J
Loss of salvation???
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ok Cameron
So we BELIEVE
BUT
we do not obey.
God help us.
So,,, what does BELIEVE mean anyway?
What has that got to do with your accusations of me being a liar?
You admit it yourself by saying "I know it's not us" than contradict yourself by saying there "is something we must do".
We are either saved by grace through faith in Christ or you make God a liar as well as yourself.
Ephesians 2:8
For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God,
It is Christ who takes away the consequences of our sin, not you. By the grace of God alone do you enter that sin free place which, is the lord Jesus Christ.
John 1:29
The next day John saw Jesus coming toward him, and said, “Behold! The Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world!
I don't see your name in there Ouch. It wasn't you who hung on the Cross.
When you believe in the Gospel of Jesus Christ it is He who baptizes you into His work, your work is as filthy rags.
Christ's baptism is one with the Spirit, not water. Water has no effect to achieve what is necessary to place you in Christ, it is a supernatural work of the Spirit.
1 Corinthians 12:13
For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body—whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free—and have all been made to drink into one Spirit.
Just because you believe in water baptism and I don't, doesn't make me a liar, that is simply your opinion. I have shown you from God's word how water is past it's due date. Peter agrees. He says our salvation is baptism through the resurrection of Christ 1Pet.3:21 and how are we placed into Christ's resurrection? See above. Salvation is by His work and His work alone.
Now, I wonder if you would like to recant your lie saying I only share my opinions and not the word of God. (post#6754) Anyone with eyes will see I have shared God's word in the majority of my posts.
J
James456
Guest
So what works must we do not to be cut off from Christ, can you tell me?I speak like a man!
I DON'T THINK SO!
No, I wouldn't want to "leave it at that", as it makes the Law of God a matter of pragmatism, and I don't believe that is valid. James even affirms that the Law is a single thing (all that You say we will do, this was the covenant God made with Israel, expanded in the Law and Prophets), and if you break one part, you've broken all of it.
No, if you insist in keeping the commandments as taught by Jesus, this is one of them. And you are on the hook for it. But you are not actually able to keep it. It's a conundrum.
Much love!
Nothing. No more than water baptism does.
But, many Christians will believe anything if it is presented to them in as manner that they will approve of.
For the time will come when people will not put up with sound doctrine.
Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number
of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear.
2 Timothy 4:3 warns that a time will come when people will not tolerate sound teaching and will seek out teachers who tell them
what they want to hear, turning away from the truth.
That verse emphasizes the importance of adhering to sound doctrine and being cautious of false teachings.
J
James456
Guest
I will say this, Jesus reserved his harshest words for the religious who insisted of others what they did not insist of themselves.I speak like a man!
I DON'T THINK SO!
So, I wouldn't personally tell anyone it was bad them not trying to obey each and every command of Christ in the gospels if I wasn't trying to obey them all myself. I would say that would be a bad work
You assume much. I never said we shouldn't obey. You don't seem to be able to distinguish the difference between salvation by grace that produces obedience and salvation by means of obedience. No one is saying we shouldn't obey; only that obedience is a by-product of a heart that has been changed.
J
James456
Guest
So much legalism in this debate. A changed and repentant heart doesnt seem to be the deciding factor for some.
Most of the mafia got baptised, but Im sure it didn't do them any good.
Jesus showed us what really mattered. Though a baptism for the forgiveness of sin was in place when he walked this earth, he forgave people their sins and told them they had received salvation without firstly telling them they must be baptised in water. Their faith he said saved them and a changed heart
It seems for some, God is not allowed to act today as Jesus did when he walked this earth
Most of the mafia got baptised, but Im sure it didn't do them any good.
Jesus showed us what really mattered. Though a baptism for the forgiveness of sin was in place when he walked this earth, he forgave people their sins and told them they had received salvation without firstly telling them they must be baptised in water. Their faith he said saved them and a changed heart
It seems for some, God is not allowed to act today as Jesus did when he walked this earth
My "soft spot button," is activated...
That is going to make me go easy on you...
So nice to see...
(just don't get any tattoos)
I disagree with pretty much everything you have said here except "God can use whatever He wishes to accomplish His purposes". In the case of Christ's baptism, He decided to use the Spirit.
Except that being baptized with water and being baptized with the Spirit are two distinct baptisms, not one. Both John the Baptist and Jesus make this very clear.
Jn.3:5 is not receiving the Holy Spirit, it is being made spiritually alive. It is the Spirit generating our spirit. He is not giving birth to Himself.
His command to immerse others in the fullness of God can be applied though accurate and complete teaching of the Godhead. To baptize means to be in complete identification with, it does not necessarily involve water.
No, we don't see water baptism in all cases of Acts. Many places it is assumed and not directly stated.
Cornelius was already reborn (spiritually alive) before Peter arrived which is why God visited Cornelius. What Cornelius needed was to be made part of Christ's body, that was something new and never seen before. The Spirit falling on them was the sign he was now a part of Christ and in His church (body). 1Cor.12:13
That obedience to water baptism is clear, is your opinion for if it were as clear as you say there would be no argument.
See post 6968,, where you said this:
Ive already responded to that twice. The people who will love God the most are those who know their righteousness is faith in Christ, not obeying the law, not works. People who know they have a free salvation. What do you think will then follow because they love God greatly? What Jesus desires!
What you're saying is that our righteousness comes from faith in Christ
NOT obeying the Law (whatever you might mean by that)
and
NOT works. (which is what Jesus taught that we are to do---ACT on His words...Matthew 7)
So what does righteousness by faith in Christ mean if we don't do what He taught??
How are we RIGHT WITH GOD (righteousness) if we do NOT do what Jesus taught?
LOLMy "soft spot button," is activated...
That is going to make me go easy on you...
So nice to see...
(just don't get any tattoos)
What me a tatoo??
Heavens no!
J
James456
Guest
We are righteous apart from works of the law/works, and that brings far better obedience!!
1 Cor 5:5
deliver such a one to Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that his spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.
1 Cor 3:15
If anyone’s work is burned up, he will suffer loss; but he himself will be saved, yet only so as through fire.
J
James456
Guest
I will give you an example, you said it was bad if I did not try and obey each and every command of Christ in the gospels. It seems it turns out you do not try and obey them all. My conscience would not let me be like that
Yea that’s the problem with teaching works. No one can ever give an answer to how many.
Any nice thing you do for God is a work.
Jesus said to do good deeds [and not bad deeds].
This is how we serve God.
By offering everything we do for God.
Matthew 5:16
16In the same way, let your light shine before others, so that they may see your good works and give glory to your Father who is in heaven.
Colossians 3:23-25
. 23 Whatever you do, do your work [y]heartily, as for the Lord and not for people,
24 knowing that it is from the Lord that you will receive the reward [z]of the inheritance. It is the Lord Christ whom you serve.
25 For the one who does wrong will receive the consequences of the wrong which he has done, and [aa]that without partiality.
Romans 6:16
16 Do you not know that the one to whom you present yourselves as slaves for obedience, you are slaves of that same one whom you obey, either of sin [r]resulting in death, or of obedience.