A Challenge facing our nation right now

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Feb 25, 2024
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#1
The Gospel of Christ, and political extremism, a challenge facing our nation right now (please read to the end)

It is deeply disturbing to me to have witnessed the politicizing of Christianity in this nation. The conjoining of politics and faith have led to a polarization of our nation that has not been seen since just prior to the Civil War. In our having politicized Christianity, we've reduced the Gospel of Christ to a battle between political and social issues that have alienated many from the ultimate message of Christ, that we are in need of redemption, and that repentance and conversion of heart are to become the priority of each and every one of us.

By insisting that we are still a Christian nation, we've allowed a polarization to take place that has pushed Christianity to the brink, having linked values, and moral teachings that are based on the Gospels, while the world around us has become jaded, even hostile, to whatever Christians have to say. Thus, the primary message of the Gospel is dismissed before people can even be brought through the door of our churches.

Today's youth are leaving Christianity in droves, as has been demonstrated in the demographics of America's "Bible Belt". The number of young people, even in the conservative South, who are giving birth out of wedlock, or having abortions, has skyrocketed. The support of civil marriage for same sex partners has increased dramatically. These moral issues are of course a concern for Christians, but our acceptance of the moral standards set forth in the Scriptures, are received by us, not as law, but as a result of our personal encounter with Christ. Legislative action ignores the fact that Christ changes the heart, and a society that is to be transformed, must see this transformation take place in the hearts of its people. For we Christians to foist our beliefs upon the nation, only creates resentment, and Christophobia.

Society must be transformed, but it can not be done by force of law. It must be done by bringing Christ to the center of our national scene. This can only be done when Christian love and charity rule, and when the nation can see in it's Christian peoples, an honesty of heart, and a authentic witness to Christ that is not based on angry polarization that contributes nothing but distrust and disunity.

Chuck Colson, who was one of President Nixon's Watergate people, and who, during his incarceration in prison, converted to Christ, said: “We made a big mistake in the ’80s by politicizing the Gospel … We [thought] that we could solve the deteriorating moral state of our culture by electing good guys. That’s nonsense. Now people are kind of realizing it was a mistake."

Change must begin with us, not with our society. Laws will not make this a Christian nation, for many of these very laws some politicians would enact, are also the basis of Islamic law. Biblical morality can only become an integral part of our nation, when we, as a people, have taken Christ into our hearts, and allowed the Holy Spirit to change us.

As Christians, we must not detract from the central message of the Gospels, by making it appear to be a part of one political party. To do so will eventually lead to the total discrediting of the institution of the Church. History has proven, time and again, that the Church must remain aloof from political parties or movements, for when the party is out of office, so is the Church’s influence. It must come with the conversion of her people.

Now that America’s extremist right wing groups have become emboldened, leftist have begun to fill their ranks with their own extremists, and the polarization of our country seems poised for another civil war. The Christianizing of this nation cannot be the result of legislation, political extremism, and blood letting between waring factions, but built upon a respect for the opinions of others, and the influence of committed Christians, whose lives are centered in the love of the Prince of Peace.
 

ThereRoseaLamb

Well-known member
Jan 17, 2023
4,732
2,025
113
#2
The Gospel of Christ, and political extremism, a challenge facing our nation right now (please read to the end)

It is deeply disturbing to me to have witnessed the politicizing of Christianity in this nation. The conjoining of politics and faith have led to a polarization of our nation that has not been seen since just prior to the Civil War. In our having politicized Christianity, we've reduced the Gospel of Christ to a battle between political and social issues that have alienated many from the ultimate message of Christ, that we are in need of redemption, and that repentance and conversion of heart are to become the priority of each and every one of us.

By insisting that we are still a Christian nation, we've allowed a polarization to take place that has pushed Christianity to the brink, having linked values, and moral teachings that are based on the Gospels, while the world around us has become jaded, even hostile, to whatever Christians have to say. Thus, the primary message of the Gospel is dismissed before people can even be brought through the door of our churches.

Today's youth are leaving Christianity in droves, as has been demonstrated in the demographics of America's "Bible Belt". The number of young people, even in the conservative South, who are giving birth out of wedlock, or having abortions, has skyrocketed. The support of civil marriage for same sex partners has increased dramatically. These moral issues are of course a concern for Christians, but our acceptance of the moral standards set forth in the Scriptures, are received by us, not as law, but as a result of our personal encounter with Christ. Legislative action ignores the fact that Christ changes the heart, and a society that is to be transformed, must see this transformation take place in the hearts of its people. For we Christians to foist our beliefs upon the nation, only creates resentment, and Christophobia.

Society must be transformed, but it can not be done by force of law. It must be done by bringing Christ to the center of our national scene. This can only be done when Christian love and charity rule, and when the nation can see in it's Christian peoples, an honesty of heart, and a authentic witness to Christ that is not based on angry polarization that contributes nothing but distrust and disunity.

Chuck Colson, who was one of President Nixon's Watergate people, and who, during his incarceration in prison, converted to Christ, said: “We made a big mistake in the ’80s by politicizing the Gospel … We [thought] that we could solve the deteriorating moral state of our culture by electing good guys. That’s nonsense. Now people are kind of realizing it was a mistake."

Change must begin with us, not with our society. Laws will not make this a Christian nation, for many of these very laws some politicians would enact, are also the basis of Islamic law. Biblical morality can only become an integral part of our nation, when we, as a people, have taken Christ into our hearts, and allowed the Holy Spirit to change us.

As Christians, we must not detract from the central message of the Gospels, by making it appear to be a part of one political party. To do so will eventually lead to the total discrediting of the institution of the Church. History has proven, time and again, that the Church must remain aloof from political parties or movements, for when the party is out of office, so is the Church’s influence. It must come with the conversion of her people.

Now that America’s extremist right wing groups have become emboldened, leftist have begun to fill their ranks with their own extremists, and the polarization of our country seems poised for another civil war. The Christianizing of this nation cannot be the result of legislation, political extremism, and blood letting between waring factions, but built upon a respect for the opinions of others, and the influence of committed Christians, whose lives are centered in the love of the Prince of Peace.

Best answer I've heard...
https://www.facebook.com/reel/1029633367992972
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
26,074
13,771
113
#3
Now that America’s extremist right wing groups have become emboldened, leftist have begun to fill their ranks with their own extremists, and the polarization of our country seems poised for another civil war.
What a wonderful way to TWIST THE TRUTH. "America's extremist right" is a vile canard against law-abiding and conservative and Christian citizens who do not want Communism and tyranny.

It is not that they who became "emboldened" but they were marginalized and called "Nazis" and "terrorists" by the left. This has all been documented. And the Leftists have been extremists long before that, promoting lawlessness and hatred in order to polarize the country. The record of the DNC convention in Chicago proves this. One Democrat after another after another was simply spewing hatred for Trump and the Republicans.

Who wants civil war? It is the Democrats and Leftists. Read the news.
Maxine Waters: There Will Be Violence & ‘More Killings’ If Trump Wins Election (infowars.com)

So if you are here as a shill for Kamala Harris, go somewhere else. Do not promote Leftist lies and garbage. This is a spiritual battle, and you are on the side of darkness.
 
Feb 25, 2024
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#4
I'm not advocating for neutrality. I'm advocating for choosing Christ. "In this world you will have tribulation..." And again, "when someone strikes you on the cheek, turn to him the other also." We are in the world, but are not of the world. "Rejoice, and be exceeding glad..."

I'm not expecting to be "left alone." I'm looking to remain faithful and persevere. I'm not going to get caught up in godless fights and propose godless solutions. God is in control. He is my Savior, not any politician.

Don't lose your soul to politics and the doctrines of men.
 

SomeDisciple

Well-known member
Jul 4, 2021
2,240
1,038
113
#5
The conjoining of politics and faith have led to a polarization of our nation that has not been seen since just prior to the Civil War.
The current polarization is mainly the result of the left's bad policies. Advocating for good government is not the "conjoining of politics and religion".
By insisting that we are still a Christian nation, we've allowed a polarization to take place that has pushed Christianity to the brink, having linked values, and moral teachings that are based on the Gospels, while the world around us has become jaded, even hostile, to whatever Christians have to say. Thus, the primary message of the Gospel is dismissed before people can even be brought through the door of our churches.
The world's opposition to the Church is nothing new... this has been going on since John the Baptist. If you're upset because someone is rejecting church's message; wait till they start crucifying you and cutting off your heads. The polarization hasn't even come from the Church, though- it came from the political left moving to the far-left.
Legislative action "ignores" nothing. Indeed, you don't preach or evangelize with legislation; but that doesn't mean you can't have good laws. Do you want to de-criminalize rape and murder?
Society must be transformed, but it can not be done by force of law.
On this we agree.
Change must begin with us, not with our society. Laws will not make this a Christian nation, for many of these very laws some politicians would enact, are also the basis of Islamic law. Biblical morality can only become an integral part of our nation, when we, as a people, have taken Christ into our hearts, and allowed the Holy Spirit to change us.
True.
History has proven, time and again, that the Church must remain aloof from political parties or movements, for when the party is out of office, so is the Church’s influence.
Sorry; but none of that is true. Christian withdrawal from politics only invites the acceptance of corruption and evil.
Now that America’s extremist right wing groups have become emboldened, leftist have begun to fill their ranks with their own extremists, and the polarization of our country seems poised for another civil war.
That's kinda rubbish. Right wing extremism is marginal; and has been since the 1990's.

There is an clear-as-day secular communist movement on the political left that has initiated the polarization in the US. This wasn't some kind of "reaction" to right wing extremism. Ask the Libertarians who are now being "accused" of being conservatives; all because they don't want to go along with it.
 

ResidentAlien

Well-known member
Apr 21, 2021
8,236
3,576
113
#6
The Gospel of Christ, and political extremism, a challenge facing our nation right now (please read to the end)

It is deeply disturbing to me to have witnessed the politicizing of Christianity in this nation. The conjoining of politics and faith have led to a polarization of our nation that has not been seen since just prior to the Civil War. In our having politicized Christianity, we've reduced the Gospel of Christ to a battle between political and social issues that have alienated many from the ultimate message of Christ, that we are in need of redemption, and that repentance and conversion of heart are to become the priority of each and every one of us.

By insisting that we are still a Christian nation, we've allowed a polarization to take place that has pushed Christianity to the brink, having linked values, and moral teachings that are based on the Gospels, while the world around us has become jaded, even hostile, to whatever Christians have to say. Thus, the primary message of the Gospel is dismissed before people can even be brought through the door of our churches.

Today's youth are leaving Christianity in droves, as has been demonstrated in the demographics of America's "Bible Belt". The number of young people, even in the conservative South, who are giving birth out of wedlock, or having abortions, has skyrocketed. The support of civil marriage for same sex partners has increased dramatically. These moral issues are of course a concern for Christians, but our acceptance of the moral standards set forth in the Scriptures, are received by us, not as law, but as a result of our personal encounter with Christ. Legislative action ignores the fact that Christ changes the heart, and a society that is to be transformed, must see this transformation take place in the hearts of its people. For we Christians to foist our beliefs upon the nation, only creates resentment, and Christophobia.

Society must be transformed, but it can not be done by force of law. It must be done by bringing Christ to the center of our national scene. This can only be done when Christian love and charity rule, and when the nation can see in it's Christian peoples, an honesty of heart, and a authentic witness to Christ that is not based on angry polarization that contributes nothing but distrust and disunity.

Chuck Colson, who was one of President Nixon's Watergate people, and who, during his incarceration in prison, converted to Christ, said: “We made a big mistake in the ’80s by politicizing the Gospel … We [thought] that we could solve the deteriorating moral state of our culture by electing good guys. That’s nonsense. Now people are kind of realizing it was a mistake."

Change must begin with us, not with our society. Laws will not make this a Christian nation, for many of these very laws some politicians would enact, are also the basis of Islamic law. Biblical morality can only become an integral part of our nation, when we, as a people, have taken Christ into our hearts, and allowed the Holy Spirit to change us.

As Christians, we must not detract from the central message of the Gospels, by making it appear to be a part of one political party. To do so will eventually lead to the total discrediting of the institution of the Church. History has proven, time and again, that the Church must remain aloof from political parties or movements, for when the party is out of office, so is the Church’s influence. It must come with the conversion of her people.

Now that America’s extremist right wing groups have become emboldened, leftist have begun to fill their ranks with their own extremists, and the polarization of our country seems poised for another civil war. The Christianizing of this nation cannot be the result of legislation, political extremism, and blood letting between waring factions, but built upon a respect for the opinions of others, and the influence of committed Christians, whose lives are centered in the love of the Prince of Peace.
Amen. Christians don't respond with fear. Fear is all the Christian nationalists know. Christians walk in love for God and their neighbors; perfect love casts out fear.
 

Mem

Senior Member
Sep 23, 2014
7,123
2,152
113
#7
And again, "when someone strikes you on the cheek, turn to him the other also." We are in the world, but are not of the world. "Rejoice, and be exceeding glad..."

I'm not expecting to be "left alone." I'm looking to remain faithful and persevere. I'm not going to get caught up in godless fights and propose godless solutions. God is in control. He is my Savior, not any politician.
Amen. Christians don't respond with fear. Fear is all the Christian nationalists know. Christians walk in love for God and their neighbors; perfect love casts out fear.
If I'm struck on the cheek for calling someone a liar, I'll offer them the other cheek which says I'm telling the truth.
 

ThereRoseaLamb

Well-known member
Jan 17, 2023
4,732
2,025
113
#8
I'm not advocating for neutrality. I'm advocating for choosing Christ. "In this world you will have tribulation..." And again, "when someone strikes you on the cheek, turn to him the other also." We are in the world, but are not of the world. "Rejoice, and be exceeding glad..."

I'm not expecting to be "left alone." I'm looking to remain faithful and persevere. I'm not going to get caught up in godless fights and propose godless solutions. God is in control. He is my Savior, not any politician.

Don't lose your soul to politics and the doctrines of men.

I understand what you are saying. But Christ isn't on either ticket, so we have to choose who to vote for. Then the question is who to vote for. There once was a middle ground and Christians felt comfortable to vote either or. Unfortunately it's not like that anymore, like the video said. There were times in the Bible that people had to take part in politics, guided by God. We must do that today.
 

Mem

Senior Member
Sep 23, 2014
7,123
2,152
113
#9
Your mother might not approve of your choice. But if she has raised you to take personal responsibility. Then taking that responsibility, which is anything but easy, upon yourself would be honoring her. "I've come to set mother against daughter."
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
26,074
13,771
113
#10
I understand what you are saying. But Christ isn't on either ticket, so we have to choose who to vote for.
You are quite right. Lawful citizens have a duty to vote and vote for the best possible candidate. But putting Christ into this to create confusion is just a tactic. Here is what Christ says: Render therefore to all their dues: tribute to whom tribute is due; custom to whom custom; fear to whom fear; honour to whom honour. (Rom 13:7)

What is "due" to a candidate who requires votes? A vote. Should Trump receive honor for facing danger and not running away? For facing hatred from every side, and not running away? For facing unjust persecution and not running away? Absolutely.
 
Feb 25, 2024
48
40
18
#11
The current polarization is mainly the result of the left's bad policies. Advocating for good government is not the "conjoining of politics and religion".

The world's opposition to the Church is nothing new... this has been going on since John the Baptist. If you're upset because someone is rejecting church's message; wait till they start crucifying you and cutting off your heads. The polarization hasn't even come from the Church, though- it came from the political left moving to the far-left.
Legislative action "ignores" nothing. Indeed, you don't preach or evangelize with legislation; but that doesn't mean you can't have good laws. Do you want to de-criminalize rape and murder?

On this we agree.

True.

Sorry; but none of that is true. Christian withdrawal from politics only invites the acceptance of corruption and evil.

That's kinda rubbish. Right wing extremism is marginal; and has been since the 1990's.

There is an clear-as-day secular communist movement on the political left that has initiated the polarization in the US. This wasn't some kind of "reaction" to right wing extremism. Ask the Libertarians who are now being "accused" of being conservatives; all because they don't want to go along with it.
Thank you for your reply. "It is better to trust in the Lord than to trust in princes." Being inclusive of other religions and cultures does not persecute the church. We are not the Taliban...we are not insecure in our faith. We know how things turn out in the end. Jesus Christ is the Victor. We don't need to embrace and promote a dictator who we think will instill peace for Christians...we love and embrace the eternal Prince of Peace.

Don't lose your soul to politics and the doctrines of men in search of comfort and superficial appearances in this world.
 
Feb 25, 2024
48
40
18
#12
I understand what you are saying. But Christ isn't on either ticket, so we have to choose who to vote for. Then the question is who to vote for. There once was a middle ground and Christians felt comfortable to vote either or. Unfortunately it's not like that anymore, like the video said. There were times in the Bible that people had to take part in politics, guided by God. We must do that today.
Thank you for your reply. Yes, we should take part in the voting process and do our duty as citizens of the "one nation under God." But we need not vote for an AntiChrist who's only purpose is to divide and conquer for his own ambitions, just because it appears (for now) that he's supporting some church ideals. Satan himself often appears as an angel of light, yet ultimately leads people to darkness.

We don't maintain nor expand the Body if Christ through laws and legislation. Only through the transformation of the heart. We should offer people Christ, not laws. The building up of the body of Christ was given to the church not to politicians. Don't get caught up in politics and the doctrines of men. Christians will thrive when they focused on the work God has ordained the Church to do rather than trying to pawn that work off in politicians.

"Little children, flee from idols."
 

daisyseesthesun

Well-known member
Aug 23, 2024
608
333
63
#13
Thank you for your reply. Yes, we should take part in the voting process and do our duty as citizens of the "one nation under God." But we need not vote for an AntiChrist who's only purpose is to divide and conquer for his own ambitions, just because it appears (for now) that he's supporting some church ideals. Satan himself often appears as an angel of light, yet ultimately leads people to darkness.

We don't maintain nor expand the Body if Christ through laws and legislation. Only through the transformation of the heart. We should offer people Christ, not laws. The building up of the body of Christ was given to the church not to politicians. Don't get caught up in politics and the doctrines of men. Christians will thrive when they focused on the work God has ordained the Church to do rather than trying to pawn that work off in politicians.

"Little children, flee from idols."



Trump has never had the evangelical vote. The media has portrayed the Right as the Christian conservative party but the majority of us Christians have been independent/moderates for years.



i know you are worried about the political situation in the USA and how Trump's nationalism/Biden's liberalism has polarized the USA. But you have to remember this is all in God's hands.


"the first thought which came into my mind. was that in the bible the words "don't be afraid" appear 366 times. Once for every day of the year and because there an extra day of the leap year it is not 365 times but 366 times. I knew that even in the van of the secret police I am in the hands of the almighty God and this gave quiet to my heart" Richard Wurmbrand


12And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold. 13But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved. 14And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations;
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
26,074
13,771
113
#14
But we need not vote for an AntiChrist who's only purpose is to divide and conquer for his own ambitions...
More Leftist lies about Trump (whose name was left out). Had that said "her" ambitions, it would have been more accurate and just. Harris is a very evil Satanist woman who primary ambition is to utterly destroy America and convert it into a Communist country. Dividing and conquering is her specialty.

So what we have in your posts is simply shilling for Harris, who is the enemy of God and Christ. Justify that to God if you can. Your veneer of Christianity won't fool God.
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
26,074
13,771
113
#15
“She's much more skillful than I have ever seen. She's a liar on the deepest level,” Carlson said. “The things she is saying right now are not just untrue - they're the opposite of the truth, which is the hallmark of evil.” -- Tucker Carlson

The chaos and evil created by the Biden/Harris regime has been blamed on Trump.
 

JayBird

Active member
Aug 15, 2024
792
83
28
#16
“She's much more skillful than I have ever seen. She's a liar on the deepest level,” Carlson said. “The things she is saying right now are not just untrue - they're the opposite of the truth, which is the hallmark of evil.” -- Tucker Carlson
I wouldn't be quoting Carlson, given how it was revealed in a lawsuit that he 1) hates Trump "passionately", and 2) he encouraged Fox News to lie so they wouldn't lose viewers.
 

daisyseesthesun

Well-known member
Aug 23, 2024
608
333
63
#18
I wouldn't be quoting Carlson, given how it was revealed in a lawsuit that he 1) hates Trump "passionately", and 2) he encouraged Fox News to lie so they wouldn't lose viewers.
I hold Tucker Carlson responsible for the death of Alexei Navalny. You couldn't quote someone i detest more. Tucker went over there to that tyrant and puffed up his ego then 7 days later Alexei dead.
 

JayBird

Active member
Aug 15, 2024
792
83
28
#20
I hold Tucker Carlson responsible for the death of Alexei Navalny. You couldn't quote someone i detest more. Tucker went over there to that tyrant and puffed up his ego then 7 days later Alexei dead.
Exactly. He literally promoted an international war criminal.