Acts 2:38 Comparison: Evangelical vs. Oneness / Baptismal-Regeneration View

[LightBearer316]

I have never heard Oneness believers claim the act of water baptism itself being the congruent connection to receive the Holy Ghost until reading this thread. A lot of misconception within this thread. And Wansvic might be Oneness but his beliefs don't align to the majority of those I am familiar with that proclaim Oneness or Manifestations of the One True Triune God.

Brother, I appreciate your input — but to be clear, classic Oneness Pentecostalism (especially as taught by the United Pentecostal Church International, UPCI) absolutely does teach that water baptism in Jesus’ name and receiving the Holy Ghost evidenced by tongues are both required for salvation.

That’s the foundation of their doctrine from Acts 2:38 KJV — they see baptism as part of the “new birth” process, not as a post-salvation symbol. So when someone like Wansvic says remission of sins occurs “through” water baptism and that Spirit reception is a separate but equally necessary experience, that is textbook Oneness theology.

Mainstream Pentecostals — and all historic Protestant traditions — distinguish sharply between faith as the cause of salvation and baptism as the confession of it. That’s why Peter later said plainly:

“Whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins.” — Acts 10:43 (KJV)​

If baptism or tongues were essential steps to complete salvation, that verse couldn’t stand as written.

Grace and peace — always in His Word.

 

[LightBearer316]

I have never heard Oneness believers claim the act of water baptism itself being the congruent connection to receive the Holy Ghost until reading this thread. A lot of misconception within this thread. And Wansvic might be Oneness but his beliefs don't align to the majority of those I am familiar with that proclaim Oneness or Manifestations of the One True Triune God.

Many who hold Oneness or UPCI-style views are very cautious (some would say sneaky or evasive) about revealing what they really believe — especially in mixed Christian forums or churches that uphold the Trinity and salvation by grace through faith alone.

How They Often Operate (Quietly at First)

1. They use familiar Christian language — “faith,” “grace,” “Holy Spirit,” “born again” — but redefine those terms subtly.
   • For example, when they say “salvation by faith”, they actually mean “faith that leads to baptism in Jesus’ name and speaking in tongues.”
2. They avoid mentioning the Trinity early on.
   • Many will claim “We believe in the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit”, but leave out that they see those as roles or manifestations of Jesus, not distinct coequal Persons.
3. They present Acts 2:38 as the “full gospel.”
   • Instead of saying outright that baptism and tongues are required for salvation, they say things like “That’s just the pattern of the early church” or “We just follow what Peter preached.”
4. They accuse others of misunderstanding or misrepresenting them.
   • When confronted, they’ll often pivot to “You’re misreading me — I’m not saying baptism itself saves, I’m saying God saves through baptism.”
   • That’s a linguistic dodge. The core belief — that salvation isn’t complete until baptism — stays intact.
5. They often play the “unity card.”
   • When pressed on doctrine, they’ll say things like “We should focus on what unites us, not divide over details”, but then continue spreading their theology in subtle ways.

Why This Matters

It’s not just semantics — it’s a different gospel (Galatians 1:6–9).
Their teaching makes salvation conditional on human obedience (baptism, tongues, specific formula) rather than the finished work of Christ received by faith. That’s why you’ll notice their posts often blur grace, twist “context,” and overplay Acts while underplaying the epistles.

Grace and Peace

 

[Wansvic]

...

“And his name through faith in his name hath made this man strong.” — Acts 3:16 KJV​

The man was healed by faith in His name, not by water.​

...

"And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.
He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;
They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover. (Mark 16:15-18)

Jesus says ask anything in my name and I will do it. (John 14:14)


What does the entire Acts 3 account reveal?
Then Peter said, Silver and gold have I none; but such as I have give I thee: In the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth rise up and walk.
And he took him by the right hand, and lifted him up: and immediately his feet and ankle bones received strength.

And he leaping up stood, and walked, and entered with them into the temple, walking, and leaping, and praising God.
And all the people saw him walking and praising God:
And they knew that it was he which sat for alms at the Beautiful gate of the temple: and they were filled with wonder and amazement at that which had happened unto him.
And as the lame man which was healed held Peter and John, all the people ran together unto them in the porch that is called Solomon's, greatly wondering.
And when Peter saw it, he answered unto the people, Ye men of Israel, why marvel ye at this? or why look ye so earnestly on us, as though by our own power or holiness we had made this man to walk?
The God of Abraham, and of Isaac, and of Jacob, the God of our fathers, hath glorified his Son Jesus; whom ye delivered up, and denied him in the presence of Pilate, when he was determined to let him go.
But ye denied the Holy One and the Just, and desired a murderer to be granted unto you;
And killed the Prince of life, whom God hath raised from the dead; whereof we are witnesses.

16 And his name through faith in his name hath made this man strong, whom ye see and know: yea, the faith which is by him hath given him this perfect soundness in the presence of you all.

 

[LightBearer316]

I have never heard Oneness believers claim the act of water baptism itself being the congruent connection to receive the Holy Ghost until reading this thread. A lot of misconception within this thread. And Wansvic might be Oneness but his beliefs don't align to the majority of those I am familiar with that proclaim Oneness or Manifestations of the One True Triune God.

The core dynamic of baptismal-regeneration or Oneness teaching can be expressly pronounced below;

“Often, they build their entire framework around baptism as the instrument of salvation. So no matter how many verses you show about faith preceding baptism, they’ll circle back to make baptism the saving act rather than the sign of salvation.”

That’s exactly what happens. Their system is built on the assumption that baptism causes salvation — so every passage is reinterpreted to preserve that foundation. Even when faced with clear verses showing faith preceding baptism (Acts 10:43-47 KJV; Ephesians 1:13 KJV; Romans 10:9-10 KJV), they always “circle back” to make baptism the instrument of grace instead of the evidence of grace.


Labeling it a heretical view is also theologically sound, since it:

• Denies salvation by grace through faith alone (Ephesians 2:8-9 KJV).
• Adds a work (baptism) as a condition for justification.
• Reinterprets the gospel in Acts 2:38 KJV as a formula rather than a proclamation of faith.

Grace and Peace

 

[LightBearer316]

"And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.
He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;
They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover. (Mark 16:15-18)

Jesus says ask anything in my name and I will do it. (John 14:14)


What does the entire Acts 3 account reveal?
Then Peter said, Silver and gold have I none; but such as I have give I thee: In the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth rise up and walk.
And he took him by the right hand, and lifted him up: and immediately his feet and ankle bones received strength.

And he leaping up stood, and walked, and entered with them into the temple, walking, and leaping, and praising God.
And all the people saw him walking and praising God:
And they knew that it was he which sat for alms at the Beautiful gate of the temple: and they were filled with wonder and amazement at that which had happened unto him.
And as the lame man which was healed held Peter and John, all the people ran together unto them in the porch that is called Solomon's, greatly wondering.
And when Peter saw it, he answered unto the people, Ye men of Israel, why marvel ye at this? or why look ye so earnestly on us, as though by our own power or holiness we had made this man to walk?
The God of Abraham, and of Isaac, and of Jacob, the God of our fathers, hath glorified his Son Jesus; whom ye delivered up, and denied him in the presence of Pilate, when he was determined to let him go.
But ye denied the Holy One and the Just, and desired a murderer to be granted unto you;
And killed the Prince of life, whom God hath raised from the dead; whereof we are witnesses.

16 And his name through faith in his name hath made this man strong, whom ye see and know: yea, the faith which is by him hath given him this perfect soundness in the presence of you all.

Wansvic now is doing here is classic Oneness proof-text layering.
He’s piling verses with “in My name” or “in the name of Jesus” (Mark 16, Acts 3, John 14) to make it sound like there’s a single uniform “power formula” where invoking the name of Jesus activates divine results — whether healing or salvation.

That’s a category mistake. The phrase “in My name” in Scripture means by My authority — not by pronouncing certain words. And Acts 3:16 makes that plain: “faith in His name” healed the man, not the utterance of the name itself.

, thank you for bringing those passages together — but the pattern in Scripture isn’t a formula to invoke; it’s faith in the Person and authority the name represents.

In Acts 3, Peter explains exactly what happened:

“And his name through faith in his name hath made this man strong.” — Acts 3:16 (KJV)​

It wasn’t the spoken phrase “in the name of Jesus” that healed him; it was faith in Jesus Himself. That’s the same truth behind salvation — the name represents His authority and finished work, not a ritual word sequence or act.​

Mark 16’s phrase “He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved” mirrors the same order — belief first, baptism following as obedience. The condemnation falls on unbelief, not on lack of baptism (“he that believeth not shall be damned”).

And when Jesus said, “If ye shall ask any thing in my name, I will do it” (John 14:14 KJV), He wasn’t prescribing a phrase to recite, but inviting believers to pray under His authority and in harmony with His will.

So yes — everything is done in His name because He alone has the authority to save and to heal. But the power lies in the Person behind the name, not in the physical act or spoken formula.

Grace and peace — always in His Word.

 

[Wansvic]

Wansvic just revealed his core position clearly: He separates baptism and Spirit reception but still makes baptism a condition for remission of sins, which is classic Oneness Pentecostal theology (baptismal regeneration + tongues as the evidence of Spirit baptism), and other Oneness circles teach.
Here’s the key part of Wansvic’s post that signals it clearly:

“After sharing the truth regarding the need to believe in Jesus, and baptizing them in His name, Paul laid hands on the 12 Ephesians and they received the Holy Ghost as evidenced by speaking in tongues and prophesying. I believe scripture reveals the sealing with the Holy Ghost and the initial infilling is one in the same experience.”​

That line shows several things unmistakably:

1. He equates “receiving the Holy Ghost” with the Acts 2 / Acts 19 pattern — tongues as proof.
   
   “As evidenced by speaking in tongues and prophesying.”
   That’s classic Oneness Pentecostal doctrine: the Spirit’s presence is not confirmed until tongues appear.​
2. He rejects the idea of being sealed with the Spirit at belief (Ephesians 1:13) and instead redefines “sealing” as the later “infilling” moment accompanied by tongues.
3. He ties this to rebirth and salvation — by citing John 3:3–5 and Mark 16:15–16, he’s saying water baptism and Spirit baptism (tongues evidence) together equal being “born again.”

So yes — even though he didn’t say “tongues are the evidence of the Holy Spirit” outright, his wording is the textbook phrasing used in United Pentecostal Church International (UPCI) and other Oneness circles that teach tongues as the initial evidence of the Holy Ghost.

The United Pentecostal Church International (UPCI) and other Oneness Pentecostal groups are outside the bounds of historic Protestant orthodoxy — both doctrinally and historically.
Origin and Background

• The UPCI arose from a split within early Pentecostalism in the early 20th century (around 1913–1916).
• Mainstream Pentecostals (like the Assemblies of God) rejected their theology as heretical and expelled Oneness ministers from their ranks.
• The key issue was their denial of the Trinity and the introduction of “Jesus’ Name” baptismal formula — both departures from historic Christian doctrine.

Core Doctrinal Differences
View attachment 281256

How Protestants View Oneness Pentecostalism

Mainline Protestant and Evangelical denominations (Baptist, Lutheran, Methodist, Reformed, etc.) consider Oneness theology to be non-Trinitarian and heretical — closer to ancient modalism (Sabellianism) than to biblical Christianity.

• The Assemblies of God (AG) officially condemned Oneness doctrine in 1916.
• Scholars and theologians across Protestantism classify the UPCI as a sect or pseudo-Christian movement, not within the bounds of orthodoxy.

Basically:

• Oneness Pentecostalism = non-Trinitarian + baptismal regeneration + tongues as required evidence.
• It uses biblical terms but redefines them in ways that contradict historic Christian teaching.
• That’s why most Protestants (and Catholics, for that matter) view it as outside orthodox Christianity, despite its use of Christian vocabulary.

I appreciate the clarification — but that’s still two steps Scripture never separates. You’ve placed remission of sins in baptism and the Spirit after baptism, yet the apostles consistently taught that both forgiveness and the Spirit are received the moment of faith.

Paul’s “word of truth” in Ephesians 1:13 KJV isn’t Acts 19 KJV — it’s the gospel itself:

“In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that Holy Spirit of promise.”​

That’s a single, unified event — belief → sealing. No ritual in between.

Acts 19 describes twelve men who had only known John’s baptism — an outdated, pre-cross message of repentance. Paul explained Christ’s finished work, they believed, and then the Spirit came. It’s not a “formula”; it’s a correction.

If remission only occurs after baptism, grace is no longer grace — it becomes a transaction. Scripture never presents God’s mercy as something earned through compliance, but as a gift received by faith (Romans 3:28 KJV; 4:5; 11:6 KJV).

Yes, baptism is commanded — but as testimony, not as the trigger of forgiveness. The Spirit is not “at God’s discretion in accordance with His purposes” after our obedience; He’s given immediately to all who believe (Galatians 3:2 KJV).

Grace and peace — always in His Word.

God's grace is seen in His willingness to provide a way of salvation even though man did not deserve it.

Actually Acts 19 reveals the Holy Ghost is not automatically received upon belief. The 12 men believed in Jesus, were water baptized in His name, and when Paul laid hands upon them they received the Holy Ghost.

 

[LightBearer316]

I have never heard Oneness believers claim the act of water baptism itself being the congruent connection to receive the Holy Ghost until reading this thread. A lot of misconception within this thread. And Wansvic might be Oneness but his beliefs don't align to the majority of those I am familiar with that proclaim Oneness or Manifestations of the One True Triune God.

Another major heresy, I've called out on the Christian Chat forum that usually comes from a small but vocal group sometimes called hyper-dispensationalists or Acts 28 dispensationalists.
The “Two Gospels” Error

These teachers claim:

• Peter preached a “gospel of the kingdom” to the Jews (faith + works + baptism).
• Paul preached a separate “gospel of grace” to the Gentiles.
• Therefore, what Peter taught in Acts 2 no longer applies today.

That idea collapses under Scripture itself.

What the Bible Actually Teaches

1. One gospel, one Savior, one faith.
   
   “There is one body, and one Spirit… one Lord, one faith, one baptism.” — Ephesians 4:4-5 KJV​
2. Peter and Paul preached the same Christ.
   
   “We believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved, even as they.” — Acts 15:11 KJV
   (Peter said this at the Jerusalem Council — showing unity, not division.)​
3. Paul confirmed his gospel with the other apostles.
   
   “They saw that the gospel of the uncircumcision was committed unto me, as the gospel of the circumcision was unto Peter.” — Galatians 2:7 KJV
   Two audiences, not two messages — same gospel, different mission fields.​
4. Paul warned against inventing “another gospel.”
   
   “Though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel… let him be accursed.” — Galatians 1:8-9 KJV​

The Unified Message

From Peter to Paul, from Pentecost to Philippi, the message never changed:
Salvation by grace through faith in Christ’s death and resurrection.
Baptism, obedience, and good works follow as testimony — not as alternate gospels.

The claim that Peter and Paul preached two different gospels is pure heresy. Scripture makes it clear there’s only one gospel, one faith, one Lord (Ephesians 4:5 KJV). Peter himself said, ‘We believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved, even as they’ (Acts 15:11 KJV). Paul confirmed the same message, not a new one (Galatians 2:7 KJV). Different audiences, same gospel — salvation by grace through faith in Christ alone. Anything else is ‘another gospel,’ which Paul condemns in Galatians 1:8-9 KJV.

Grace and Peace

 

[LightBearer316]

Just pointing out the obvious here but Acts 2:38 you receive the Holy Ghost which means you are saved. Unless I don't understand the purpose of this thread but being Saved and receiving the Holy Ghost seems to be the sole objective for the Christian.

False teachings like Oneness theology, baptismal regeneration, and the “two-gospel” heresy are especially dangerous because they sound biblical on the surface — quoting Scripture out of context — and young believers often can’t yet tell the difference between a verse being used and a verse being interpreted rightly.

Here’s what’s really happening:

• Babes in Christ (1 Cor. 3:1–2; Heb. 5:12–14) are hungry to grow, but they’re still learning how to rightly divide the Word.
• When heretics twist Scripture cleverly — like claiming “Peter preached water salvation” or “Paul had a different gospel” — it plants confusion and discouragement.
• That’s exactly why Paul repeatedly warned the church:
  
  “That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine.” — Ephesians 4:14 (KJV)​

My concern isn’t about ‘winning arguments’ — it’s about protecting babes in Christ. False doctrines like Oneness theology and the ‘two-gospel’ theory confuse new believers and twist Scripture into systems God never taught. We’re told to speak the truth in love (Eph 4:14-15), helping believers grow stable in sound doctrine — not tossed to and fro by clever distortions. Christ’s gospel is one message: grace through faith in His finished work.

Grace and Peace

 

[Wansvic]

Wansvic just revealed his core position clearly: He separates baptism and Spirit reception but still makes baptism a condition for remission of sins, which is classic Oneness Pentecostal theology (baptismal regeneration + tongues as the evidence of Spirit baptism), and other Oneness circles teach.
Here’s the key part of Wansvic’s post that signals it clearly:

“After sharing the truth regarding the need to believe in Jesus, and baptizing them in His name, Paul laid hands on the 12 Ephesians and they received the Holy Ghost as evidenced by speaking in tongues and prophesying. I believe scripture reveals the sealing with the Holy Ghost and the initial infilling is one in the same experience.”​

That line shows several things unmistakably:

1. He equates “receiving the Holy Ghost” with the Acts 2 / Acts 19 pattern — tongues as proof.
   
   “As evidenced by speaking in tongues and prophesying.”
   That’s classic Oneness Pentecostal doctrine: the Spirit’s presence is not confirmed until tongues appear.​
2. He rejects the idea of being sealed with the Spirit at belief (Ephesians 1:13) and instead redefines “sealing” as the later “infilling” moment accompanied by tongues.
3. He ties this to rebirth and salvation — by citing John 3:3–5 and Mark 16:15–16, he’s saying water baptism and Spirit baptism (tongues evidence) together equal being “born again.”

So yes — even though he didn’t say “tongues are the evidence of the Holy Spirit” outright, his wording is the textbook phrasing used in United Pentecostal Church International (UPCI) and other Oneness circles that teach tongues as the initial evidence of the Holy Ghost.

The United Pentecostal Church International (UPCI) and other Oneness Pentecostal groups are outside the bounds of historic Protestant orthodoxy — both doctrinally and historically.
Origin and Background

• The UPCI arose from a split within early Pentecostalism in the early 20th century (around 1913–1916).
• Mainstream Pentecostals (like the Assemblies of God) rejected their theology as heretical and expelled Oneness ministers from their ranks.
• The key issue was their denial of the Trinity and the introduction of “Jesus’ Name” baptismal formula — both departures from historic Christian doctrine.

Core Doctrinal Differences
View attachment 281256

How Protestants View Oneness Pentecostalism

Mainline Protestant and Evangelical denominations (Baptist, Lutheran, Methodist, Reformed, etc.) consider Oneness theology to be non-Trinitarian and heretical — closer to ancient modalism (Sabellianism) than to biblical Christianity.

• The Assemblies of God (AG) officially condemned Oneness doctrine in 1916.
• Scholars and theologians across Protestantism classify the UPCI as a sect or pseudo-Christian movement, not within the bounds of orthodoxy.

Basically:

• Oneness Pentecostalism = non-Trinitarian + baptismal regeneration + tongues as required evidence.
• It uses biblical terms but redefines them in ways that contradict historic Christian teaching.
• That’s why most Protestants (and Catholics, for that matter) view it as outside orthodox Christianity, despite its use of Christian vocabulary.

I appreciate the clarification — but that’s still two steps Scripture never separates. You’ve placed remission of sins in baptism and the Spirit after baptism, yet the apostles consistently taught that both forgiveness and the Spirit are received the moment of faith.

Paul’s “word of truth” in Ephesians 1:13 KJV isn’t Acts 19 KJV — it’s the gospel itself:

“In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that Holy Spirit of promise.”​

That’s a single, unified event — belief → sealing. No ritual in between.

Acts 19 describes twelve men who had only known John’s baptism — an outdated, pre-cross message of repentance. Paul explained Christ’s finished work, they believed, and then the Spirit came. It’s not a “formula”; it’s a correction.

If remission only occurs after baptism, grace is no longer grace — it becomes a transaction. Scripture never presents God’s mercy as something earned through compliance, but as a gift received by faith (Romans 3:28 KJV; 4:5; 11:6 KJV).

Yes, baptism is commanded — but as testimony, not as the trigger of forgiveness. The Spirit is not “at God’s discretion in accordance with His purposes” after our obedience; He’s given immediately to all who believe (Galatians 3:2 KJV).

Grace and peace — always in His Word.

You said,
"I appreciate the clarification — but that’s still two steps Scripture never separates. You’ve placed remission of sins in baptism and the Spirit after baptism, yet the apostles consistently taught that both forgiveness and the Spirit are received the moment of faith."

Scripture confirms the truth.

The 120 in the upper room believed in Jesus well before they received the Holy Ghost and were water baptized in the name of Jesus. (Acts 2)
Paul's question in Acts 19 indicates the Holy Ghost is not automatically received when people believe. (Acts 19:1-7)
The Samaritans did not receive the Holy Ghost until days after believing in Jesus. (Acts 8:12-18)

Detailed conversion accounts indicate some believers receive the Holy Ghost before and sometimes after being water baptized in the name of Jesus.

 

[Wansvic]

This is another classic Oneness pivot from Wansvic: he’s insisting that because baptism is performed “in the name of Jesus,” the power of salvation must therefore occur in the act of baptism. But that’s a category error. If only you could get past your Oneness indoctrination, you could see the truth.

Brother, I don’t disagree that every baptism in Acts was performed in the name of Jesus — but that doesn’t mean the act itself caused forgiveness. Scripture connects salvation to the authority of His name, not to the ceremony that bears it.

When Peter said,

“Through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins” — Acts 10:43 KJV,​

he made faith in Christ the channel of remission — not the moment of water baptism.​

Even the examples you listed show that baptism followed belief. In Acts 10 KJV, for instance, the Gentiles received the Holy Spirit first while Peter was still preaching (v. 44–47). Peter then commanded baptism — not to get forgiveness, but because forgiveness had already been received.

The name of Jesus signifies His authority — the same authority that healed the lame man in Acts 3:16 KJV without water and forgave the thief on the cross without baptism. The remission of sins is through His blood (Ephesians 1:7 KJV), not through the water.

Baptism proclaims His name publicly; faith unites us with Him personally. The first is our confession — the second is God’s work of grace.

Grace and peace — always in His Word.

Belief in Jesus and His sacrifice is what makes the NT rebirth possible in the first place. However, what many fail to realize is sins are remitted and the Holy Ghost is received in entirely separate experiences.

 

[TruthDefender]

-You will be saved, IF you believe and are baptized:

"And He said to them, "Go into all the world and preach the gospel to every creature. He who believes and is baptized will be saved; but he who does not believe will be condemned."
Mark 16:15-16 NKJV

-Repent, and be baptized for the remission of sins:

"Then Peter said to them, "Repent, and let every one of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. For the promise is to you and to your children, and to all who are afar off, as many as the Lord our God will call.""
Acts 2:38-39 NKJV

-He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire:

"John answered, saying to all, "I indeed baptize you with water; but One mightier than I is coming, whose sandal strap I am not worthy to loose. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire."
Luke 3:16 NKJV

-Unless you’re born of water and the Spirit, you can’t enter the kingdom of God:

"Jesus answered and said to him, "Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God." Jesus answered, "Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God."
John 3:3, 5 NKJV

-Repent, be baptized for the remission of sins:

"Then Peter said to them, "Repent, and let every one of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. For the promise is to you and to your children, and to all who are afar off, as many as the Lord our God will call."" Acts 2:38-39 NKJV

-Believe and be baptized:

"But when they believed Philip as he preached the things concerning the kingdom of God and the name of Jesus Christ, both men and women were baptized. Then Simon himself also believed; and when he was baptized he continued with Philip, and was amazed, seeing the miracles and signs which were done." Acts 8:12-13 NKJV

-The Holy Spirit fell on ALL who heard the word, and then they were baptized:

"While Peter was still speaking these words, the Holy Spirit fell upon all those who heard the word. And those of the circumcision who believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because the gift of the Holy Spirit had been poured out on the Gentiles also. "Can anyone forbid water, that these should not be baptized who have received the Holy Spirit just as we have?" And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then they asked him to stay a few days."
Acts 10:44-45, 47-48 NKJV

-Baptized with the Holy Spirit:

"Then I remembered the word of the Lord, how He said, ‘John indeed baptized with water, but you shall be baptized with the Holy Spirit.’"
Acts 11:16 NKJV

-Be Baptized and wash away your sins:

"And now why are you waiting? Arise and be baptized, and wash away your sins, calling on the name of the Lord.’"
Acts 22:16 NKJV

-You’re Baptized into Jesus and into His death, and like Jesus will be raised up:

"Or do you not know that as many of us as were baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into His death? Therefore we were buried with Him through baptism into death, that just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life. For if we have been united together in the likeness of His death, certainly we also shall be in the likeness of His resurrection,"
Romans 6:3-5 NKJV

-We were Baptized into Christ and put on Christ; we are heirs according to the promise, Abraham’s seed:

"For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ. There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus. And if you are Christ’s, then you are Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise." Galatians 3:27-29 NKJV

-We were buried with Him in Baptism and were raised with Him in faith; He circumcised us by the remission of sins:

"In Him you were also circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, by putting off the body of the sins of the flesh, by the circumcision of Christ, buried with Him in baptism, in which you also were raised with Him through faith in the working of God, who raised Him from the dead."
Colossians 2:11-12 NKJV

-An antitype now SAVES us—- Baptism:

"There is also an antitype which now saves us—baptism (not the removal of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God), through the resurrection of Jesus Christ, who has gone into heaven and is at the right hand of God, angels and authorities and powers having been made subject to Him."
I Peter 3:21-22 NKJV

 

[Wansvic]

@Wansvic, the reason your interpretations stay tangled is because you’re still filtering everything through that Oneness cult lens. It’s why you have to keep forcing verses to fit a man-made formula instead of letting Scripture speak for itself. That system turns grace into ritual and faith into performance. Step outside that cage for a moment, and you’ll see how clearly the Word teaches salvation through Christ alone — not through ceremony.

Grace and Peace

Relying upon any denomination is futile. It's God's word and His word alone that will judge each and everyone. As such, I accept scripture as written. It alone paints an accurate picture; there is no need to discard a single scripture.

And your perception of me being in a cage is very far from the truth. I placed my trust in Jesus long ago. And am confident of where I stand, and that's in Jesus.

 

[LightBearer316]

You said,
"I appreciate the clarification — but that’s still two steps Scripture never separates. You’ve placed remission of sins in baptism and the Spirit after baptism, yet the apostles consistently taught that both forgiveness and the Spirit are received the moment of faith."

Scripture confirms the truth.

The 120 in the upper room believed in Jesus well before they received the Holy Ghost and were water baptized in the name of Jesus. (Acts 2)
Paul's question in Acts 19 indicates the Holy Ghost is not automatically received when people believe. (Acts 19:1-7)
The Samaritans did not receive the Holy Ghost until days after believing in Jesus. (Acts 8:12-18)

Detailed conversion accounts indicate some believers receive the Holy Ghost before and sometimes after being water baptized in the name of Jesus.

That response from Wansvic perfectly shows the pattern of Oneness reasoning: he’s quoting examples from Acts to build a formula out of transitional moments, while ignoring what the apostles later taught doctrinally about salvation by grace through faith.

He’s doing what Oneness and baptismal-regeneration teachers almost always do — turning Acts (a history book) into a doctrinal manual, instead of letting the epistles (letters of instruction) interpret those events.

I agree the book of Acts records believers receiving the Spirit at different moments — but that doesn’t mean God established multiple salvation formulas. Acts is a record of transition, not a rulebook for repetition.

The 120 in Acts 2 were already disciples of Jesus before Pentecost — that event marked the Spirit’s coming to indwell all believers for the first time (John 7:39 KJV). That was a once-for-all historical fulfillment, not a model of delay.

The Samaritans in Acts 8 and the twelve men in Acts 19 both highlight unique transitional moments as the gospel spread beyond Jerusalem. In each case, the apostles’ presence confirmed unity in the one body of Christ — not a two-step salvation.

By the time Paul wrote to the churches, he taught a consistent truth:

“In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth… in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that Holy Spirit of promise.” — Ephesians 1:13 KJV​

That’s the settled order — belief, then sealing. The Spirit is received by faith, not by timing or ritual (Galatians 3:2 KJV).

When you turn descriptive events in Acts into prescriptive theology, you end up with contradictions that the epistles already resolve. The apostles didn’t preach multiple ways to receive the Spirit; they all preached the same gospel of grace through faith in Christ alone.

Grace and peace — always in His Word.

 

[Wansvic]

Christ alone means doing what he says, even if it's ceremony

I'm reminded of Jesus' words, "My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me." John 10:27

 

[LightBearer316]

-You will be saved, IF you believe and are baptized:

"And He said to them, "Go into all the world and preach the gospel to every creature. He who believes and is baptized will be saved; but he who does not believe will be condemned."
Mark 16:15-16 NKJV

-Repent, and be baptized for the remission of sins:

"Then Peter said to them, "Repent, and let every one of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. For the promise is to you and to your children, and to all who are afar off, as many as the Lord our God will call.""
Acts 2:38-39 NKJV

-He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire:

"John answered, saying to all, "I indeed baptize you with water; but One mightier than I is coming, whose sandal strap I am not worthy to loose. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire."
Luke 3:16 NKJV

-Unless you’re born of water and the Spirit, you can’t enter the kingdom of God:

"Jesus answered and said to him, "Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God." Jesus answered, "Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God."
John 3:3, 5 NKJV

-Repent, be baptized for the remission of sins:

"Then Peter said to them, "Repent, and let every one of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. For the promise is to you and to your children, and to all who are afar off, as many as the Lord our God will call."" Acts 2:38-39 NKJV

-Believe and be baptized:

"But when they believed Philip as he preached the things concerning the kingdom of God and the name of Jesus Christ, both men and women were baptized. Then Simon himself also believed; and when he was baptized he continued with Philip, and was amazed, seeing the miracles and signs which were done." Acts 8:12-13 NKJV

-The Holy Spirit fell on ALL who heard the word, and then they were baptized:

"While Peter was still speaking these words, the Holy Spirit fell upon all those who heard the word. And those of the circumcision who believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because the gift of the Holy Spirit had been poured out on the Gentiles also. "Can anyone forbid water, that these should not be baptized who have received the Holy Spirit just as we have?" And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then they asked him to stay a few days."
Acts 10:44-45, 47-48 NKJV

-Baptized with the Holy Spirit:

"Then I remembered the word of the Lord, how He said, ‘John indeed baptized with water, but you shall be baptized with the Holy Spirit.’"
Acts 11:16 NKJV

-Be Baptized and wash away your sins:

"And now why are you waiting? Arise and be baptized, and wash away your sins, calling on the name of the Lord.’"
Acts 22:16 NKJV

-You’re Baptized into Jesus and into His death, and like Jesus will be raised up:

"Or do you not know that as many of us as were baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into His death? Therefore we were buried with Him through baptism into death, that just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life. For if we have been united together in the likeness of His death, certainly we also shall be in the likeness of His resurrection,"
Romans 6:3-5 NKJV

-We were Baptized into Christ and put on Christ; we are heirs according to the promise, Abraham’s seed:

"For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ. There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus. And if you are Christ’s, then you are Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise." Galatians 3:27-29 NKJV

-We were buried with Him in Baptism and were raised with Him in faith; He circumcised us by the remission of sins:

"In Him you were also circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, by putting off the body of the sins of the flesh, by the circumcision of Christ, buried with Him in baptism, in which you also were raised with Him through faith in the working of God, who raised Him from the dead."
Colossians 2:11-12 NKJV

-An antitype now SAVES us—- Baptism:

"There is also an antitype which now saves us—baptism (not the removal of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God), through the resurrection of Jesus Christ, who has gone into heaven and is at the right hand of God, angels and authorities and powers having been made subject to Him."
I Peter 3:21-22 NKJV

You are debating against Oneness / United Pentecostal Church International (UPCI) heretics... They are not here to learn the truth, just here to spread their heresy.

 

[TruthDefender]

-You will be saved, IF you believe and are baptized:

"And He said to them, "Go into all the world and preach the gospel to every creature. He who believes and is baptized will be saved; but he who does not believe will be condemned."
Mark 16:15-16 NKJV

-Repent, and be baptized for the remission of sins:

"Then Peter said to them, "Repent, and let every one of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. For the promise is to you and to your children, and to all who are afar off, as many as the Lord our God will call.""
Acts 2:38-39 NKJV

-He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire:

"John answered, saying to all, "I indeed baptize you with water; but One mightier than I is coming, whose sandal strap I am not worthy to loose. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire."
Luke 3:16 NKJV

-Unless you’re born of water and the Spirit, you can’t enter the kingdom of God:

"Jesus answered and said to him, "Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God." Jesus answered, "Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God."
John 3:3, 5 NKJV

-Repent, be baptized for the remission of sins:

"Then Peter said to them, "Repent, and let every one of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. For the promise is to you and to your children, and to all who are afar off, as many as the Lord our God will call."" Acts 2:38-39 NKJV

-Believe and be baptized:

"But when they believed Philip as he preached the things concerning the kingdom of God and the name of Jesus Christ, both men and women were baptized. Then Simon himself also believed; and when he was baptized he continued with Philip, and was amazed, seeing the miracles and signs which were done." Acts 8:12-13 NKJV

-The Holy Spirit fell on ALL who heard the word, and then they were baptized:

"While Peter was still speaking these words, the Holy Spirit fell upon all those who heard the word. And those of the circumcision who believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because the gift of the Holy Spirit had been poured out on the Gentiles also. "Can anyone forbid water, that these should not be baptized who have received the Holy Spirit just as we have?" And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then they asked him to stay a few days."
Acts 10:44-45, 47-48 NKJV

-Baptized with the Holy Spirit:

"Then I remembered the word of the Lord, how He said, ‘John indeed baptized with water, but you shall be baptized with the Holy Spirit.’"
Acts 11:16 NKJV

-Be Baptized and wash away your sins:

"And now why are you waiting? Arise and be baptized, and wash away your sins, calling on the name of the Lord.’"
Acts 22:16 NKJV

-You’re Baptized into Jesus and into His death, and like Jesus will be raised up:

"Or do you not know that as many of us as were baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into His death? Therefore we were buried with Him through baptism into death, that just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life. For if we have been united together in the likeness of His death, certainly we also shall be in the likeness of His resurrection,"
Romans 6:3-5 NKJV

-We were Baptized into Christ and put on Christ; we are heirs according to the promise, Abraham’s seed:

"For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ. There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus. And if you are Christ’s, then you are Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise." Galatians 3:27-29 NKJV

-We were buried with Him in Baptism and were raised with Him in faith; He circumcised us by the remission of sins:

"In Him you were also circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, by putting off the body of the sins of the flesh, by the circumcision of Christ, buried with Him in baptism, in which you also were raised with Him through faith in the working of God, who raised Him from the dead."
Colossians 2:11-12 NKJV

-An antitype now SAVES us—- Baptism:

"There is also an antitype which now saves us—baptism (not the removal of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God), through the resurrection of Jesus Christ, who has gone into heaven and is at the right hand of God, angels and authorities and powers having been made subject to Him."
I Peter 3:21-22 NKJV

 

[Wansvic]

I have never heard Oneness believers claim the act of water baptism itself being the congruent connection to receive the Holy Ghost until reading this thread. A lot of misconception within this thread. And Wansvic might be Oneness but his beliefs don't align to the majority of those I am familiar with that proclaim Oneness or Manifestations of the One True Triune God.

I do not believe, nor have I ever stated that the Holy Ghost is received upon obedience to water baptism.

 

[LightBearer316]

I do not believe, nor have I ever stated that the Holy Ghost is received upon obedience to water baptism.

When Wansvic says,

“I do not believe, nor have I ever stated that the Holy Ghost is received upon obedience to water baptism,”​

he’s trying to soften how his view appears — but it doesn’t change that he still teaches baptismal regeneration (forgiveness tied to water) and a separate “Spirit reception” experience (typically evidenced by tongues).​

That combination — even if he denies they’re simultaneous — is still Oneness Pentecostal theology.
The UPCI and other Oneness groups teach “new birth = water + Spirit.” Some phrase it like he does — claiming baptism doesn’t “cause” Spirit reception, but that both are “essential elements of salvation.”

Separating the Holy Spirit from salvation still doesn’t fit the pattern the apostles taught. The moment a believer trusts Christ, he is both forgiven and indwelt by the Spirit — not by stages or separate ceremonies.

“In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth… in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that Holy Spirit of promise.” — Ephesians 1:13 KJV​

That verse leaves no gap between belief and the Spirit’s indwelling. To teach remission through water baptism and Spirit reception later on — even if not simultaneous — still divides what Scripture unites.

Whether before or after baptism in Acts, the constant truth is this: the Spirit is given by faith, not by ritual or sequence (Galatians 3:2 KJV).

Wansic's theology is unsound...

Grace and peace — always in His Word.

 

[Wansvic]

B...That’s why Peter later said plainly:

“Whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins.” — Acts 10:43 (KJV)​

If baptism or tongues were essential steps to complete salvation, that verse couldn’t stand as written.

Grace and peace — always in His Word.

You misquote the scripture.

The scripture specifically states that it is through the name of Jesus that sins are remitted:
"To him give all the prophets witness, that through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins." Acts 10:43


After the group is filled with the Holy Ghost, Peter commands that they be water baptized in the name of Jesus. (47;48) You may think that is just a coincidence. However, I do not.

 

[LightBearer316]

You misquote the scripture.

The scripture specifically states that it is through the name of Jesus that sins are remitted:
"To him give all the prophets witness, that through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins." Acts 10:43

After the group is filled with the Holy Ghost, Peter commands that they be water baptized in the name of Jesus. (47;48) You may think that is just a coincidence. However, I do not.

That’s a perfect example of how Oneness apologists twist a phrase like “through His name” into “through water baptism in His name.”

He’s subtly changing what “through His name” means — from Christ’s authority to a baptismal ceremony. That’s a category error and a classic misuse of Acts 10:43–48 KJV.

I didn’t misquote the verse — I quoted it exactly. What you’re doing is misinterpreting what “through His name” means.

“Through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins.” — Acts 10:43 KJV​

The verse doesn’t say “through baptism in His name,” but “through His name” — meaning by His authority and on the basis of His finished work. The remission comes through believing in Him, not through performing an act that bears His name.

If remission only came after baptism, Peter couldn’t have said “whosoever believeth” — he would have said “whosoever is baptized.” But he didn’t.

And notice the order right after: “While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word.” (v.44) They received the Spirit before touching the water. Peter then commanded baptism because they had already received the Spirit — not to make it happen.

So no, it’s not coincidence — it’s confirmation. Faith brought remission; baptism followed as obedience. Scripture interprets itself clearly when we let it speak in its own order.

Grace and peace — always in His Word.