What if you die before water baptism?

[Genez]

You are correct that Acts 10 (Household of Cornelius) and Acts 19 (Paul and Believers) is "flipped" which means God wants all Believers to be water baptized but Salvation and the Holy Spirit baptism is NOT dependent on the timing of water baptism.

Acts 10 - Gentile Believers received Holy Spirit baptism then, water baptism.
Acts 19 - Believers that were NOT at Pentacost believed in Jesus Christ and were water baptized but, had not received the Holy Spirit baptism yet... until Paul layed his hands on them and prayed.

On one occasion, while he was eating with them, he gave them this command:
“Do not leave Jerusalem, but wait for the gift my Father promised, which you
have heard me speak about. For John baptized with water, but in a few days
you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit.” Acts 1:4-5


One Lord, one faith, one baptism.
Ephesians 4:5

How many baptisms do you want?

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​

 

[Thunderrr-mental]

On one occasion, while he was eating with them, he gave them this command:
“Do not leave Jerusalem, but wait for the gift my Father promised, which you
have heard me speak about. For John baptized with water, but in a few days
you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit.” Acts 1:4-5


One Lord, one faith, one baptism.
Ephesians 4:5

How many baptisms do you want? ​

​

you can't leave water baptism out of one lord one faith one baptism

 

[Lafftur]

Thankyou for the agreement, in one sense

I wouldn't argue that its dependant on salvation, but I would argue it's dependant on recieving more gifts like becoming a full pint glass

The Holy Spirit distributes gifts according to the Father's Will.

Here's something to ponder...

Jesus Christ spoke a lot about spiritual things using natural things... like telling Nicodemus in John 3 that, "Unless a person is born again with water and Spirit, he cannot even see the Kingdom of God."

So, here we have water and Spirit as part of the "Born Again" process - Jesus did not say Salvation. Yet Nicodemus struggled because he was trying to understand with his natural human reasoning... he would need "spiritual ears" to hear and understand what the Spirit was saying.

Jesus told Nicodemus, How can you understand spiritual things when I've spoken concerning natural things and you do not understand.

I do believe something very special and very spiritual does happen to every Believer when we are water baptized and when we are baptized with the Holy Spirit... it's the birthing process. The Word of God is also referred to as the "washing of the water of the Word" in Ephesians 5...

Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it;

26 That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word,

27 That he might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish.

I'm curious about the Baptism with Fire...

Even the planet Earth is going through the Water, Spirit and Fire Baptism.... Noah's Flood on all flesh, Holy Spirit outpouring on all flesh, coming Fire on all flesh.....

 

[Genez]

The Holy Spirit distributes gifts according to the Father's Will.

Here's something to ponder...

Jesus Christ spoke a lot about spiritual things using natural things... like telling Nicodemus in John 3 that, "Unless a person is born again with water and Spirit, he cannot even see the Kingdom of God."

So, here we have water and Spirit as part of the "Born Again" process - Jesus did not say Salvation. Yet Nicodemus struggled because he was trying to understand with his natural human reasoning... he would need "spiritual ears" to hear and understand what the Spirit was saying.

Jesus told Nicodemus, How can you understand spiritual things when I've spoken concerning natural things and you do not understand.

I do believe something very special and very spiritual does happen to every Believer when we are water baptized and when we are baptized with the Holy Spirit... it's the birthing process. The Word of God is also referred to as the "washing of the water of the Word" in Ephesians 5...
.

Jesus was speaking about two kinds of BIRTHS.

When the flesh gives birth? The mother "breaks water."

That speaks of being born of the flesh, not water baptism.

 

[Thunderrr-mental]

The Holy Spirit distributes gifts according to the Father's Will.

Here's something to ponder...

Jesus Christ spoke a lot about spiritual things using natural things... like telling Nicodemus in John 3 that, "Unless a person is born again with water and Spirit, he cannot even see the Kingdom of God."

So, here we have water and Spirit as part of the "Born Again" process - Jesus did not say Salvation. Yet Nicodemus struggled because he was trying to understand with his natural human reasoning... he would need "spiritual ears" to hear and understand what the Spirit was saying.

Jesus told Nicodemus, How can you understand spiritual things when I've spoken concerning natural things and you do not understand.

I do believe something very special and very spiritual does happen to every Believer when we are water baptized and when we are baptized with the Holy Spirit... it's the birthing process. The Word of God is also referred to as the "washing of the water of the Word" in Ephesians 5...

Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it;

26 That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word,

27 That he might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish.

I'm curious about the Baptism with Fire...

Even the planet Earth is going through the Water, Spirit and Fire Baptism.... Noah's Flood on all flesh, Holy Spirit outpouring on all flesh, coming Fire on all flesh.....

well I believe water baptism is not solely dependant on baptism of fire straight away, or or by it's self.

But I'm convinced baptism of fire comes after water baptism. But confession of faith is more of a confession that kicks of the process, initially.

But for me Jesus was telling Nicodemus of what was to come.

I believe he was referring to being baptised in his name, in water after confessing of faith, which was Jesus implying being born of water and spirit.

upon confession Jesus is lord,.it could be your receive the spirit but your not born of the spirit until baptism of fire comes.

Can a person still receive salvation at Judgment day if they've not been water baptised.

Well I would say they have received the spirit upon confession Jesus is lord , and I would say also say They can be treated as those who where preached to by Jesus in paradise.

But I would say in order to receive baptism of fire you must be water baptised.

But if you don't receive baptism of fire I would also say your not doomed all together

 

[Eli1]

The Holy Spirit distributes gifts according to the Father's Will.

Here's something to ponder...

Jesus Christ spoke a lot about spiritual things using natural things... like telling Nicodemus in John 3 that, "Unless a person is born again with water and Spirit, he cannot even see the Kingdom of God."

So, here we have water and Spirit as part of the "Born Again" process - Jesus did not say Salvation. Yet Nicodemus struggled because he was trying to understand with his natural human reasoning... he would need "spiritual ears" to hear and understand what the Spirit was saying.

Jesus told Nicodemus, How can you understand spiritual things when I've spoken concerning natural things and you do not understand.

I do believe something very special and very spiritual does happen to every Believer when we are water baptized and when we are baptized with the Holy Spirit... it's the birthing process. The Word of God is also referred to as the "washing of the water of the Word" in Ephesians 5...

Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it;

26 That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word,

27 That he might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish.

I'm curious about the Baptism with Fire...

Even the planet Earth is going through the Water, Spirit and Fire Baptism.... Noah's Flood on all flesh, Holy Spirit outpouring on all flesh, coming Fire on all flesh.....

I think that communication is very important in this life.
You have a great gift to communicate well with other people.
Even though i disagree with you on the topic of Salvation or even water baptism, i enjoy reading your posts because of your good communication.

 

[Cameron143]

I believe it's a little bit more complicated than Just saying he washed away the sins of the whole world.



John 1:7

English Standard Version



7 But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus his Son cleanses us from all sin.

Tell me...when were sins paid for?

 

[Thunderrr-mental]

Tell me...when were sins paid for?

Cameron it's not a simple as asking questions, you can't have sins payed for unless you confess.

 

[Cameron143]

Cameron it's not a simple as asking questions, you can't have sins payed for unless you confess.

There was only 1 time in history when sins were paid for.

 

[Lafftur]

Jesus was speaking about two kinds of BIRTHS.

When the flesh gives birth? The mother "breaks water."

That speaks of being born of the flesh, not water baptism.

...and when the Spirit gives birth.... does "water break"?

Jesus clearly said, "water and Spirit"....

Yet, we know the timing of water baptism is not consistent... it can happen before or after the baptism with the Holy Spirit but, we do know Salvation happens FIRST.

 

[Lafftur]

I think that communication is very important in this life.
You have a great gift to communicate well with other people.
Even though i disagree with you on the topic of Salvation or even water baptism, i enjoy reading your posts because of your good communication.

You are a wonderful Encourager, Eli! Thank you!

 

[Thunderrr-mental]

There was only 1 time in history when sins were paid for.

there's no doubt that every sin of the world that could have been commited in the world where commited before the cross, and Jesus bore all the sins of the world upon his shoulders. But to say he forgave all those sins is entirely a different story.

Because in order to be forgiven, you have to confess.

 

[Thunderrr-mental]

You are a wonderful Encourager, Eli! Thank you!

are you not going to ask him what the disagreement is.

You have to watch him tho, if you disagree with him, he cuts you off.

 

[Genez]

...and when the Spirit gives birth.... does "water break"?

Jesus clearly said, "water and Spirit"....

Yet, we know the timing of water baptism is not consistent... it can happen before or after the baptism with the Holy Spirit but, we do know Salvation happens FIRST.

So now we have to have three births?

1. Flesh.
2. Water baptism.
3. And,,, Spirit Baptism?

Make up your mind...

 

[Cameron143]

there's no doubt that every sin of the world that could have been commited in the world where commited before the cross, and Jesus bore all the sins of the world upon his shoulders. But to say he forgave all those sins is entirely a different story.

Because in order to be forgiven, you have to confess.

One does need to repent...change direction...and believe. As part of repentance you will no doubt confess. But we don't need to continually repent because our hearts have been made new and we are already on board with team God. However, we are still prone to wander into sin and darkness, and confession will restore us to the light.

 

[Lafftur]

are you not going to ask him what the disagreement is.

You have to watch him tho, if you disagree with him, he cuts you off.

Oh no, Eli is an absolute sweetheart!

It doesn't matter if we disagree, we know Jesus will sort it all out, we're brother and sister in the Family of God! All is wonderful!

If Eli wants to discuss anything with me, he knows he can!

 

[Lafftur]

So now we have to have three births?

1. Flesh.
2. Water baptism.
3. And,,, Spirit Baptism?

Make up your mind...

Oh @Genez I love your humor! I busted out laughing when I read your post!

Aren't we all so funny! Three births now?! WHAT??!! How'd we end up on this rabbit trail??!!!! LOL!

 

[Eli1]

@Thunderrr-mental as i mentioned to you, i would like to discuss things with you too but the problem is that i can't understand you since English is your second language.
However, even if you spoke perfect English i find your mental state to be very disorganized.
In one sentence you say 10 topics in response to one topic.
So, for the 50% of the things that i am able to understand from you and which i find interesting, i take them and post them somewhere else where i can discuss them with people who are able to speak English.

So, i don't think we'll be able to understand each-other and that's okay. It is what it is.

 

[Genez]

Oh @Genez I love your humor! I busted out laughing when I read your post!

Aren't we all so funny! Three births now?! WHAT??!! How'd we end up on this rabbit trail??!!!! LOL!

No ... we end up being shown that the logic we use needs some grease.

Logos comes from the same root word as 'logic.'

When its comes to the Word of God?

If someone convinces me to change my mind for something wrong, because they have a pleasing personality?
I would not be a servant of the Lord.....

He testing all of us now to have us discover if we will be found trustworthy for receiving the power needed to share in his life experientially.

He will be our Husband.

Some wives are deep with their husband.
Others skim the surface....

Some treat the Word of God the same way,

 

[Lafftur]

So now we have to have three births?

1. Flesh.
2. Water baptism.
3. And,,, Spirit Baptism?

Make up your mind...

Just to be clearly understood.... there are two births:

1 - Natural birth of water and flesh (born into Adam)
2 - Spiritual birth of water and Spirit (born into Christ the 2nd Adam)