Did Jesus Die on The Cross for The Just/Elect/Saved Whose Names Are Written in The Book of Life OR

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.

BillyBob

Active member
Dec 20, 2023
407
176
43
Texas
I'm sorry if I offended anyone. I'm not trying to say that they are not saved, I'm just trying to say that they are trying to take credit for a work that the Spirit did. It was the Spirit which enabled them to believe.
 

tylerbones1313

Active member
May 1, 2022
565
156
43
------------For the General Audience. We have so much error rampant through this forum. Hopefully every believer listens.------------

Believers have a responsibility to point out error and guide others towards truth as part of their commitment to love, truth, and the spiritual well-being of the community. This responsibility is rooted in the broader biblical commands to love one's neighbor, to pursue righteousness, and to be agents of reconciliation and truth in the world. Several passages throughout the New Testament underscore this aspect of Christian duty: (We are called to love one another even when we disagree. Perhaps we can take a step back and approach ALL conversation with a spirit of humility and respect. While we may have different interpretations (The Word of God is the only true Interpretation), it's important to remember that God calls us to unity and love. Let's focus on those shared values in ALL discussions.)

Galatians 6:1 (NKJV): "Brethren, if a man is overtaken in any trespass, you who are spiritual restore such a one in a spirit of gentleness, considering yourself lest you also be tempted." This verse emphasizes the responsibility of believers to help restore those who have fallen into sin. The approach should be characterized by gentleness and self-awareness, highlighting the importance of humility and care in correcting others.
Matthew 18:15-17 (NKJV): "Moreover if your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault between you and him alone. If he hears you, you have gained your brother. But if he will not hear, take with you one or two more, that ‘by the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established.’ And if he refuses to hear them, tell it to the church. But if he refuses even to hear the church, let him be to you like a heathen and a tax collector." Here, Jesus provides a process for addressing sin within the community, emphasizing the importance of private correction and the goal of reconciliation. It shows a structured approach to pointing out error, with the ultimate aim of restoration.
2 Timothy 4:2 (NKJV): "Preach the word! Be ready in season and out of season. Convince, rebuke, exhort, with all longsuffering and teaching." Paul instructs Timothy—and by extension, all believers—to be diligent in teaching the truth of God's Word, which includes correcting errors and encouraging right living. This exhortation underscores the role of Scripture in guiding the process of correction and the need for patience and dedication in this task.
James 5:19-20 (NKJV): "Brethren, if anyone among you wanders from the truth, and someone turns him back, let him know that he who turns a sinner from the error of his way will save a soul from death and cover a multitude of sins." James highlights the life-saving impact of correcting error and guiding someone back to the truth. It presents the act of pointing out error as an expression of care and concern for the spiritual state of others.

with meekness and fear: The manner in which believers are to defend their faith is critically important. "Meekness" suggests gentleness and humility, indicating that our defense should not be aggressive or confrontational but characterized by the humility that comes from understanding that our faith is a gift from God. "Fear" in this context refers to a deep respect or reverence for God, reminding believers that their ultimate accountability is to Him. This respectful approach ensures that the conversation about faith honors God and respects the dignity of the person asking.

These passages collectively illustrate that believers are indeed called to lovingly and carefully address error within the community, always aiming for the restoration and spiritual health of the individual. This responsibility is carried out within the context of a commitment to truth, love, humility, and the ultimate goal of salvation. It's important that such correction is done in a spirit of gentleness, respect, and love, reflecting the character of Christ.

My Signature------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Noone on Earth brings new revelation, that isn't already revealed through the Word of God (Jesus Christ), which is fullest revelation given to man. Through the moving and operation of the Holy Ghost, I Pray what we say here brings the truth of these Revelations, truth by truth, or precept upon precept, to the heart of the hearer. Lay what we say before the feet of Jesus (Word of God) and compare, the Bible is Always truth, so if they don't match, we need to reevaluate our stance. What we say or do here will have lasting impact upon the believer and sinner alike. We most certainly have freedom of speech, but any true christian will weigh what they say against the Word of God and if they don't agree God is not in error, and we need to pray for understanding. Those that have more meat of the Word can help those who are struggling, if done with humility, peace and love. I don't mind a peaceful debate, but when we start to argue amongst each other that is not the Spirit of God. God Bless and Peace to you all. (This signature is in general and not pointing fingers at anyone at anytime. God Bless.)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 

Mem

Senior Member
Sep 23, 2014
7,230
2,208
113
Isaiah 55 is no different than Acts 2. The offer of salvation was given to all and a response was called for. Acts 2, however, explains what occurs in those who do respond. It accentuates the activity of God that produces the responses in man. There is always a response from man, but there isn't always a saving response, which is seldom considered.

Where I believe many err is they focus on the choices of men irrespective of the activity of God. If God is the author of faith, then it follows that He is its cause.
How does God as the author, an originator or creator of something, and the finisher of our faith necessitate that He is an automatic finisher of all that he authors. I mean, it is necessary that He originate faith in order that He finish it, but must He finish everything He creates? Even though I'm certain that I know your answer, and you really need not reply with it. I just believe He regards our personality as much as He desires that we regard His, but of course that is not speaking in terms of equal status of authority but rather of a humbler level, as our good friend because, well, that is an aspect of His character.
 

MerSee

Active member
Jan 13, 2024
796
119
43
I believe God gave us the Bible so we don't go around making things up.
And if we read and study the Bible we can quote scripture and not make something up.
You didn't answer the question.

Do you believe it is necessary to believe correct doctrine which is from God?
 

Cameron143

Well-known member
Mar 1, 2022
20,075
6,883
113
62
We need to be saved before we need or can have fellowship.

Are you saying the Laodecians are saved or not saved?
I imagine they were like most churches with a collection of saved and unsaved people in attendance. But as I stated, it's directed at those who have ears to hear.
 

MerSee

Active member
Jan 13, 2024
796
119
43
Anyone who believes in Once Saved Always Saved knows if God can get rid of you then you were Never saved to begin with.

Jesus said He would VOMIT the Laodecians out. A saved person cannot be Vomited Out under the Once Saved Always Saved doctrine.
THE ELECT ONLY GET SAVED 1 TIME. :D
 

FollowerofShiloh

Well-known member
Jan 24, 2024
4,321
715
113
You didn't answer the question.

Do you believe it is necessary to believe correct doctrine which is from God?
Depends upon who defines the doctrine.

In the case of Only way to get to the Father is through Jesus Christ, that's pretty straight forward.

In the case of Once Saved Always Saved is equal to Eternal Security in our Salvation, then the people of Laodecia cannot be saved because...
Anyone who believes in Once Saved Always Saved knows if God can get rid of you then you were Never saved to begin with.

Jesus said He would VOMIT the Laodecians out. A saved person cannot be Vomited Out under the Once Saved Always Saved doctrine.
Which is why Revelation 3:20 is a call for Salvation.
And fulfills what we know that God makes first contact to the human being and when the human being yields, God's Regeneration takes place.

Those are basic doctrine principles that are Biblical.


What doctrines are you talking about that come into question?
 

FollowerofShiloh

Well-known member
Jan 24, 2024
4,321
715
113
I imagine they were like most churches with a collection of saved and unsaved people in attendance. But as I stated, it's directed at those who have ears to hear.
Then God is vomiting out saved people if you think so.
 

MerSee

Active member
Jan 13, 2024
796
119
43
Depends upon who defines the doctrine.

In the case of Only way to get to the Father is through Jesus Christ, that's pretty straight forward.

In the case of Once Saved Always Saved is equal to Eternal Security in our Salvation, then the people of Laodecia cannot be saved because...

Which is why Revelation 3:20 is a call for Salvation.
And fulfills what we know that God makes first contact to the human being and when the human being yields, God's Regeneration takes place.

Those are basic doctrine principles that are Biblical.


What doctrines are you talking about that come into question?
Do you believe it is necessary to believe correct doctrine which is from God?

MY QUESTION IS PERTAINING TO DOCTRINES WHICH COME FROM GOD.
 

Cameron143

Well-known member
Mar 1, 2022
20,075
6,883
113
62
How does God as the author, an originator or creator of something, and the finisher of our faith necessitate that He is an automatic finisher of all that he authors. I mean, it is necessary that He originate faith in order that He finish it, but must He finish everything He creates? Even though I'm certain that I know your answer, and you really need not reply with it. I just believe He regards our personality as much as He desires that we regard His, but of course that is not speaking in terms of equal status of authority but rather of a humbler level, as our good friend because, well, that is an aspect of His character.
He is the author and finisher of our faith. God isn't obligated to finish what He starts. But He claims to be the finisher of our faith so that's why I believe He finishes this.
I'm not sure what you mean concerning personality.
 

Mem

Senior Member
Sep 23, 2014
7,230
2,208
113
He is the author and finisher of our faith. God isn't obligated to finish what He starts. But He claims to be the finisher of our faith so that's why I believe He finishes this.
I'm not sure what you mean concerning personality.
By personality I mean the consideration of particular sensibilities? of each individual person (that is even those with 'no personality' are a personality in themselves). So, if God is the creator of all things, but not all things are 'finished' (indeed it is apparent that some, if not many, things will be scrapped), then the personality of that which is indeed finished must've factored, somewhat even if only minutely, into the formula for the finishing. And though it is argued that man would claim 'credit' in this idea, being is not 'doing,' i.e. one can 'be' faithful rather as opposing to anyone 'doing' faith.
 

Cameron143

Well-known member
Mar 1, 2022
20,075
6,883
113
62
By personality I mean the consideration of particular sensibilities? of each individual person (that is even those with 'no personality' are a personality in themselves). So, if God is the creator of all things, but not all things are 'finished' (indeed it is apparent that some, if not many, things will be scrapped), then the personality of that which is indeed finished must've factored, somewhat even if only minutely, into the formula for the finishing. And though it is argued that man would claim 'credit' in this idea, being is not 'doing,' i.e. one can 'be' faithful rather as opposing to anyone 'doing' faith.
If the author is also the finisher, there is probably design in the intention. But you are able to nuance in ways I don't grasp. Your brain is too big for my head.
 

Mem

Senior Member
Sep 23, 2014
7,230
2,208
113
If the author is also the finisher, there is probably design in the intention. But you are able to nuance in ways I don't grasp. Your brain is too big for my head.
Ok, the nice guy defensive maneuver always throws me off balance.
 

FollowerofShiloh

Well-known member
Jan 24, 2024
4,321
715
113
He vomits out the false professors. They are the lukewarm ones.
Why even say that when the Bible does not specifically say that?

16 So because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will vomit thee out of my mouth.

There's is absolutely "no way" to conclude such a thing. In fact, "none" of the verses (14-22) ascribed to Laodecia mentions what you just did. You really have no Biblical grounds to conclude such a thing. There's literally no way to make your conclusion unless you're "making it up."