It's never clear enough, brother...
(Just messin' with you, brother - you threw that door wide open and I just couldn't resist.)
The word of God is not a secret code that needs unlocked.
- Thread starter Brasspen
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(Just messin' with you, brother - you threw that door wide open and I just couldn't resist.)
No it doesn't. Every man is created with a spirit.
[Pro 20:27 KJV] 27 The spirit of man [is] the candle of the LORD, searching all the inward parts of the belly.
[Ecc 3:21 KJV] 21 Who knoweth the spirit of man that goeth upward, and the spirit of the beast that goeth downward to the earth?
[Zec 12:1 KJV] 1 The burden of the word of the LORD for Israel, saith the LORD, which stretcheth forth the heavens, and layeth the foundation of the earth, and formeth the spirit of man within him.
[1Co 2:11 KJV] 11 For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God.
[Job 32:8 KJV] 8 But [there is] a spirit in man: and the inspiration of the Almighty giveth them understanding.
[Ecc 8:8 KJV] 8 [There is] no man that hath power over the spirit to retain the spirit; neither [hath he] power in the day of death: and [there is] no discharge in [that] war; neither shall wickedness deliver those that are given to it.
Revelation 13:18, as stated in the KJV, speaks to those who already possess wisdom, implying they should have the knowledge and experience necessary to calculate a particular number—666—attached with its specific meaning. Many, perhaps including yourself, may not have delved into the study of Biblical Numerics or fully grasp how statistical probabilities work. I encourage you to explore Brandon Peterson’s recent micro-pattern series on YouTube. The patterns he reveals are far too complex to dismiss as mere coincidence. To deny the significance behind them without proper understanding is a missed opportunity for deeper insight.
Figures like Mark Ward and Jonathan Burris have tried to challenge Peterson’s findings. In a conversation I had with Burris, when I used the Bible to explain the reasoning behind Peterson’s patterns, he had no response and failed to acknowledge that my points were rooted in Scripture. As for Ward, his attempt to refute Biblical Numerics lacked depth and fell short in comparison to Peterson’s work. It seems Ward's hope is that people will trust his argument without prayerfully watching the video and genuinely seeking the truth.
Some critics of the KJV argue against its status as the perfect Word of God by pointing to the KJV preface and citing printing errors found in earlier editions. This is truly sad and shows lack of careful thought on this subject.
Would these also be your arguments against the KJV?
So you believe that that all reputable Modern Bibles are all word perfect and have no errors?
Why shouldn't we simply trust the Bible when it plainly states that God's words are perfect and will be preserved for all generations? How is it 'cultic' to believe the Bible exactly as it’s written? There’s no clear scriptural evidence that these promises refer only to doctrines or general truths. In fact, claiming they do would be a far more cultic view, since that idea isn’t found anywhere in the Bible.
Unless you believe that the NIV and NASB are completely error-free and word-perfect, they cannot be considered the authentic or true Word of God. The genuine Word of God would be holy and divine, not 'holey'—a book riddled with holes and errors.
They are not baseless. You don’t believe the KJV is the perfect and inerrant Word of God. You have a bias or preference for Modern Scholarship and Modern Bibles.
Not at all. Bart Ehrman and Rick Beckman are two individuals who have apostatized from the faith directly as a result of their involvement in Textual Criticism. This would not have happened if they simply trusted in the promises of God by faith.
When you overlook the context of Daniel 3:28, you're not fully engaging with the facts that need correction. I've been corrected by other believers on forums like this before. It’s rare, but it has happened—especially when someone points out a verse that helps me correct my understanding of another piece of Scripture. This is not to boast, but to merely encourage you to do the same.
Given our previous discussion, do you think that by not considering Daniel 3:28 as part of the context, you might be approaching this topic with a certain bias, potentially interpreting details that aren’t actually there?
This demonstrates a misunderstanding of the topic. For instance, earlier editions of the NIV describe Jesus healing a leper with compassion (Mark 1:41). However, the latest edition of the NIV now depicts Jesus healing the leper with indignation. In the context, no clear reason is given for His anger, which contradicts Jesus’ teaching in Matthew 5:22, where He warns that being angry without cause puts one in danger of judgment.
Imagine trying to use the sleep emoji to get a job interview—it probably wouldn’t go over well. Likewise, using it while attempting to impress a woman would likely make her lose interest quickly. Now think about how God feels when you show disinterest (like using a sleep emoji) during a Bible discussion. I’m not saying this to wound you, but to encourage you to grow and be better. To inspire you to be the Christian hero God calls you to be.
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when you are praising kjv instead of praising Jesus, i really don't care how many numbers you have, your equation is unbalanced.
Its clear to me that every man may CHOOSE to heed God's command
to seek His face, love Him, obey Him. Those commands cannot be and are not an hoax or a cruel joke.
But men CHOOSE to ignore the calling of the Holy Ghost.
And impenitence leads inexorably to this state:
Rom 1:28 - And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;
Maybe I made a mistake in the way I characterized it. Certainly He is drawing all people to Himself. But That doesn't change the fact that the things of God are hidden from those who are without the Spirit (because it is the Spirit who reveals them).
Who gets the Spirit that gives wisdom and insight into the mind of God?
Anybody who asks.
Luk 11:13
If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children: how much more shall your heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to them that ask him?
Tragically the super-determinist hyper-Calvinists deny that anyone even has the capacity to ask.
No verse in all the Bible has been so horribly disfigured as this one.
There has grown from it an entire set of doctrines that are......specious.
And worse, demand that it is God Himself that is the author of evil.
Which is precisely the same accusation that Satan has made over and over again. Quite successfully.
1Co 2:14
But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
Its almost like prefaces we see in our modern bibles today.
The translators, in effect, admitted that there can be no perfect translation.
Its weird how the KJV Only folks insist and claim its the perfect translation!
When the King James Version of the Bible came off the press of Robert Barker in 1611,
it contained an eleven-page preface titled “The Translators to the Reader.”
This preface is primarily a defense of the new translation, but it also provides important
information about the translators’ views on the subject of Bible translation.
https://dbts.edu/2012/04/09/the-embarrassing-preface-to-the-king-james-version/
I also ENLARGED the words "the Lord" in my post.
Because that [that part] was INCLUDED in what I am pointing out about how the other words ("present" and "before"--these Hebrew words) are used (elsewhere in Scripture) to speak of HUMANS (located ON THE EARTH) are doing this.
I hoped you would yourself look that up, to SEE whether these things (I'm pointing out) ARE SO.
Of course, we all know this. But that's beside the point
(beside the point that I AM POINTING OUT, specifically.)
I'm pointing out that, the fact there is OTHER places using THESE HEBREW WORDS (I've underlined / emphasized), yet is speaking of HUMANS who are LOCATED ON THE EARTH doing this, negates your claim that this "naturally" must be the case that the place is "IN HEAVEN".
I wouldn't have brought it up, otherwise.
All I'm asking is that you CHECK IT OUT (feel free to PROVE OTHERWISE, as to what point I'm actually making... Not one I'm NOT making. haha)
Repeatedly in Job 1 & 2, the phrase "there became a day" is used (or however you want to read that phrase). I don't see any passage elsewhere in Scripture where this speaks of "[there became a day] UP IN HEAVEN". I've not seen one. Maybe you can point one out to me??
I DO see, however, that Job chapter 1, verses 4-5 (just prior to 1:6), it talks about "when the days of their feasting were finished" and how Job then "offered burnt offerings according to the number of them"... and "Thus Job did continually."
(The verses which follow aren't changing the subject ENTIRELY. Even though, as we might say, it may be starting a new "paragraph".)
In Job 1:6 (KJV), we read:
"Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan came also among them."
This verse shows that the "sons of God," understood to be angels, are presenting themselves before the Lord. The setting described here doesn't specify an earthly location like the tabernacle or temple, which we see in other parts of Scripture. Instead, it reflects a gathering in the spiritual realm, commonly understood as Heaven. The fact that Satan also comes to present himself, and the Lord asks him about his activity "going to and fro in the earth" (Job 1:7), implies that this meeting is happening in a realm outside of the physical earth—indicating a heavenly setting.
Now, when it comes to human beings presenting themselves before the Lord, we do have instances where this takes place in specific earthly locations. For example, in Deuteronomy 31:14-15, Moses and Joshua are instructed to present themselves before the Lord in the tent of meeting:
Deuteronomy 31:14 (KJV):
"And the LORD said unto Moses, Behold, thy days approach that thou must die: call Joshua, and present yourselves in the tabernacle of the congregation, that I may give him a charge."
In this passage, the Lord appears in the tent of meeting in a visible manifestation, a pillar of cloud (verse 15), as a sign of His presence on earth. This is an earthly event, whereas the scene in Job clearly points to a spiritual or heavenly court where angels, not humans, present themselves before the Lord.
The distinction here is that in Deuteronomy, God is manifesting His presence on earth, while in Job, the setting involves angels in the spiritual realm, where no physical earthly location is mentioned, leading many Christians to logically conclude this is taking place in Heaven.
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You make it sound like God cannot even communicate to people today using the Bible.
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That is just silly and dumb. The words that come from God (in the Bible) is a part of His own mind unless you simply desire to lobotomize God or seek to take a magic marker to wipe out His words. Besides, I have catalogued 40 places in Scripture where there is a connection between the Living Word (Jesus) and the Communicated Word (like Scripture). But this is not surprising you are hostile to the authority of Scripture. Your own Modern Bibles teach you to think that way. Ironically, one such example is in John 5:39 in the trojan horse update of the KJV known as the NKJV.
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Bible Highlighter said:
God’s Word says the Scriptures are holy (1 Timothy 3:15).
Many covers of the Bible say, "Holy Bible."
Something that is holy from God does not have errors.
So if you believe the Bible has errors in it, then you must conclude that the cover of your Modern Bibles are lying to you when it says, "Holy Bible." In reality, it should say, "holey bible" a book full of holes and errors.
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Psalms 12:6-7 (KJV)
6 "The words of the LORD are pure words: as silver tried in a furnace of earth, purified seven times.
7 Thou shalt keep them, O LORD, thou shalt preserve them from this generation for ever."
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