Evidently you are confused.
Cameron143 said:
But I disagree that his motivation was selfless in partaking of the fruit.
There will be no Rapture!!!
- Thread starter Romans1012
- Start date
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
Cameron143 said:
But I disagree that his motivation was selfless in partaking of the fruit.
The operative, spiritual judgment of Adam and Eve was that they were “one flesh”. This superseded the physical evidence that they were two separate people.
Because of this, that God saw them as “one flesh”, had Adam not eaten the fruit he would have redeemed Eve by his faithfulness to God. God, by His own judgment, could not have removed Eve and kept Adam whole. By remaining true to God Adam would have become the Lord of all.
Because of this, that God saw them as “one flesh”, had Adam not eaten the fruit he would have redeemed Eve by his faithfulness to God. God, by His own judgment, could not have removed Eve and kept Adam whole. By remaining true to God Adam would have become the Lord of all.
before Adam sinned, there was no death in him, because death only enters through sin.
so Adam did have eternal life - it wasn't something he had to 'attain' - but something he lost when he added death to himself by sin.
Romans 5:12
Therefore, just as through one man sin entered the world, and death through sin, and thus death spread to all men, because all sinned
this isn't the same as the eternal life given to him, and to us through Christ, because we now have sin atoned for.Adam had life without sin, and the freedom to reject it. after he sinned, we all have death with sin, and the freedom to receive life through the promise of God, the finished redemptive work of the Son.
Adam, like Christ, was under a works covenant. In order to receive eternal life, he would have to fulfill all righteousness. He would have to be the end of righteousness for his lone law.
Also, eternal life is less than eternal life if it can be lost.
It was Adam, who decided to join the Woman in sin. By an act of his own free will and no other.
God had nothing to do with it.
I think not.
Adam was not laboring to keep anything. Or earn anything. Or pay for anything.
Nor was Adam expecting, requiring or demanding doggie treats from some infinite cosmic vending machine by his works.
if i warn you that this is poison, are you under a law against drinking it?
the apostle wrote saying 'be careful you don't bite and devour each other, or you will be consumed by each other!' - but we aren't under the law, or a covenant of works.
in any case God having warned Adam was prohibitive, not proscriptive. there wasn't anything he had to 'do' to have life - he was created with it: there was something he could choose to do, to have death. in this sense Adam was nothing like those under Moses.
And the LORD commanded the man....Genesis 2:16.
Yes it was prohibited, just like every other commandment that says...thou shalt not...
And every one of those are covenental.
If Adam is not in covenant with God, he cannot represent mankind.
why not?
he was the only man that existed - was it possible he would not represent himself?
was there ever any doubt Christ would do everything He sent Himself to do?
Do you believe the Father and Son were in covenant relationship?
We know from Romans 5 that he represented mankind.
You're so bold because you probably think you're so old that you won't ever get to see the antichrist be revealed - but what if you ARE still around when that happens?
Agreed. The real Biblical rapture is Post-Tribulation. It says so plainly in 1 Thess 4. Just read it. Believers will be caught up (1) only after the saints rise again and (2) the saints rise again on the last day (John 6:40). Therefore, the rapture happens only at the end of time.
"13 Brothers and sisters, we do not want you to be uninformed about those who sleep in death, so that you do not grieve like the rest of mankind, who have no hope. 14 For we believe that Jesus died and rose again, and so we believe that God will bring with Jesus those who have fallen asleep in him. 15 According to the Lord’s word, we tell you that we who are still alive, who are left until the coming of the Lord, will certainly not precede those who have fallen asleep. 16 For the Lord himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first. 17 After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord forever. "
Good insights here. Listen from about 45 mins onward.^ @cv5 , yep... that's pretty much exactly what I've been saying... (for many years).
Yeah, I believe it will correspond more with Jesus' FIRST ascension (on His Resurrection Day / ON Firstfruit--Lev23:10-12 / 1Cor15:20 / Jn20:17); and that His Second Coming TO THE EARTH corresponds more with His SECOND time of going up (Acts 1--which was "VISIBLE" in their sight)--with some "40 DAYS" intervening;
IOW, the PATTERN is consistent.
Really the Rapture is a conclusive open and shut case.
There is no wiggle room. I just hope people will come to understand this.
Also.....the The 5 Fold Lies of Satan from about 50 mins onward.
Amazing truths.
https://www.sermonaudio.com/solo/cliffside/sermons/9101132540/
I just now noticed this thread when it popped back to the front, so while I agree with JJ we should remember that the only crucial doctrine related to eschatology is the omega miracle of resurrection to judgment. (Did we really need 157 pages for the rest of it? :^)
Uhm, those prophesies REPEATEDLY speak about believers being deceived by false prophets/teachers/leaders, to the point where they will depart from the faith. They also warn us to PREPARE for what's coming, not to try and stop what has been prophesied. I think keeping brothers and sisters from separating from their faith would be the most important past of all this.