Is masturbation really a sin?

[presidente]

Jesus said "Lust one one's heart " Matthew 5:28-30. This "LUST" will take you down. It will come upon you suddenly and feel harmless. Yet the end result is to control and torment. If this action is so harmless why so many men of God who did this harmless act ended up in fornication, adultery and homosexuality?

Lust is the same word (inflected differently grammatically) as the word for 'covet' in the Greek version of the 10 commandments in the LXX. How is this coveting?

Also, a lot of homosexuals drink coffee. I don't know the stats, but I've read 90+ percent... maybe high 90's of men have done this to themselves. What percentage of them are adulterers, fornicators, or homosexuals? The percentage of homosexuals has gone up as this has been promoted on TV and at schools... but back in the 1980's, there weren't as many of them.

Couldn't you present your case a bit better?

Lust is a sin of the heart that is the cause that drives one to do.

I would imagine it does in many cases, but what about other reasons-- stress relief or physical pressure, desire for release... other stuff that could make a man want to have sex with his wife besides seeing her come out of the shower.

I fully believe each parson here knows fully this is not godly act to thing to do. Youn know.

So the argument is that it's wrong, and you know it's wrong, and that's it?

I'm thinking, back 3000 years ago, people had basically the same anatomy. Of course, Jews were circumcised, but.... why isn't it in Leviticus 18 or some other passage? Why doesn't it show up in the gospels or epistles? If it does, it's hidden somehow behind translation.

I'm not against you saying not to do this... but can't you do a better job arguing your case than this? i think you normally do.

I mentioned my stance. I'm not going to tell someone to go do this to himself... but if someone does.... where is my basis for condemning that person?

Also, what about a married couple who have 10 minutes, and they forgot the birth control, and he's trying to stay ready while she grabs it... or while he grabs it (lets say he's getting a bit old in this scenario and isn't 19.) If he tries to keep.... well you know...do you think that's a sin? What if it is in the overall context of a marital act? What if the doctor needs a sample so a couple can conceive, and she's not around. Or what if it's her 'collecting the sample' and not him? But not intercourse? Are you against that?

 

[presidente]

If your understanding is that drinking Doctor Pepper is anyway associated with the spirit of Lust that has taken many men of God down who admittedly said Masturbation was what they started with when there seeking online porno. Then led them to other venues of sexual addiction.

Can you show me where the Bible mentions a 'spirit of lust.' By 'spirit' do you mean a demon, or some kind of conscious spiritual entity? Or do you mean some sort of spiritual condition? If the Bible speaks of 'lusts of the flesh' is lust a 'flesh' thing or a 'spirit' thing?

Btw, do you think there was basically no masturbation before the Internet developed to the extent it could host pictures? I remember kids joking about it and a sermon on the topic back when the Internet was a NASA thing when home computers had kilobytes and could not do much with photos. Do you think there was masturbation before photography was invented in the 1800s?

 

[presidente]

So lacking self- control is NOT a sin anymore?
Even when the Bible says those who don't practice it won't inherit the Kingdom of God?

If you post on the Internet or use your phone, are you lacking in self control? What if you drink coffee or eat chocolate? Where does the Bible say that they that lack self control will not inherit the kingdom of God? Is that what you mean by 'don't practice it'?

 

[Suze]

Perhaps u didn't understand the context of th

Curious why someone has to 'use ones imagination' or be thinking about anything in particular. Especially, young men, early in the morning.

Have you ever heard of even married men thinking about baseball? I think you are conflating this with 'lustful thoughts.'

Perhaps u didn't understand the context of this message ?

 

[Suze]

I don't know if there is any evidence that God told him to do that. The lavrite law was given later. But it was the custom... and he was sleeping with her.

We also don't know that he didn't masturbate either, or if he was just good at timing.

It tooks some 'theological reasoning' to get from that to story 'onanism'.

Abraham was given the law by God , if u read the Old Testament very carefully u can find the law in there well before Moses .

 

[Suze]

Like it or not, there are probably justifiable reasons for some masturbation.... doesn't make it "right" or "wrong"... just is what it is.
Too many pious people here that think that everything we do, minute by minute should only be done "to the glory of God".... Is drinking that extra Dr Pepper being done to the glory of God? How bout the FIRST Dr Pepper? What about making un-necessary trips back and forth to Home Depot, spending money on gas unnecessarily? Is THAT to the glory of God....

Good grief.... we as believers are to do the best we can, with our very human abilities and limitations... not all of us can live up to the standard of sinless perfection like many of you here claim to have.... not pointing any fingers, but it's easy to armchair quarterback OTHER people's lives... "Lord I thank you that I am not like that sinner over there....."

I believe that on this site , just as in real life , there r people who just like to argue for the sake of it . Personally , I only argue if it's about some thing that I actually believe to b correct , not just for my own amusement , which is what I think that some people on here , as in real life , do . God bless u for your common sense .

 

[Edify]

If you post on the Internet or use your phone, are you lacking in self control? What if you drink coffee or eat chocolate? Where does the Bible say that they that lack self control will not inherit the kingdom of God? Is that what you mean by 'don't practice it'?

2Tim 3: 1But realize this, that in the last days difficult times will come. 2For people will be lovers of self, lovers of money, boastful, arrogant, slanderers, disobedient to parents, ungrateful, unholy, 3unloving, irreconcilable, malicious gossips, without self-control, brutal, [a]haters of good, 4treacherous, reckless, conceited, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God, 5holding to a form of https://biblehub.com/nasb_/2_timothy/3.htm#fngodliness although they have denied its power; avoid such people as these. 6For among them are those who [c]slip into households and captivate [d]weak women weighed down with sins, led on by various impulses, 7always learning and never able to come to the [e]knowledge of the truth. 8Just as Jannes and Jambres opposed Moses, so these men also oppose the truth, men of depraved mind, [f]worthless in regard to the faith. 9But they will not make further progress; for their foolishness will be obvious to all, just as was that also of [g]Jannes and Jambres.

Didn't you know this?

 

[Edify]

Those without self control can never come to the knowledge of the truth usually because they don't want to know.
They will always try to justify their sin.

 

[Edify]

Those who are single and married who masterbate are filled with lust & adultery, because they can't keep their imagination pure. There are all kinds of temptation to imagine a spouse with more than they have, or for a favorite/famous beautiful person of the world, or someone much younger & sexier than their spouse. Those who say they can will be put to the test.

 

[Edify]

Joseph, a righteous man, had to run from sexual temptation. He is an example to all of us.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

ahhhhh..... sigh. I'm sure I didn't explain it correctly to you... others seem to have grasped it....

I was in no way saying that going to the Home Depot would cause a person to lust....
I was pointing out that several folks on here are rather piously telling everyone that if any action is not "to the glory of God" we should not be doing it. Period.

I was pointing out that MUCH of what we do would not be considered "to the glory of God" ...... like drinking Dr. Pepper, or spending too much on gas going to Home Depot, etc.... but we all still DO those things.

We live our lives.... our flawed, human, saved lives to the glory of God, to the best of our ability. But everyone will fall short, every day... it's the human condition that Jesus came to "clean" for us....

is there any merit to believing things like this ?

“Behold, all souls are mine; as the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is mine: the soul that sinneth, it shall die.”
‭‭Ezekiel‬ ‭18:4‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish.”
‭‭Luke‬ ‭13:3‬ ‭

“I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.”
‭‭Luke‬ ‭5:32‬ ‭

“As obedient children, do not conform to the evil desires you had when you lived in ignorance. But just as he who called you is holy, so be holy in all you do; for it is written: “Be holy, because I am holy.” Since you call on a Father who judges each person’s work impartially, live out your time as foreigners here in reverent fear.”
‭‭1 Peter‬ ‭1:14-17‬ ‭NIV‬‬

should we get angry at doctine like that and people who mention it ? Or should we be willing to maybe accept what it says so our thinking will change with it ?

should we have the attitude “everyone sins it’s no biggy “ these judgemental people talking about needing “ repentance “ and obedience “ they just don’t get it …”

Or should we let the word change tbat thinking ?

“Therefore, brethren, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live after the flesh. For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die:

but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭8:12-13‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“But fornication, and all uncleanness, or covetousness, let it not be once named among you, as becometh saints; neither filthiness, nor foolish talking, nor jesting, which are not convenient: but rather giving of thanks. For this ye know, that no whoremonger, nor unclean person, nor covetous man, who is an idolater, hath any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God.

Let no man deceive you with vain words: for because of these things cometh the wrath of God upon the children of disobedience. Be not ye therefore partakers with them.”
‭‭Ephesians‬ ‭5:3-7‬ ‭KJV‬‬

it shouldn’t upset and offend us to hear what’s throughout the New Testament about repenting from sin and lustful minds and hearts

Things like this aren’t meant to and shouldn’t offend believers they should provide direction for our lives and a framework for our beliefs

“Follow peace with all men, and holiness, without which no man shall see the Lord:”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭12:14‬ ‭KJV‬‬

If we’re offended by the idea of repentance and obeying God living upright godly lives were missing everything About Gods grace

“For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men, teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world; ( this shouldn’t offend believers ) looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ; who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works. These things speak, and exhort, and rebuke with all authority. Let no man despise thee.”
‭‭Titus‬ ‭2:11-15‬ ‭KJV‬‬

More than half the New Testament is preaching about repentance and obeying the lord . It’s true we aren’t perfect but if our attitudes aren’t in line with the gospel we need to change

 

[Pilgrimshope]

Joseph, a righteous man, had to run from sexual temptation. He is an example to all of us.

Yeah probably why Paul wrote to the church about it

“Flee from sexual immorality. All other sins a person commits are outside the body, but whoever sins sexually, sins against their own body.”
‭‭1 Corinthians‬ ‭6:18‬ ‭NIV‬‬

“Do you not know that your bodies are temples of the Holy Spirit, who is in you, whom you have received from God? You are not your own; you were bought at a price. Therefore honor God with your bodies.”
‭‭1 Corinthians‬ ‭6:19-20‬ ‭NIV‬‬

These concepts are great when we’re talking about them and discussing but if we’re trying to preserve sin in our life and reason why it’s still alright they are like scolding water and we don’t want to hear them

The Bible is like that to press us to repentance just because we acknowledge his word being believers it tends our hearts and cleanses us like a refiners fire

awe fond rebukes for our sins as we listen to the lords word

 

[Brasspen]

“Flee from sexual immorality. All other sins a person commits are outside the body, but whoever sins sexually, sins against their own body.”
‭‭1 Corinthians‬ ‭6:18‬ ‭NIV‬‬

“Do you not know that your bodies are temples of the Holy Spirit, who is in you, whom you have received from God? You are not your own; you were bought at a price. Therefore honor God with your bodies.”
‭‭1 Corinthians‬ ‭6:19-20‬ ‭NIV‬‬

This is talking about laying with a hooker. They obeserved in those time, that those who did these things died sooner (aids), and sometimes got herpies.

 

[presidente]

Abraham was given the law by God , if u read the Old Testament very carefully u can find the law in there well before Moses .

There are some similarities, but a lot of this stuff is based on Jewish tradition not scripture.

 

[presidente]

2Tim 3: 1But realize this, that in the last days difficult times will come. 2For people will be lovers of self, lovers of money, boastful, arrogant, slanderers, disobedient to parents, ungrateful, unholy, 3unloving, irreconcilable, malicious gossips, without self-control, brutal, [a]haters of good, 4treacherous, reckless, conceited, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God, 5holding to a form of godliness although they have denied its power; avoid such people as these. 6For among them are those who [c]slip into households and captivate [d]weak women weighed down with sins, led on by various impulses, 7always learning and never able to come to the [e]knowledge of the truth. 8Just as Jannes and Jambres opposed Moses, so these men also oppose the truth, men of depraved mind, [f]worthless in regard to the faith. 9But they will not make further progress; for their foolishness will be obvious to all, just as was that also of [g]Jannes and Jambres.

Didn't you know this?

I'm not seeing 'will not inherit the kingdom of God' in this passage either. That shows up in I Corinthians 6.

 

[presidente]

Those who are single and married who masterbate are filled with lust & adultery, because they can't keep their imagination pure. There are all kinds of temptation to imagine a spouse with more than they have, or for a favorite/famous beautiful person of the world, or someone much younger & sexier than their spouse. Those who say they can will be put to the test.

How do you now what these masturbators are thinking about?

Also, how do you know what people think about when they masturbate?

Are you projecting?

 

[Pilgrimshope]

This is talking about laying with a hooker. They obeserved in those time, that those who did these things died sooner (aids), and sometimes got herpies.

anything that’s willfully done to satisfy our lust is sinful.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

I'm not seeing 'will not inherit the kingdom of God' in this passage either. That shows up in I Corinthians 6.

“But among you there must not be even a hint of sexual immorality, or of any kind of impurity, or of greed, because these are improper for God’s holy people. Nor should there be obscenity, foolish talk or coarse joking, which are out of place, but rather thanksgiving. For of this you can be sure: No immoral, impure or greedy person—such a person is an idolater—has any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God. Let no one deceive you with empty words, for because of such things God’s wrath comes on those who are disobedient.”
‭‭Ephesians‬ ‭5:3-6‬ ‭NIV‬‬

It was a repetetive message in Paul’s epistles and doctrines

“The acts of the flesh are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God. But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law.”
‭‭Galatians‬ ‭5:19-23‬ ‭NIV‬‬

 

[CS1]

ahhhhh..... sigh. I'm sure I didn't explain it correctly to you... others seem to have grasped it....

I was in no way saying that going to the Home Depot would cause a person to lust....
I was pointing out that several folks on here are rather piously telling everyone that if any action is not "to the glory of God" we should not be doing it. Period.

I was pointing out that MUCH of what we do would not be considered "to the glory of God" ...... like drinking Dr. Pepper, or spending too much on gas going to Home Depot, etc.... but we all still DO those things.

We live our lives.... our flawed, human, saved lives to the glory of God, to the best of our ability. But everyone will fall short, every day... it's the human condition that Jesus came to "clean" for us....

I AGREE with that

 

[CS1]

My approach is more nuanced than you think, and doesn't start with assuming an answer.

I don't think I made it personal.

Not addressing it is probably better than addressing it the way you did. Jesus doesn't say anything about a "spirit of lust" motivating anything; he condemns a specific behavior which is tangentially related to; but is not necessarily implied in the behavior that is the topic of this thread.
Next, the Greek in Matt5 is the same word as the Greek in Matt13:17 where it says For truly I tell you, many prophets and righteous men longed to see what you see but did not see it, and to hear what you hear but did not hear it. Earlier in the thread you said "desire" and "lust" are not the same; but as far as NT scriptures go, they are the same; so it's not useful to make a distinction between the two, even if it exists in the current English.

That doesn't seem like very friendly advice from someone who is condemning this behavior.

I didn't; I said gun control activists use the same kind of logic where they insist one thing implies another without really proving it.

the context of lust or a spirit of lust is addressed by Jesus. its and issue of the heart. Lust and desire are not the same thing although they can be used in the same way IF the meaning and context so provides. The context of the word in both Hebrew and Greek have different interpretations. 1. you will never see the word lust in context of Jesus having a desire to do. the word never says, "Jesus lusted after food." If your English in not taken into consideration the systematic range of meaning of words in the Greek and Hebrew. That your issue not mine.