No person can come to Christ by their own freewill !

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
This is about no man has the freewill ability to believe in Jesus Christ. Jn 6:44
The issue about John 6:44,65 is that Jesus is addressing Jews that have been cursed with Blindness and Deafness under the Isaiah prophecy that Jesus speaks to His Disciples about and Paul writes about in Romans.

But in Romans, Galatians, and other Letters Paul alludes that ALL GENTILES have access to be Grafted Into the Vine should they choose to believe.

So in reality John 6:44,65 is only referring to the Jews. And we know which Jews were drawn to Jesus because the New Testament lists them.
 
  • Like
Reactions: HeIsHere
The issue about John 6:44,65 is that Jesus is addressing Jews that have been cursed with Blindness and Deafness under the Isaiah prophecy that Jesus speaks to His Disciples about and Paul writes about in Romans.

But in Romans, Galatians, and other Letters Paul alludes that ALL GENTILES have access to be Grafted Into the Vine should they choose to believe.

So in reality John 6:44,65 is only referring to the Jews. And we know which Jews were drawn to Jesus because the New Testament lists them.

Nope "to as many as thou hast given him"

[Jhn 17:2-3 KJV]
2 As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.
3 And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.

[Col 3:11 KJV] 11 Where there is neither Greek nor Jew, circumcision nor uncircumcision, Barbarian, Scythian, bond [nor] free: but Christ [is] all, and in all.
 
Nope "to as many as thou hast given him"

[Jhn 17:2-3 KJV]
2 As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.
3 And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.

[Col 3:11 KJV] 11 Where there is neither Greek nor Jew, circumcision nor uncircumcision, Barbarian, Scythian, bond [nor] free: but Christ [is] all, and in all.
But those Verses in John 17 are not in context to the discussion with the Jews in chapter 6. You are just cherry picking and that is ungodly.
 
Then you don't believe God's Word who is Jesus ---so if you don't believe God's word who is Jesus then you don't believe in Jesus -----and if you don't believe in Jesus then you don't believe in God the Father cause Jesus and God the Farther are ONE ____and then you don't believe in the Holy Spirit as well _so your SOL for heaven my friend -----

Good luck with your False Doctrine -------:devilish:

View attachment 280476

Perhaps it is you who doesn't believe - believe that Jesus is THE Savior and that man is not -that being the most fundamental doctrine of scripture upon which all the rest has been built. If you don't/can't recognize that then how can anything else you state be correct?
 
By nature we are children of disobedience and can not obey
You will find in most any BDF that while people there say they believe the Bible contains the words of God, they will argue God doesn't actually mean what he says in it.

We are indeed separated from God due to our human nature.
Unless God's Spirit enters into us and lifts the God given hardening from our natural minds,we cannot understand the things of God. Because those things are spiritually discerned.
1 Corinthians 2.

This coincides with what Jesus said when he told his Disciples his parables are meant to deliver a message they and others are meant by God to understand. Because that capacity to understand isn't given to others or else they too would come to repentance.

God shows mercy as he chooses and hardens as he chooses.

No one comes to Salvation unless God lets them. We don't choose God. God chooses us..
 
But those Verses in John 17 are not in context to the discussion with the Jews in chapter 6. You are just cherry picking and that is ungodly.

Wrong - they pertain to everyone - all whom God elected to salvation - you just don't understand them. Allow me to post again:

[Col 3:11 KJV] 11 Where there is neither Greek nor Jew, circumcision nor uncircumcision, Barbarian, Scythian, bond [nor] free: but Christ [is] all, and in all.
 
Wrong - they pertain to everyone - all whom God elected to salvation - you just don't understand them. Allow me to post again:

[Col 3:11 KJV] 11 Where there is neither Greek nor Jew, circumcision nor uncircumcision, Barbarian, Scythian, bond [nor] free: but Christ [is] all, and in all.

@lrs68

And in case I wasn't clear, by the "everyone" above, I did not mean everyone ever born but only those specific individuals God elected to salvation. The next verse:

[Col 3:12 KJV] 12 Put on therefore, as the elect of God, holy and beloved, bowels of mercies, kindness, humbleness of mind, meekness, longsuffering;
 
Wrong - they pertain to everyone - all whom God elected to salvation - you just don't understand them. Allow me to post again:

[Col 3:11 KJV] 11 Where there is neither Greek nor Jew, circumcision nor uncircumcision, Barbarian, Scythian, bond [nor] free: but Christ [is] all, and in all.
@lrs68

And in case I wasn't clear, by the "everyone" above, I did not mean everyone ever born but only those specific individuals God elected to salvation. The next verse:

[Col 3:12 KJV] 12 Put on therefore, as the elect of God, holy and beloved, bowels of mercies, kindness, humbleness of mind, meekness, longsuffering;
I understand what you meant but if you read all of John 6 you will see why Jesus said what He did in Verses 44 and 65.

And John 17 relates directly to your reference in Colossians because Paul referenced the 2.
 
I understand what you meant but if you read all of John 6 you will see why Jesus said what He did in Verses 44 and 65.

And John 17 relates directly to your reference in Colossians because Paul referenced the 2.

I have read all of John 6. There aren't two salvations based upon ethnicity -through/in Christ, the one pertains to all of the elect.

[Gal 3:28-29 KJV]
28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
29 And if ye [be] Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

[Jhn 6:38-39 KJV]
38 For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me.
39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.

[Jhn 17:2 KJV] 2 As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.

Which verses of Colossians do you have in mind?
 
I have read all of John 6. There aren't two salvations based upon ethnicity -through/in Christ, the one pertains to all of the elect.

[Gal 3:28-29 KJV]
28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
29 And if ye [be] Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

[Jhn 6:38-39 KJV]
38 For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me.
39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.

[Jhn 17:2 KJV] 2 As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.

Which verses of Colossians do you have in mind?
I agree only 1 Salvation like you say.

I am saying what Jesus said is to the Jews because when they were Blinded and Deaf they had no ability to come to Jesus because they were cursed.
 
I agree only 1 Salvation like you say.

I am saying what Jesus said is to the Jews because when they were Blinded and Deaf they had no ability to come to Jesus because they were cursed.

No natural man, regardless of their ethnicity, has that ability - Jew and Gentile alike
 
  • Like
Reactions: brightfame52
believe that Jesus is THE Savior and that man is not

You need the right Faith inbirthed in you to believe that Jesus is the Saviour ---even the Jews don't believe that Jesus is the Saviour ----they are still waiting for their Saviour ----and they are God's Chosen nation --so you are just fooling yourself if you think that everyone believes Jesus is the Saviour and man is not ----many people believe that as long as they serve their neighbour they are saved so they believe man is the saviour -------without Jesus being their Saviour ----

You first need a heart change ---and Repent and then get rooted with saving Faith to have Jesus as your Lord and Saviour -----Period ----
 
You need the right Faith inbirthed in you to believe that Jesus is the Saviour ---even the Jews don't believe that Jesus is the Saviour ----they are still waiting for their Saviour ----and they are God's Chosen nation --so you are just fooling yourself if you think that everyone believes Jesus is the Saviour and man is not ----many people believe that as long as they serve their neighbour they are saved so they believe man is the saviour -------without Jesus being their Saviour ----

You first need a heart change ---and Repent and then get rooted with saving Faith to have Jesus as your Lord and Saviour -----Period ----

The Jews are no longer God's chosen nation so that would not be a true criterion for obtaining belief.
By "everyone" I do not mean everyone ever born, I mean all of the elect - those chosen by God unto salvation.
True Faith is given as a fruit of the Spirit upon becoming saved/born-again. From that rebirth, those saved come to a true belief
in Christ as the/their Savior.

[Gal 2:16 KJV] 16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.

[2Pe 1:1 KJV] 1 Simon Peter, a servant and an apostle of Jesus Christ, to them that have obtained like precious faith with us through the righteousness of God and our Saviour Jesus Christ:
 
No natural man, regardless of their ethnicity, has that ability - Jew and Gentile alike
Agreed 👍

But chapter 6 is a discussion concerning the Jews and the prophecy curse of Isaiah they are under.
 
Agreed 👍

But chapter 6 is a discussion concerning the Jews and the prophecy curse of Isaiah they are under.

I don't find that limitation/restriction in 6. Guess we'll just have to agree to disagree.
 
I don't find that limitation/restriction in 6. Guess we'll just have to agree to disagree.
I'm just saying Jesus was speaking to the Jews which were also under the prophecy curse spoken by Isaiah.
 
I'm just saying Jesus was speaking to the Jews which were also under the prophecy curse spoken by Isaiah.

Understand, but I think that while He was speaking to the Jews, His message transcended the Jews. Anyway, I don't think we'll
be able to resolve this now.
 
Agreed 👍

But chapter 6 is a discussion concerning the Jews and the prophecy curse of Isaiah they are under.
Has nothing to do with race per say, but human depravity and God's righteous judgement on it, not because of ethnicity
 
2-Corinthians4-5-7.png

2 Corinthians 4 verses 5-7 ~ We do not proclaim ourselves, but Jesus Christ as Lord, and ourselves as your servants for Jesus’ sake. For God, who said, “Let light shine out of darkness,” made His light shine in our hearts to give us the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ. Now we have this treasure in jars of clay to show that this surpassingly great power is from God and not from us.
 
The Jews are no longer God's chosen nation

OH BOY ____NOW I KNOW YOUR NOT SAVED _____the Jews are still God's Chosen and He does honor His Covenant with His Chosen Nation ----He Marks the 12 Tribe of Israel who are going to Preach His Gospel to all the Nations during the 7 year Tribulation and the Jews in the end all Get saved ------Period --Jesus NEVER __NEVER Abandoned His Chosen Nation ------NEVER ---

I say --------Nothing happen to start the 7 Year Tribulation until God Seals His Jewish Nation 144000 --they are sealed and saved -----

Better read Revelation ----


144,000 Sealed
7 After this I saw four angels standing at the four corners of the earth, holding back the four winds of the earth to prevent any wind from blowing on the land or on the sea or on any tree.

2 Then I saw another angel coming up from the east, having the seal of the living God. He called out in a loud voice to the four angels who had been given power to harm the land and the sea:

3 “Do not harm the land or the sea or the trees until we put a seal on the foreheads of the servants of our God.”

4 Then I heard the number of those who were sealed: 144,000 from all the tribes of Israel.

5 From the tribe of Judah 12,000 were sealed,
from the tribe of Reuben 12,000,
from the tribe of Gad 12,000,
6 from the tribe of Asher 12,000,
from the tribe of Naphtali 12,000,
from the tribe of Manasseh 12,000,
7 from the tribe of Simeon 12,000,
from the tribe of Levi 12,000,
from the tribe of Issachar 12,000,
8 from the tribe of Zebulun 12,000,
from the tribe of Joseph 12,000,
from the tribe of Benjamin 12,000.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Doll