Demons

[keepingthingsreal]

Can a Christian have a demon dwelling inside of them?

Yes or no?

Whatever your position is, please support it with scripture which can then be scrutinized by everybody here in order to determine whether or not those scriptures truly say what anybody here might claim they say in context.

I trust that we all believe that Christians can be oppressed or harassed outwardly by demons, but that is not my question.

Again, can a Christian have a demon dwelling inside of them?

Yes or no?

Btw, I am not starting this thread in order to set off another all-too-common ruckus here in the BDF. Instead, as we all should already know, if we are honest with ourselves, there are a lot of Christians in this world who are struggling tremendously with things like depression, all sorts of illnesses or diseases, and lust (especially in a sexual sense), and I am seeking to address and determine whether or not things like this could sometimes be directly related to demons dwelling inside of them. In other words, my goal is to potentially help people to be delivered from various torments, and not to set off some sort of free-for-all here, so please present your cases civilly, respectfully, and with scriptural backing.

Thank you.

 

[MsMediator]

What do you mean by "dwelling inside" of them?

 

[Kroogz]

Can a Christian have a demon dwelling inside of them?

Yes or no?

Whatever your position is, please support it with scripture which can then be scrutinized by everybody here in order to determine whether or not those scriptures truly say what anybody here might claim they say in context.

I trust that we all believe that Christians can be oppressed or harassed outwardly by demons, but that is not my question.

Again, can a Christian have a demon dwelling inside of them?

Yes or no?

Btw, I am not starting this thread in order to set off another all-too-common ruckus here in the BDF. Instead, as we all should already know, if we are honest with ourselves, there are a lot of Christians in this world who are struggling tremendously with things like depression, all sorts of illnesses or diseases, and lust (especially in a sexual sense), and I am seeking to address and determine whether or not things like this could sometimes be directly related to demons dwelling inside of them. In other words, my goal is to potentially help people to be delivered from various torments, and not to set off some sort of free-for-all here, so please present your cases civilly, respectfully, and with scriptural backing.

Thank you.

No.
Romans 8:9-11
But you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. Now if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he is not His. And if Christ is in you, the body is dead because of sin, but the Spirit is life because of righteousness. But if the Spirit of Him who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, He who raised Christ from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through His Spirit who dwells in you.

John 14:23
Jesus answered and said to him, "If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word; and My Father will love him, and We will come to him and make Our home with him.

Romans 8:14-17
For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, these are sons of God. For you did not receive the spirit of bondage again to fear, but you received the Spirit of adoption by whom we cry out, "Abba, Father." The Spirit Himself bears witness with our spirit that we are children of God, and if children, then heirs—heirs of God and joint heirs with Christ, if indeed we suffer with Him, that we may also be glorified together.

1 Corinthians 2:10-14
But God has revealed them to us through His Spirit. For the Spirit searches all things, yes, the deep things of God. For what man knows the things of a man except the spirit of the man which is in him? Even so no one knows the things of God except the Spirit of God. Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, that we might know the things that have been freely given to us by God. These things we also speak, not in words which man's wisdom teaches but which the Holy Spirit teaches, comparing spiritual things with spiritual. But the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; nor can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

Colossians 1:27
To them God willed to make known what are the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles: which is Christ in you, the hope of glory.

John 14:16-18
And I will pray the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may abide with you forever— the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees Him nor knows Him; but you know Him, for He dwells with you and will be in you. I will not leave you orphans; I will come to you.

John 14:23
Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.

Isaiah 42:8
8 I am the Lord; that is my name;my glory I give to no other,nor my praise to carved idols.

Isaiah 48:11
11 For my own sake, for my own sake, I do it,for how should my name be profaned?My glory I will not give to another.

Mark 3:25
And if a house be divided against itself, that house cannot stand.

 

[Blain]

I don't think there is scripture that specivically says either or but there are many implications such as the body bieng the temple for the holy spirit or when Jesus encountered a man posessed by the demons he was not a believer in Christ and this was before the holy spirit was shared

Now I wish I could give you scripture for what yuor asking for but as far as I know it is not literally spoken of only implied I mean you never see a believer in Christ posessed by a demon at all but a non believer has more than once been posessed by one or many

 

[keepingthingsreal]

Now I wish I could give you scripture for what yuor asking for but as far as I know it is not literally spoken of only implied I mean you never see a believer in Christ posessed by a demon at all but a non believer has more than once been posessed by one or many

Just as an aside, my question has nothing to do with "possession." Possession implies ownership. What I am asking is can a Christian have a demon inside of them.

 

[keepingthingsreal]

What do you mean by "dwelling inside" of them?

I don't know how to rephrase it any better. Can a Christian have a demon inside of them?

 

[Blain]

Just as an aside, my question has nothing to do with "possession." Possession implies ownership. What I am asking is can a Christian have a demon inside of them.

Well sadly the same thing there is little if any scripture that speaks on it
many implicantions but no actual verses as far as I know

After all think about it can the holy spirit exist with a demon? we hear of the indweling of the holy spirit but not the dweling of a demon

 

[keepingthingsreal]

After all think about it can the holy spirit exist with a demon?

I believe that scripture says that the two can co-exist in the same place at the same time. I will address that at another time. For now, I want to see what other people here think, and the scriptures behind their beliefs.

 

[keepingthingsreal]

No.

Romans 8:9-11
But you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. Now if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he is not His. And if Christ is in you, the body is dead because of sin, but the Spirit is life because of righteousness. But if the Spirit of Him who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, He who raised Christ from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through His Spirit who dwells in you.

John 14:23
Jesus answered and said to him, "If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word; and My Father will love him, and We will come to him and make Our home with him.

Romans 8:14-17
For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, these are sons of God. For you did not receive the spirit of bondage again to fear, but you received the Spirit of adoption by whom we cry out, "Abba, Father." The Spirit Himself bears witness with our spirit that we are children of God, and if children, then heirs—heirs of God and joint heirs with Christ, if indeed we suffer with Him, that we may also be glorified together.

Colossians 1:27
To them God willed to make known what are the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles: which is Christ in you, the hope of glory.

John 14:16-18
And I will pray the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may abide with you forever— the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees Him nor knows Him; but you know Him, for He dwells with you and will be in you. I will not leave you orphans; I will come to you.

All of these verses speak of God, Jesus, or the Holy Spirit dwelling inside of a believer. None of them say that a demon cannot dwell within a believer as well.

Isaiah 42:8
8 I am the Lord; that is my name;my glory I give to no other,nor my praise to carved idols.

Isaiah 48:11
11 For my own sake, for my own sake, I do it,for how should my name be profaned?My glory I will not give to another.

These verses seem irrelevant to me. Anyhow, they say nothing about a believer not being able to have a demon inside of them.

Mark 3:25
And if a house be divided against itself, that house cannot stand.

The context here is that of Satan casting out Satan or of him having a divided kingdom. It says nothing about a believer being incapable of having a demon inside of them.

1 Corinthians 2:10-14
But God has revealed them to us through His Spirit. For the Spirit searches all things, yes, the deep things of God. For what man knows the things of a man except the spirit of the man which is in him? Even so no one knows the things of God except the Spirit of God. Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, that we might know the things that have been freely given to us by God. These things we also speak, not in words which man's wisdom teaches but which the Holy Spirit teaches, comparing spiritual things with spiritual. But the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; nor can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

The context here is what type of Spirit/spirit a believer received when they got saved. This does not necessarily mean that believer was delivered from every demon they might have had prior to that time. I will elaborate on this point at a later time.

 

[Kroogz]

All of these verses speak of God, Jesus, or the Holy Spirit dwelling inside of a believer. None of them say that a demon cannot dwell within a believer as well.
These verses seem irrelevant to me. Anyhow, they say nothing about a believer not being able to have a demon inside of them.
The context here is that of Satan casting out Satan or of him having a divided kingdom. It says nothing about a believer being incapable of having a demon inside of them.

The context here is what type of Spirit/spirit a believer received when they got saved. This does not necessarily mean that believer was delivered from every demon they might have had prior to that time. I will elaborate on this point at a later time.

OK. Thanks.

 

[keepingthingsreal]

OK. Thanks.

Lol.

Was that sarcasm? You are free to offer a rebuttal of your own. Like I said, I am looking for civil and respectful dialogue here. Your input matters, but, as I said from the outset, everything needs to be scrutinized in context.

 

[Kroogz]

Lol.

Was that sarcasm? You are free to offer a rebuttal of your own. Like I said, I am looking for civil and respectful dialogue here. Your input matters, but, as I said from the outset, everything needs to be scrutinized in context.

Nope. No sarcasm. Thanks.

 

[keepingthingsreal]

Nope. No sarcasm. Thanks.

That might be the first time that anybody here has ever thanked me.

What is going on here?

Have I entered into "The Twilight Zone" or something?

"Imagine if you will..."





Just trying to keep things light and friendly here. I know that this is not a humorous topic.

 

[keepingthingsreal]

After all think about it can the holy spirit exist with a demon?

Hey, Blain.

This is a very good question, and all that I ask is for everybody to consider what I am about to say.

I think that we would all probably agree (not that anybody ever seems to agree on anything in the BDF) that one of the arguments against a Christian possibly having a demon inside of them goes something like this.

A Christian's body is the temple of the Holy Ghost, and the Holy Ghost and a demon cannot co-exist in the same temple.

I mean, I have heard that argument many times over the years, and I trust that at least some of you have heard it as well, but I believe that scripture refutes this argument, and I will give you one example of that now.

1Ki 22:13
And the messenger that was gone to call Micaiah spake unto him, saying, Behold now, the words of the prophets declare good unto the king with one mouth: let thy word, I pray thee, be like the word of one of them, and speak that which is good.
1Ki 22:14
And Micaiah said, As the LORD liveth, what the LORD saith unto me, that will I speak.
1Ki 22:15
So he came to the king. And the king said unto him, Micaiah, shall we go against Ramothgilead to battle, or shall we forbear? And he answered him, Go, and prosper: for the LORD shall deliver it into the hand of the king.
1Ki 22:16
And the king said unto him, How many times shall I adjure thee that thou tell me nothing but that which is true in the name of the LORD?
1Ki 22:17
And he said, I saw all Israel scattered upon the hills, as sheep that have not a shepherd: and the LORD said, These have no master: let them return every man to his house in peace.
1Ki 22:18
And the king of Israel said unto Jehoshaphat, Did I not tell thee that he would prophesy no good concerning me, but evil?
1Ki 22:19
And he said, Hear thou therefore the word of the LORD: I saw the LORD sitting on his throne, and all the host of heaven standing by him on his right hand and on his left.
1Ki 22:20
And the LORD said, Who shall persuade Ahab, that he may go up and fall at Ramothgilead? And one said on this manner, and another said on that manner.
1Ki 22:21
And there came forth a spirit, and stood before the LORD, and said, I will persuade him.
1Ki 22:22
And the LORD said unto him, Wherewith? And he said, I will go forth, and I will be a lying spirit in the mouth of all his prophets. And he said, Thou shalt persuade him, and prevail also: go forth, and do so.
1Ki 22:23
Now therefore, behold, the LORD hath put a lying spirit in the mouth of all these thy prophets, and the LORD hath spoken evil concerning thee.

In context, the King of Israel, Ahab, wanted the King of Judah, Jehoshaphat, to join him in battle at Ramothgilead. All of Ahab's false prophets prophesied of victory, but Jehoshaphat wanted to hear from a true prophet of God, and Micaiah was summoned. Pay close attention to what this true prophet of the LORD saw.

In verse 19, he saw the LORD sitting on his throne, and all the host of heaven standing by him on his right hand and on his left hand. This throne, I believe we would all agree (if we are honest), was inside of the temple in heaven. All the host of heaven included different spirits (vss. 20-22) who stood before the LORD, in this temple in heaven, and who offered to go and persuade Ahab that he might go and fall in battle at Ramothgilead (vs. 20). Finally, in verse 22, a spirit was chosen, and it was sent to be a lying spirit in the mouths of all of Ahab's false prophets (vs. 23).

Was this lying spirit a demon or the Holy Spirit, the Spirit of truth?

Obviously, it was a demon, and it was seen in heaven, in the temple, where God, Jesus, and the Holy Spirit/Holy Ghost all reside.

1Jo 5:7
For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.

Seeing how a demon can co-exist with God, Jesus, and the Holy Spirit/Holy Ghost in the literal temple in heaven, why should we believe that they cannot co-exist in the figurative temple (a Christian's body) here on earth?

Do you understand the question?

If you or others do, then I would be curious to hear any of your answers.

Thank you.

 

[Blain]

Hey, Blain.

This is a very good question, and all that I ask is for everybody to consider what I am about to say.

I think that we would all probably agree (not that anybody ever seems to agree on anything in the BDF) that one of the arguments against a Christian possibly having a demon inside of them goes something like this.

A Christian's body is the temple of the Holy Ghost, and the Holy Ghost and a demon cannot co-exist in the same temple.

I mean, I have heard that argument many times over the years, and I trust that at least some of you have heard it as well, but I believe that scripture refutes this argument, and I will give you one example of that now.

1Ki 22:13
And the messenger that was gone to call Micaiah spake unto him, saying, Behold now, the words of the prophets declare good unto the king with one mouth: let thy word, I pray thee, be like the word of one of them, and speak that which is good.
1Ki 22:14
And Micaiah said, As the LORD liveth, what the LORD saith unto me, that will I speak.
1Ki 22:15
So he came to the king. And the king said unto him, Micaiah, shall we go against Ramothgilead to battle, or shall we forbear? And he answered him, Go, and prosper: for the LORD shall deliver it into the hand of the king.
1Ki 22:16
And the king said unto him, How many times shall I adjure thee that thou tell me nothing but that which is true in the name of the LORD?
1Ki 22:17
And he said, I saw all Israel scattered upon the hills, as sheep that have not a shepherd: and the LORD said, These have no master: let them return every man to his house in peace.
1Ki 22:18
And the king of Israel said unto Jehoshaphat, Did I not tell thee that he would prophesy no good concerning me, but evil?
1Ki 22:19
And he said, Hear thou therefore the word of the LORD: I saw the LORD sitting on his throne, and all the host of heaven standing by him on his right hand and on his left.
1Ki 22:20
And the LORD said, Who shall persuade Ahab, that he may go up and fall at Ramothgilead? And one said on this manner, and another said on that manner.
1Ki 22:21
And there came forth a spirit, and stood before the LORD, and said, I will persuade him.
1Ki 22:22
And the LORD said unto him, Wherewith? And he said, I will go forth, and I will be a lying spirit in the mouth of all his prophets. And he said, Thou shalt persuade him, and prevail also: go forth, and do so.
1Ki 22:23
Now therefore, behold, the LORD hath put a lying spirit in the mouth of all these thy prophets, and the LORD hath spoken evil concerning thee.

In context, the King of Israel, Ahab, wanted the King of Judah, Jehoshaphat, to join him in battle at Ramothgilead. All of Ahab's false prophets prophesied of victory, but Jehoshaphat wanted to hear from a true prophet of God, and Micaiah was summoned. Pay close attention to what this true prophet of the LORD saw.

In verse 19, he saw the LORD sitting on his throne, and all the host of heaven standing by him on his right hand and on his left hand. This throne, I believe we would all agree (if we are honest), was inside of the temple in heaven. All the host of heaven included different spirits (vss. 20-22) who stood before the LORD, in this temple in heaven, and who offered to go and persuade Ahab that he might go and fall in battle at Ramothgilead (vs. 20). Finally, in verse 22, a spirit was chosen, and it was sent to be a lying spirit in the mouths of all of Ahab's false prophets (vs. 23).

Was this lying spirit a demon or the Holy Spirit, the Spirit of truth?

Obviously, it was a demon, and it was seen in heaven, in the temple, where God, Jesus, and the Holy Spirit/Holy Ghost all reside.

1Jo 5:7
For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.

Seeing how a demon can co-exist with God, Jesus, and the Holy Spirit/Holy Ghost in the literal temple in heaven, why should we believe that they cannot co-exist in the figurative temple (a Christian's body) here on earth?

Do you understand the question?

If you or others do, then I would be curious to hear any of your answers.

Thank you.

The lying spirit though was to be in the false prophets not the true one so the lying spirit entered the false prophets did it not? not the true prophet which is what one would consider a holy spirit filled servant of God. if we are to assume based on the fact a lying spirit can show up in his throne room that it is meant to say one can with the temple we have now the two are not the same and it is mainly an assumption.

 

[keepingthingsreal]

The lying spirit though was to be in the false prophets not the true one so the lying spirit entered the false prophets did it not? not the true prophet which is what one would consider a holy spirit filled servant of God. if we are to assume based on the fact a lying spirit can show up in his throne room that it is meant to say one can with the temple we have now the two are not the same and it is mainly an assumption.

I understand that the lying spirit was to be in the mouths of the false prophets, but my point is that a demon and the Holy Spirit/Holy Ghost can co-exist in the same temple at the same time as was evidenced in what we just read. Are you willing to at least concede this point? Again, my goal here is not to start or win an argument. Instead, my goal is to see, from scripture, whether or not a Christian can have a demon inside of them, and I am trying to determine the correct answer to this question so that people might be helped or delivered. I hope that you and others here understand my motivation for this thread.

 

[daisyseesthesun]

No.

But Christians can be influenced by demons as Peter was in Matthew 16:23

When we become Christian the temple of the holy Spirit is swept clean "When an unclean spirit goes out of a man, he goes through dry places, seeking rest, and finds none. 44 Then he says, ‘I will return to my house from which I came.’ And when he comes, he finds it empty, swept, and put in order. 45 Then he goes and takes with him seven other spirits more wicked than himself, and they enter and dwell there; and the last state of that man is worse than the first. So shall it also be with this wicked generation."Matthew 12:43-45

But that being said if we go back to their old man ways. The demons will come back in and with seven worse then it. So the state of the man is worse then where he began. This reminds me of that song by Mahalia Jackson How I got over? you know my soul looks back in wonder? And I'm gonna thank God because he never left me.
Possible examples of this are Kanye West and Britney Spears and many others that tried to be good christians but failed.

I never considered that most of people that aren't Christian could be demon possessed by 1 or 2 demons but not to the extent of "I am legion" raving lunatic. But that would explain the devil as ones spiritual father. As the Trinity only exist with the our father.

 

[Blain]

I understand that the lying spirit was to be in the mouths of the false prophets, but my point is that a demon and the Holy Spirit/Holy Ghost can co-exist in the same temple at the same time as was evidenced in what we just read. Are you willing to at least concede this point? Again, my goal here is not to start or win an argument. Instead, my goal is to see, from scripture, whether or not a Christian can have a demon inside of them, and I am trying to determine the correct answer to this question so that people might be helped or delivered. I hope that you and others here understand my motivation for this thread.

Yes but so can the devil also appear before God in his temple remember job?
I think a better example would be when satan entered into Judas I don't remember if he was given the holy spirit or not though but if he did and yet satan entered him then that would make a better point I remember that Jesus breathed on them and they were filled with the holy ghost but I don't know if Judas was one of them

But the temple in which the holy ghost resides and the temple of God are also not the same things yes the devil and lying spirits can exist in his throne room but if we liken that to the same new temple under Christs atonement then that would mean that he has only one kind of temple which he does not.

But I will say I think there is something to be said about Judas what do you think

 

[keepingthingsreal]

Yes but so can the devil also appear before God in his temple remember job?
I think a better example would be when satan entered into Judas I don't remember if he was given the holy spirit or not though but if he did and yet satan entered him then that would make a better point I remember that Jesus breathed on them and they were filled with the holy ghost but I don't know if Judas was one of them

But I will say I think there is something to be said about Judas what do you think

Jesus breathed on them after he rose from the dead (John 20:22), and after Judas had hung himself.

 

[keepingthingsreal]

But the temple in which the holy ghost resides and the temple of God are also not the same things yes the devil and lying spirits can exist in his throne room but if we liken that to the same new temple under Christs atonement then that would mean that he has only one kind of temple which he does not.

I am not suggesting that they are the same temple, but if demons can co-exist with God, Jesus, and the Holy Spirit/Holy Ghost in the literal temple, then why would we think that they cannot co-exist in the figurative temple or in Christian's bodies? I mean, the former temple had Christ's blood brought into it in order to purchase our redemption (Heb. 9:12) or our figurative temples were purchased by that same blood, so I believe that there is a comparison to be made.

Anyhow, the only concession that I am seeking at this point in our conversation is that demons and the Holy Ghost/Holy Spirit can co-exist in the same place at the same time, and this truth is evidenced by what we read earlier.