I resent that you imply that I am attempting to discredit the Holy Spirit and the word of God.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
I resent that you imply that I am attempting to discredit the Holy Spirit and the word of God.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
-
3
- Show all
It's important to carefully read posts. I am guilty of jumping the gun and have learned to ask a question rather than state what a person is stating. 
I will most often say: do you mean/intend to say thus and thus? Because what I am hearing them to be saying is often not what they are intending to say!
I will most often say: do you mean/intend to say thus and thus? Because what I am hearing them to be saying is often not what they are intending to say!
7
thing is, the Bible does not say 'new knowledge; it says simply 'knowledge'
must knowledge be a revelation? I don't think so. perhaps over spiritualization of things might result in that conclusion
the Bible actually says knowledge will pass away. obviously, it has not passed away
Love never fails. But where there are prophecies, they will cease; where there are tongues, they will be stilled; where there is knowledge, it will pass away. I Cor 13:8
-
1
- Show all
The knowledge spoken of in this verse is the knowledge that Jesus had which caused the Pharisees to wonder. They said how is it that this man letters.
Joh 7:15 And the Jews marvelled, saying, How knoweth this man letters, having never learned?
Luke 12:11 And when they bring you unto the synagogues, and unto magistrates, and powers, take ye no thought how or what thing ye shall answer, or what ye shall say:
12 For the Holy Ghost shall teach you in the same hour what ye ought to say.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
Joh 7:15 And the Jews marvelled, saying, How knoweth this man letters, having never learned?
Luke 12:11 And when they bring you unto the synagogues, and unto magistrates, and powers, take ye no thought how or what thing ye shall answer, or what ye shall say:
12 For the Holy Ghost shall teach you in the same hour what ye ought to say.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
the word ecstatic utterance is not the context of Acts 2 or 1cor chapter 12, 13, and 14. you have said in the past in fact you also have in the past made that very connection . If your were not why bring up pagan practices when they are not in context to the Biblical tongues? I’m sorry you have resentment “Vain repetitions of ecstatic utterances to be more precise.”
Is not what tongues is nor did you come up with that sentence from the Bible. It is clear you formulated and coined that phrase from something other than the Word of God. If you have an opinon of pagan tongues it was not founded in the context of the bible or in the record of all the Holy Spirit has done . I dod nnot think you even know what ecstatic utterances are.
Is not what tongues is nor did you come up with that sentence from the Bible. It is clear you formulated and coined that phrase from something other than the Word of God. If you have an opinon of pagan tongues it was not founded in the context of the bible or in the record of all the Holy Spirit has done . I dod nnot think you even know what ecstatic utterances are.
7
well that is what all cessationists say and apparently you in particular
you find that Jesus has passed? what are you even talking about!
I would say 'good luck' with that explanation but as a believer in Christ, I don't believe in 'luck'
so to what purpose do you disavow what is plainly written? and then confuse with your obscure misuse of quoting Jesus' words regarding the Holy Spirit?
do you have any new objections? this one is worn out and still does not hold water
you find that Jesus has passed? what are you even talking about!
I would say 'good luck' with that explanation but as a believer in Christ, I don't believe in 'luck'
so to what purpose do you disavow what is plainly written? and then confuse with your obscure misuse of quoting Jesus' words regarding the Holy Spirit?
do you have any new objections? this one is worn out and still does not hold water
hyperbole - exaggerated statements or claims not to be taken literally - Why should we take this statement, "Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not charity (love), I am become as sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal" - as being an hyperbole?
Is this the verse you were talking about when you stated "He did this same thing in another place,' 2 Cor. 11:4 - For if he that comes preaches another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or if you receive another spirit, which you have not received, or another gospel, which you have not accepted, you might well bear with . . . This is also an hyperbole?
I don't see where either one is an exaggerated statement nor something that can not be taken literally . . . . just saying.
Is this the verse you were talking about when you stated "He did this same thing in another place,' 2 Cor. 11:4 - For if he that comes preaches another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or if you receive another spirit, which you have not received, or another gospel, which you have not accepted, you might well bear with . . . This is also an hyperbole?
I don't see where either one is an exaggerated statement nor something that can not be taken literally . . . . just saying.
Mt 6:7 But when ye pray, use not vain repetitions, as the heathen do: for they think that they shall be heard for their much speaking.
1Co 14:11 Therefore if I know not the meaning of the voice, I shall be unto him that speaketh a barbarian, and he that speaketh shall be a barbarian unto me.
Since you are convinced I don't know please tell me how you define ecstatic utterances.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
1Co 14:11 Therefore if I know not the meaning of the voice, I shall be unto him that speaketh a barbarian, and he that speaketh shall be a barbarian unto me.
Since you are convinced I don't know please tell me how you define ecstatic utterances.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
well that is what all cessationists say and apparently you in particular
you find that Jesus has passed? what are you even talking about!
I would say 'good luck' with that explanation but as a believer in Christ, I don't believe in 'luck'
so to what purpose do you disavow what is plainly written? and then confuse with your obscure misuse of quoting Jesus' words regarding the Holy Spirit?
do you have any new objections? this one is worn out and still does not hold water
you find that Jesus has passed? what are you even talking about!
I would say 'good luck' with that explanation but as a believer in Christ, I don't believe in 'luck'
so to what purpose do you disavow what is plainly written? and then confuse with your obscure misuse of quoting Jesus' words regarding the Holy Spirit?
do you have any new objections? this one is worn out and still does not hold water
One must keep in mind that the apostles and disciples did not have the benefit of a codified canon at the time they walked on the earth. They had the OT which they were able to use to persuade men that Jesus was the Messiah He claimed to be.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
hyperbole - exaggerated statements or claims not to be taken literally - Why should we take this statement, "Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not charity (love), I am become as sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal" - as being an hyperbole?
Is this the verse you were talking about when you stated "He did this same thing in another place,' 2 Cor. 11:4 - For if he that comes preaches another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or if you receive another spirit, which you have not received, or another gospel, which you have not accepted, you might well bear with . . . This is also an hyperbole?
I don't see where either one is an exaggerated statement nor something that can not be taken literally . . . . just saying.
Is this the verse you were talking about when you stated "He did this same thing in another place,' 2 Cor. 11:4 - For if he that comes preaches another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or if you receive another spirit, which you have not received, or another gospel, which you have not accepted, you might well bear with . . . This is also an hyperbole?
I don't see where either one is an exaggerated statement nor something that can not be taken literally . . . . just saying.
He's basically saying: don't listen to any other gospel from any other man. In fact, even if an angel were to come and preach a different gospel, don't listen.
He uses the same hyperbolic device in the verse you give though. He's basically doing the same thing. Saying if I could speak every language there is on earth - heck, even if I could speak the language of angels, without love, it is useless.
-
1
- Show all
PB, it's like this:
My child acts up and I put him in a chair in the corner and I say: You don't get up until I tell you that you can. I don't care if your hair is on fire, you sit there. In fact, I don't care if a bear comes into the room, you don't move. It's hyperbole. I do not mean for him to think a bear will come into the house or his hair will catch fire.
My child acts up and I put him in a chair in the corner and I say: You don't get up until I tell you that you can. I don't care if your hair is on fire, you sit there. In fact, I don't care if a bear comes into the room, you don't move. It's hyperbole. I do not mean for him to think a bear will come into the house or his hair will catch fire.
-
1
- Show all