The Kerygma - God's Requirement for Salvation
- Thread starter GWH
- Start date
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
What do you preach regarding those who never had the opportunity to hear about Jesus?
"Him" had the opportunity to know Jesus. Is asking yourself what I asked too disconcerting or what?
Your answer contradicts GW, which indicates that those who have never heard of Jesus (which includes everyone living B.C. and millions of people who have lived A.D.) are included in the world God loves (John 3:16, 1John 4:7-12, Rom. 5:8, Matt. 5:44&48, Gal. 5:6&14, Eph. 3:17b-19, Eph. 5:2 and 1Tim. 2:3-4 ) and wants to be saved (2Tim. 2:3-4, Ezek. 33:11), so He must provide an opportunity. God’s just judgment is illustrated by Jesus in the Parable of the Talents (Matt. 25:14-29), which indicates that God will judge souls on the basis of the truth (Word = Christ per John 1:1f.) they have received.
God/Christ may be encountered via general revelation, which includes meditating on the natural world or God’s supernatural work and moral conscience. God’s eternal power and divine nature (love) are manifested by creation (Rom. 1:20), and a proto-gospel has been proclaimed to everyone under heaven implicitly or in pre-NT foreshadowings (Col. 1:23, Rom. 10:13-18, Gal. 3:8). Also, all normal humans have an inner conscience or “common” sense (Rom. 2:14-16), which manifests morality (the Golden Rule) or a moral Authority in every culture. Thus, sinners have no excuse for not seeking God’s salvation or being truthseekers (Matthew 7:7, Hebrews 11:6).
Interaction between God and humans begins primitively when selfish but innocent babies attain the stage of moral accountability or conscience (normally about the stage of pre-pubescence), comparable to when Adam and Eve became aware it was wrong to eat from the forbidden tree (Gen. 2:17). At this stage a soul’s relationship with God begins in an impersonal way when the person exercises God’s seeking grace to becomes a truthseeker, because God’s Spirit is Truth (1John 5:6) and seeking salvation satisfies the command of Jesus regarding saving faith (Matt. 7:7), although the sinner does not know it (Rom. 1:17)
As a truthseeker at any time in history contemplates creation, Paul indicates that they will be able to discern God’s being and loving will in nature (Rom. 1:20, 2:14-15, Gal. 5:14) by means of what theologians call general revelation. When they realize that God has a moral requirement, if they worship Him they become like Abraham, and the relationship with God becomes personal (Rom. 4:1-25). Presumably God provides such believers the opportunity to learn the proto-gospel, so they may repent of sin and accept the pre-incarnate sacrifice of Christ, whether in the form of Abraham’s ram (Gen. 22:13) or Moses’ lamb (Exo. 12:21).
Of course, partial knowledge of God’s Word limits a person’s ability to cooperate with His HS, so there is a need for evangelism and learning the full Gospel (Matt. 28:19-20), so souls may choose to accept Jesus as Christ.
Can you discern which answer is better?
Your understanding of both GW & English is flawed. Neither Paul nor I said there is a way of being saved apart from Jesus.
Here is what I and AI say:
"In the writings of Paul, the "proto-gospel" is not a specific, distinct message, but rather the Old Testament foundation for the full gospel of Jesus Christ that Paul preached. Paul viewed his message as the fulfillment of promises God made in the Holy Scriptures long before the time of Christ."
Bingo! That is what is meant by Paul when he indicates that those who have never heard of Jesus (which includes everyone living B.C. and millions of people who have lived A.D.) are included in the world God loves (John 3:16, 1John 4:7-12, Rom. 5:8, Matt. 5:44&48, Gal. 5:6&14, Eph. 3:17b-19, Eph. 5:2 and 1Tim. 2:3-4 ) and wants to be saved (2Tim. 2:3-4, Ezek. 33:11), so He must provide an opportunity. God’s just judgment is illustrated by Jesus in the Parable of the Talents (Matt. 25:14-29), which indicates that God will judge souls on the basis of the truth (Word = Christ per John 1:1f.) they have received.
God/Christ may be encountered via general revelation, which includes meditating on the natural world or God’s supernatural work and moral conscience. God’s eternal power and divine nature (love) are manifested by creation (Rom. 1:20), and a proto-gospel has been proclaimed to everyone under heaven implicitly or in pre-NT foreshadowings (Col. 1:23, Rom. 10:13-18, Gal. 3:8). Also, all normal humans have an inner conscience or “common” sense (Rom. 2:14-16), which manifests morality (the Golden Rule) or a moral Authority in every culture. Thus, sinners have no excuse for not seeking God’s salvation or being truthseekers (Matthew 7:7, Hebrews 11:6).
Interaction between God and humans begins primitively when selfish but innocent babies attain the stage of moral accountability or conscience (normally about the stage of pre-pubescence), comparable to when Adam and Eve became aware it was wrong to eat from the forbidden tree (Gen. 2:17). At this stage a soul’s relationship with God begins in an impersonal way when the person exercises God’s seeking grace to becomes a truthseeker, because God’s Spirit is Truth (1John 5:6) and seeking salvation satisfies the command of Jesus regarding saving faith (Matt. 7:7), although the sinner does not know it (Rom. 1:17)
As a truthseeker at any time in history contemplates creation, Paul indicates that they will be able to discern God’s being and loving will in nature (Rom. 1:20, 2:14-15, Gal. 5:14) by means of what theologians call general revelation. When they realize that God has a moral requirement, if they worship Him they become like Abraham, and the relationship with God becomes personal (Rom. 4:1-25). Presumably God provides such believers the opportunity to learn the proto-gospel, so they may repent of sin and accept the pre-incarnate sacrifice of Christ, whether in the form of Abraham’s ram (Gen. 22:13) or Moses’ lamb (Exo. 12:21).
Of course, partial knowledge of God’s Word limits a person’s ability to cooperate with His HS, so there is a need for evangelism and learning the full Gospel (Matt. 28:19-20), so souls may choose to accept Jesus as Christ.
No, that's not what he meant. There is no other way except through Christ. You are preaching a false alternate way of salvation apart from Christ.
"But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach to you a gospel contrary to the one we preached to you, let him be accursed. As we have said before, so now I say again: If anyone is preaching to you a gospel contrary to the one you received, let him be accursed." -- Gal 1:8-9
There is a problem here and moral requirements do not result in salvation.
It is not good behavior that is the answer to anything because human nature is not good.
Our salvation before Jesus or after Jesus is always fully determined by God alone.
It is the calling on God because of your fallen, selfish nature, that is the kernel of salvation.
Both before Jesus and after Jesus our salvation is beyond ourselves,