Assualts Against Restrainer

[Musicmaster]

Many a speaker, preacher, commentator, author, Christian broadcaster, et al, speak routinely about the assaults against what they call "the Church," or against Christians in general. What seems to materialize in what they call say in response to the persecutions and agendas of perversity is the result of the deceptions emanating from the enemy of our souls.

John 15:18-23
18 If the world hate you, ye know that it hated me before it hated you.
19 If ye were of the world, the world would love his own: but because ye are not of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world hateth you.
20 Remember the word that I said unto you, The servant is not greater than his lord. If they have persecuted me, they will also persecute you; if they have kept my saying, they will keep yours also.
21 But all these things will they do unto you for my name's sake, because they know not him that sent me.
22 If I had not come and spoken unto them, they had not had sin: but now they have no cloke for their sin.
23 He that hateth me hateth my Father also.

Given that we are His "body," not having yet been called up out of this world until the rapture before the beginning of the tribulation, His body then serves as an instrument of empowered restraint against the empowerment and revealing of the man of sin. The undercurrent of what is said about the persecutions against the body of Christ points to a purpose that so few ever talk about, which is the restrainer.

Many will say Holy Spirit is the restrainer, which is all well and good, but they miss out on the fact that the very BODY of Christ present upon this earth also holds back the fullness of the man of sin's power being established.

Thoughts?

MM

 

[Blain]

I haven't considered that the body of Christ is the restrainer but I also think there will be newly saved Christians in the great tribulation as well people coming to Christ. So then why would we as the body be the restrainer especially if people will have to decide to take the mark of the beast. But you do make some good points though

 

[Omegatime]

I agree MM except for the timing of the rapture

 

[Kroogz]

Many a speaker, preacher, commentator, author, Christian broadcaster, et al, speak routinely about the assaults against what they call "the Church," or against Christians in general. What seems to materialize in what they call say in response to the persecutions and agendas of perversity is the result of the deceptions emanating from the enemy of our souls.

John 15:18-23
18 If the world hate you, ye know that it hated me before it hated you.
19 If ye were of the world, the world would love his own: but because ye are not of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world hateth you.
20 Remember the word that I said unto you, The servant is not greater than his lord. If they have persecuted me, they will also persecute you; if they have kept my saying, they will keep yours also.
21 But all these things will they do unto you for my name's sake, because they know not him that sent me.
22 If I had not come and spoken unto them, they had not had sin: but now they have no cloke for their sin.
23 He that hateth me hateth my Father also.

Given that we are His "body," not having yet been called up out of this world until the rapture before the beginning of the tribulation, His body then serves as an instrument of empowered restraint against the empowerment and revealing of the man of sin. The undercurrent of what is said about the persecutions against the body of Christ points to a purpose that so few ever talk about, which is the restrainer.

Many will say Holy Spirit is the restrainer, which is all well and good, but they miss out on the fact that the very BODY of Christ present upon this earth also holds back the fullness of the man of sin's power being established.

Thoughts?

MM

I agree. The church is indwelt by the Holy Spirit. When the Church is removed at the beginning of the tribulation. There are ONLY unbelievers left on this earth.

IMO, the Holy Spirit will continue the final week of Israels dispensation and He will be "among" and "upon" the tribulation saints.

 

[ResidentAlien]

The restrainer is masculine; the ekklesia is feminine.

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

The restrainer is masculine; the ekklesia is feminine.

How about the other names (for "the Church/ekklesia which is His body"), like...


--"for to make/create in himself of twain ONE NEW MAN [masculine]" - https://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/eph/2/15/p0/t_concif_1099015 - Eph2:15; or


--"In whom all the building fitly framed together groweth unto AN HOLY TEMPLE [masculine] in the Lord:" - https://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/eph/2/21/t_concif_1099021 - Eph2:21

 

[ResidentAlien]

How about the other names (for "the Church/ekklesia which is His body"), like .


--"for to make/create in himself of twain ONE NEW MAN [masculine]" - https://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/eph/2/15/p0/t_concif_1099015 - Eph2:15; or


--"In whom all the building fitly framed together groweth unto AN HOLY TEMPLE [masculine] in the Lord:" - https://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/eph/2/21/t_concif_1099021 - Eph2:21

No matter how you slice it, the ekklesia is still the bride of Christ, not the bridegroom.

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

No matter how you slice it, the ekklesia is still the bride of Christ, not the bridegroom.

Well, I'm not arguing that the Church / ekklesia is the bridegroom. (I agree we are the betrothed "bride"... but are also called other things).


You've brought to mind another example, though:

"Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto A PERFECT MAN [masculine], unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:" - https://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/eph/4/13/p0/t_concif_1101013 - Eph4:13 [see v.30 also, in this context]





[I believe the restrainer is the "Holy-Spirit-indwelt Church" (so, BOTH--and it says, "until out of the midst he become"--note: I do not believe the Holy Spirit will be absent from the earth during the Trib yrs, just that His "restraining role" will have changed)... ; Both the "masculine" and the "neuter" is used in the 2Th2 passage, so there's something else to consider ]

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

^ (to go with the above post, especially that last sentence...) The following references (speaking of the Holy Spirit as "Comforter / Advocate / Helper") are "masculine" (consider also the CONTEXT of these 4 verses) -


John 14:16 N-AMS
GRK: καὶ ἄλλον παράκλητον δώσει ὑμῖν
NAS: you another Helper, that He may be with you forever;
KJV: another Comforter, that
INT: and another Helper he will give you

John 14:26 N-NMS
GRK: ὁ δὲ παράκλητος τὸ πνεῦμα
NAS: But the Helper, the Holy Spirit,
KJV: But the Comforter, [which is] the Holy
INT: but [the] Helper the Spirit

John 15:26 N-NMS
GRK: ἔλθῃ ὁ παράκλητος ὃν ἐγὼ
NAS: When the Helper comes, whom
KJV: But when the Comforter is come, whom
INT: is come the Helper whom I

John 16:7 N-NMS
GRK: ἀπέλθω ὁ παράκλητος οὐ οὐκ
NAS: I do not go away, the Helper will not come
KJV: not away, the Comforter will not
INT: I go away the Helper no not at all







And verses such as the following (speaking of us, the Church which is His "BODY") has the word "body" in the "neuter" -

"Who now rejoice in my sufferings for you, and fill up that which is behind of the afflictions of Christ in my flesh for his BODY'S [neuter] sake, which is the church: " - https://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/col/1/24/p0/t_concif_1108024 - Col1:24

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

To go with the last line of my Post #8 (re: both the "masculine" and "neuter" being used in 2Th2:6,7) -

https://biblehub.com/interlinear/2_thessalonians/2.htm


--v.6 "that which [neuter] is restraining [neuter]..."

--v.7 "the [one] [masculine] restraining [masculine] [at present until]..."

 

[Musicmaster]

I haven't considered that the body of Christ is the restrainer

Thanks, Blain. I haven't yet spoken of the more broad basis behind what I said in the OP, but here's additional reasoning behind what came to me about this about the Kingdom Church before the Gospel of Grace came into being:

Matthew 16:18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

Given that the hoards of the evil one would not prevail against the Israeli onslaught as the Kingdom Church going forth out into the world, which will be accomplished in the future during the tribulation, the later coming of the body of Christ has served as the restraint these past two millennia to the coming of the man of sin. Granted, it's actually Christ and His Power, but also operating through His body to this very day. Our prayers are powerful and withholding the powers of the evil one to empower that man who will come, but only when the Lord is ready to pull us out of here, thus there being no body of Christ left on this earth through which to withhold that man from coming to power.

A caveat to all this is also the fact that Satan has ALWAYS had a man ready to step into that position of the man of sin whom he would and will possess within the tribulational period. Many have named names of various men through the ages, with the only possibility for accuracy being an occasional outlier. Some may ask why Satan would have one after another ready for that role...because he could not and does not know the day or the hour of the rapture when he would then be able to bring his man to the forefront of political and economic power to persecute and kill the righteous and the wicked alike.

The people who watch in the tribulation period will know precisely he day, if not the hour, of Christ's second coming at the end of the tribulation, for the timetable has clearly been revealed in the prophetic calendar, but it will be as a thief on the night to the majority who are not watching.

but I also think there will be newly saved Christians in the great tribulation as well people coming to Christ.

Absolutely. I personally believe that the numbers of people coming to faith in Christ in that time will be far beyond anything this world has ever seen before in sheer numbers, but they will be those who will possess the new earth rather than the heavenly places where the body of Christ will reside in the everlasting state. The believers in the tribulation will have to persevere unto the end to be saved because they will not be sealed by Holy Spirit as we are today as the body of Christ. Taking the mark is an absolute destroyer to one's future, but we today face no such destroyer of our everlasting future once sealed by Holy Spirit:

2 Corinthians 1:22 Who hath also sealed us, and given the earnest of the Spirit in our hearts.

Ephesians 4:30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.

When one puts down an earnest payment, they don't take it back. The benefit of possessing that payment remains in the hands of the one who received it, which is us today who are in Christ as the body of Christ. The Lord does not ever take a knife and slice away portions of His own body because of some works-based falsehood about salvation and the need to retain it by way of our efforts. Being sealed, with the earnest paid, it is an existence assured, contrary to all the works-based salvationists out there who think they have the power to retain their salvation by virtue of their personal pride in their ability to please the Lord to keep them saved by way of their works.

So then why would we as the body be the restrainer especially if people will have to decide to take the mark of the beast.

This assumes the body of Christ will be here, thus making the Lord a liar. I've asked others to show to me where the Lord ever inspired it to be written where the sealing of His own Spirit could ever become "unsealed." Where does one go to prove such a phenomenon when it's not written anywhere in scripture? Paul, the apostles to the Gentiles, never spoke of such a thing, even though he alone spoke of our being sealed by Holy Spirit that no other of the apostles ever addressed because that sealing was not present within the Kingdom Gospel, which requires perseverance.

One may ask why those in the tribulation will have to persevere. Simply stated, Holy Spirit will not seal those in that period of time, because doing so would create a dichotomy in the lives of those who later take the mark of the beast. We know ALL those people will be cast into Sheole and later into the lake of fire with Satan, the beast, death and the false prophet, etc.

So, your question hits squarely upon the problem created by those who claim the body of Christ will be here until the second coming of Christ. They believe in dichotomies that negate the harmony and consistency of scripture among those things that they either ignore or redefine into the oblivion of their false beliefs in an attempt to avoid the obvious irrationality of their eschatology.

Hope that helps. Blessings to you and yours.

MM

 

[Musicmaster]

The restrainer is masculine; the ekklesia is feminine.

Good clarification. That fits in nicely with what I stated, in that the body of Christ is the body THROUGH whom the power of the restrainer is operating. This, then, does not violate the gender of nouns and their specifying adjectives.

MM

 

[ResidentAlien]

Good clarification. That fits in nicely with what I stated, in that the body of Christ is the body THROUGH whom the power of the restrainer is operating. This, then, does not violate the gender of nouns and their specifying adjectives.

If that's the case, it's seems what you're really saying then is the restrainer is the Holy Spirit, not the ekklesia or body. The restrainer is masculine, and the Holy Spirit is definitely masculine; the ekklesia is feminine. As far as I can tell, you're saying the Holy Spirit and the body will both depart, then the man of sin will be revealed.

 

[Musicmaster]

No matter how you slice it, the ekklesia is still the bride of Christ, not the bridegroom.

The Israeli, Kingdom Gospel, ancient Israel and the small flock portions of the ekklesia are indeed the bride of Christ. Yes. The body of Christ, however, is not the bride of Christ.

Revelation 21:1-2

1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.
2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.

To us Israeli's, this replacement theology garbage idea that Christ is some sort of serial polygamist, it's utterly repugnant. Christ was originally married to Israel, He gave to Israel a writ of divorcement, and will once again take her back, thus being married to whom He had already been married, as prophesied through the very life and experience of Hosea and cumulatively revealed in Revelation. Hosea married a harlot, divorced her for continuing her harlot lifestyle, and then remarried her. This is the understanding we live as Israeli's. We do not subjectively separate what you call the Old Testament from the New. The prophets spoke and lived many things that were SHADOWS of things to come, as we also see in the Law.

So, people the world over can continue believing upon the falsehoods of replacement theology, but it will always remain a distinctive from, rather than a harmonious part of, scripture. Only bloodline Israel will live in the New Jerusalem, for all one need do is read the names written above the gates and upon the foundation stones. The Lord did not make priests of Gentiles, but only of Israel. Those are not Gentile names on the gates and foundation stones. The rest of the nations, apart from the body of Christ, will possess the new earth to form the nations over which Christ will rule through Israel everlastingly.

The haters of Israel out there who embrace replacement theology, they will continue their harangue against Israel with the Satanic hatred they have for us, and that's on them. I do not condemn any of them, for they are under the Judgement of the perfect Judge or His correction already.

MM

 

[Musicmaster]

If that's the case, it's seems what you're really saying then is the restrainer is the Holy Spirit, not the ekklesia or body. The restrainer is masculine, and the Holy Spirit is definitely masculine; the ekklesia is feminine. As far as I can tell, you're saying the Holy Spirit and the body will both depart, then the man of sin will be revealed.

What I'm saying is that a body of created people, in and of themselves, cannot restrain such a power. It is the Lord who empowers the body of Christ to serve Him as the restrainer against the man of sin coming to power. Ultimately it is the Lord who has the power of restraint, having chosen His body on this earth as the physical presence for that restraint. That is what seems to flow out from the text.

Does that help?

MM

 

[homwardbound]

The restrainer is masculine; the ekklesia is feminine.

A comforter, a compassionate person, born new by God for us all to see and believe too, thank you
Wow, woe is me in Father for us all through son as risen given us to love all, thanks

 

[Aaron56]

I agree. The church is indwelt by the Holy Spirit. When the Church is removed at the beginning of the tribulation. There are ONLY unbelievers left on this earth.

IMO, the Holy Spirit will continue the final week of Israels dispensation and He will be "among" and "upon" the tribulation saints.

The Holy Spirit, after Christ's ascension, was sent work within the world:

And when He has come, He will convict the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment: 9 of sin, because they do not believe in Me; 10 of righteousness, because I go to My Father and you see Me no more; 11 of judgment, because the ruler of this world is judged.

The Holy Spirit convicts the world of three things:
Sin
Righteousness
Judgement

He is doing this at the moment. With God the definition of sin, righteousness, and judgment are unwavering.

Conviction of Sin sets a standard of behavior for all men. Sin is an archery term that means "distance from the target". In this case, Christ is the target to whom men are called into.

Conviction of Righteousness sets an object of perfection for all men. Christ is righteousness personified. No measure of man's righteousness can measure up to that of the Son.

Conviction of Judgment sets an expectation of exposure. Judgement, at its base, is simply "establishing the truth of something". It is not sentencing. Sentencing imposes a penalty for missing the mark. Judgement is simply saying what something is. Apart from Christ, God has judged man's ways to be wanting: lacking in eternal value.

These convictions set juxtaposed to the ways of the enemy (his systems) introduced in the garden: "the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life"

Lust of the flesh sets the behavior target of man as their own flesh. This standard compels man to obtain whatever he desires.

Lust of the eyes sets the object of perfect within man's purview. The sons of God are compelled to "do only what they see their Father doing". The lust of the eyes creates lawlessness: when every man does what he sees is right in his own eyes.

The pride of life asserts that man can obtain the reaches of God without God. In effect: there is no limit to man's appetite to expand apart from God. At Babel we have a glimpse of this: "now nothing that they propose to do will be withheld from them." Here, the enemy will fund and empower all men who oppose God in an attempt to make a mockery of Him.

More than 10 years ago the prophets that I know were warning about the removal of the Restrainer: the Holy Spirit. So, this is nothing new to the people who can hear the Spirit. Of course, the Holy Spirit will never leave the people of God so we may expect to be preserved as lawlessness reaches its apogee.

 

[Omegatime]

MM said:

The people who watch in the tribulation period will know precisely he day, if not the hour, of Christ's second coming at the end of the tribulation, for the timetable has clearly been revealed in the prophetic calendar, but it will be as a thief on the night to the majority who are not watching.

Yeshua/Jesus on the night he was arrested kept returning to his disciples asking why they were not watching.

From Exodus 12

42 It was a night of watching by the Lord, to bring them out of the land of Egypt; so this same night is a night of watching kept to the Lord by all the people of Israel throughout their generations.

 

[SirSolaScriptura]

I am so glad this topic exists. I have been trying to divine what the restrainer is myself. Some say the Archangel Michael (I see not proof of this), others the Holy Spirit. What I do know is does feel like The Constrainer / Restrainer has been removed from the Earth, that we are seeing the Romans 1, "inventors of new sins," happening and a general antipathy and even antagonism towards Christ and his Church, while Witchcraft and Witches is becoming popular in most media and sections of bookstores now have more spell books than Bibles. I will be reading this thread carefully, to glean what you all have discussed already.

 

[LenMcM]

No matter how you slice it, the ekklesia is still the bride of Christ, not the bridegroom.

The Bride of Christ as such is only mentioned once in the Bible (Revelation) and there is identified as "The New Jerusalem" , So neither Jew nor Christian can exclusively claim to be The Bride. Both however will be in The New Jerusalem where Jesus reigns and both then be recognised as His Children. All one in the Family of God.