"Is There More Than one Gospel?...

[fredoheaven]

Yes, those early Apostles were witnesses to what they had seen and heard. What was missing? The abundance of revelation that the Lord gave to the Apostle Paul.

This was actually a promising thing for the fulfillment of the prophecies concerning his death, burial, and resurrection. Possibly, they overlooked or neglected it and perhaps God did not open their eyes to this truth because they couldn’t handle it yet but, the same writer Luke said that the same Jesus opened their understanding about the matter of his suffering, death, and resurrection. The hidden things were revealed prior to Paul’s so they became witnesses of these things. The point is that they have the same message. The message of the gospel necessitates Christ's death so as to become triumphant.

Luke 24:45-48

KJV_Cambridge(i) 45 Then opened he their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures, 46 And said unto them, Thus it is written, and thus it behoved Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day: 47 And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem. 48 And ye are witnesses of these things.

 

[John146]

This was actually a promising thing for the fulfillment of the prophecies concerning his death, burial, and resurrection. Possibly, they overlooked or neglected it and perhaps God did not open their eyes to this truth because they couldn’t handle it yet but, the same writer Luke said that the same Jesus opened their understanding about the matter of his suffering, death, and resurrection. The hidden things were revealed prior to Paul’s so they became witnesses of these things. The point is that they have the same message. The message of the gospel necessitates Christ's death so as to become triumphant.

Luke 24:45-48

KJV_Cambridge(i) 45 Then opened he their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures, 46 And said unto them, Thus it is written, and thus it behoved Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day: 47 And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem. 48 And ye are witnesses of these things.

The disciples did not preach the cross before the resurrection. Scripture states God hid it from them. What then, were they preaching? They were preaching the gospel of the kingdom, same message Jesus was preaching prior to the cross. This message was the good news of Israel’s King and the restoration of their kingdom.

 

[fredoheaven]

The disciples did not preach the cross before the resurrection. Scripture states God hid it from them. What then, were they preaching? They were preaching the gospel of the kingdom, same message Jesus was preaching prior to the cross. This message was the good news of Israel’s King and the restoration of their kingdom.

Umm, obviously, Peter and others did not preach the cross, the symbol of suffering Saviour for who can preach the thing that was not done yet. Neither his death nor resurrection but the mere fact that they preached what Jesus told them. They believe salvation is by grace through faith in Christ whom they followed, and Christ is actually the gospel sent. Knowledge of the truth saves no one. It is by trusting in the truth that saves. Precross teaches that people must believe in the Son God who is the personification of the Gospel. He’s the good news after all that brings salvation to whosoever beleiveth on Him (John 3:16, John 1:12 etc). Christ came to seek and to save that which was lost as the scripture says in Luke 19:10. Jesus himself preached his gospel (The gospel of the Son of God which the Bible says or the gospel of the kingdom and this gospel is not only about his earthly rulership but rather his reigning in the hearts of every man that believes on him. Christ saves! They have the gospel to preach and I would add, that the gospel before the cross is not a mere knowledge of the death, burial, and resurrection. Yes, they preach the same gospel that Christ saves!

 

[John146]

Umm, obviously, Peter and others did not preach the cross, the symbol of suffering Saviour for who can preach the thing that was not done yet. Neither his death nor resurrection but the mere fact that they preached what Jesus told them. They believe salvation is by grace through faith in Christ whom they followed, and Christ is actually the gospel sent. Knowledge of the truth saves no one. It is by trusting in the truth that saves. Precross teaches that people must believe in the Son God who is the personification of the Gospel. He’s the good news after all that brings salvation to whosoever beleiveth on Him (John 3:16, John 1:12 etc). Christ came to seek and to save that which was lost as the scripture says in Luke 19:10. Jesus himself preached his gospel (The gospel of the Son of God which the Bible says or the gospel of the kingdom and this gospel is not only about his earthly rulership but rather his reigning in the hearts of every man that believes on him. Christ saves! They have the gospel to preach and I would add, that the gospel before the cross is not a mere knowledge of the death, burial, and resurrection. Yes, they preach the same gospel that Christ saves!

They were looking for a Messiah to deliver them from their enemies. The cross was hidden.

Luke 1
67 And his father Zacharias was filled with the Holy Ghost, and prophesied, saying,
68 Blessed be the Lord God of Israel; for he hath visited and redeemed his people,
69 And hath raised up an horn of salvation for us in the house of his servant David;
70 As he spake by the mouth of his holy prophets, which have been since the world began:
71 That we should be saved from our enemies, and from the hand of all that hate us;
72 To perform the mercy promised to our fathers, and to remember his holy covenant;
73 The oath which he sware to our father Abraham,
74 That he would grant unto us, that we being delivered out of the hand of our enemies might serve him without fear,
75 In holiness and righteousness before him, all the days of our life.

Luke

 

[Clayman]

So, then, precious friend, you are willing to obey the first mention of 'good news to all' without making excuses, for disobeying it?:

the gospel to Cain and Abel!:

"bring the correct offering / be respected/accepted By God?​

(Genesis 4:3-7), eh?​

​

Amen.

Ive been reading this thread and becoming more confused with the more than one gospel position, I guess I dont understand.

Obviously Abel offering the sacrifice had no saving quality to it, so how is it good news unless its the figuratively pointing to Christ which it obviously is, but are not some here saying it is not? but then again even the offering of first fruits points to Christ and His resurrection.

What Im wanting to know from your perspective is does the act of obeying Gods commands in the Old testament equal salvation, does the following of the law equal reward from God or good news, or am I misunderstanding your meaning of Good news?

I suspect this question will be dodged for if you say yes, then you know Im going to ask why did the Lord Jesus need to die and suffer the horrible wrath of God, if there is another way for salvation to take place for us sinful men, aka another Gospel!

And if you say no Im going to ask how then is this good news its terrible news, they need the good news which is exactly what the Lord the apostles and Paul all provided which is the Good news of Jesus providing the way and giving all Salvation. Which the scriptures pointed to all along.

Also in reference to the kingdom of God, the Pharisee's wrongly understood this as an earthly kingdom, they were confused about the Lords hidden meanings when He said things like "My kingdom is not of this world" etc etc or "the kingdom is inside you" etc etc

In other Words the kingdom of God was a spiritual kingdom, it always has been when you read the scriptures with open spiritual eyes, for instance with open eyes when reading the Old testament it has Jesus Christ and the gospel all through them that's why Paul backs up what he says continually with Old testament scripture, and the kingdom Jesus was speaking of was not the millennial kingdom, that future kingdom where Israel will rule is an earthly kingdom, and is not the kingdom of God like unbelieving Israel were hoping for.

But in that earthly kingdom of Israel although like now people will be saved by the gospel, its not a physical kingdom that saves people, there will also be unsaved people there, people will die there, there will be sin there etc etc. So logically people cant be unsaved and be literally in the kingdom of God can they?

To me saying the gospel of the kingdom is a different gospel to Paul's gospel is accidently agreeing with the Pharisees who thought the kingdom of God was their coming earthly kingdom and salvation by following laws, I just mean try and re-read the gospel accounts from the mindset the Lord was talking about the kingdom of God as the heavenly kingdom, and it fits into the giant jigsaw picture scripture is, into one account that agrees with itself from Genesis to Revelation without contradiction.

I have a few more questions, but if you or anyone can clarify if someone can be saved without the cross and the shedding of blood for their sins please acknowledge it if it so and provide the how if you can?

For example can water baptism save the old testament saint is that good news?

I have to admit I stubbornly refuse to follow links you have provided, so I am in the dark but it would be greatly appreciated if you or someone can explain it as I'm getting more confused by reading this thread, or clarify what another gospel is if I've got the wrong end of the stick!

 

[GRACE_ambassador]

Point # 1. The Distinctive terminology alone would strongly imply a difference between
these Two Gospels...

The Gospel of the Kingdom is simply God’s good news about His kingdom,
a kingdom that was (and is) to be established on earth with Christ as king
(Jer. 23:5-6; Isa. 2:2-4; 11:1-9). It was prophesied by Israel’s prophets in
the Old Testament and proclaimed “at hand” in the New Testament.

Rightly Divided (2 Timothy 2:15) From “Things That Differ!” (online):

The Gospel of the Grace of God is God’s Good News About His Grace Reigning
like a king on the throne (Rom. 5:20-21). It was a new Revelation that came to
Paul, the apostle, directly from The Resurrected Christ In Heaven
(Gal. 1:11-12; 2:2; Acts 20:24).

to be continued...

...I am in the dark but it would be greatly appreciated if you or someone can explain...

Precious friend, we can do this - it may take some time to prayerfully and
Carefully go through all 12 points that were referred to in the 'link' from
the op #1 - please be very Richly Encouraged And Edified:

Point # 2:

The Gospel of the Kingdom was preached by John the Baptist (Baptizer),
Jesus Christ, and the twelve apostles, and only to the people of Israel
(Matt. 3:2; 4:17,23; 10:5-7; Rom. 15:8).

Rightly Divided (2 Timothy 2:15) From “Things That Differ!” (online):

The Gospel of the Grace of God was first preached by Paul to the Gentiles
after Israel had rejected the preaching of the Gospel of the Kingdom.
Paul then committed the Grace message to those who came after him
(Acts 16:31; Rom. 3:24; 1 Tim. 1:14; 2 Tim. 2:2).

(There is no Biblical evidence that John, Jesus, or the twelve ever preached
the Gospel of the Grace of God or that Paul ever preached the Gospel of the
Kingdom. The Grace Gospel eventually * superseded the kingdom gospel).

* After The Transition Period in Acts From Law To Grace!

to be continued...

 

[John146]

The gospel of the kingdom is only for the Jews. It is concerning their promised Messiah who would deliver them from their enemies so they could serve God without fear. It is to be the restoration of the kingdom of Israel.

Matthew 10
5 These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying, Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not:
6 But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.
7 And as ye go, preach, saying, The kingdom of heaven is at hand.
8 Heal the sick, cleanse the lepers, raise the dead, cast out devils: freely ye have received, freely give.

Thy kingdom come, thy will be done in earth as it is in heaven.

 

[fredoheaven]

They were looking for a Messiah to deliver them from their enemies. The cross was hidden.

Luke 1
67 And his father Zacharias was filled with the Holy Ghost, and prophesied, saying,
68 Blessed be the Lord God of Israel; for he hath visited and redeemed his people,
69 And hath raised up an horn of salvation for us in the house of his servant David;
70 As he spake by the mouth of his holy prophets, which have been since the world began:
71 That we should be saved from our enemies, and from the hand of all that hate us;
72 To perform the mercy promised to our fathers, and to remember his holy covenant;
73 The oath which he sware to our father Abraham,
74 That he would grant unto us, that we being delivered out of the hand of our enemies might serve him without fear,
75 In holiness and righteousness before him, all the days of our life.

Luke

The Jews were looking for a king to deliver them and that is the natural thinking of every Jew since they look one to deliver them from their enemies but the deliverance by which Jesus did was not only for physical one but also spiritual one. Actually, Christ did not deliver them from the hands of the Romans. Consider the following why Jesus came.

1. Salvation from their sins
Matthew 1:21
KJV_Cambridge(i) 21 And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name JESUS: for he shall save his people from their sins.
2. Forgiveness of sins
Mark 2:9
KJV_Cambridge(i) 9 Whether is it easier to say to the sick of the palsy, Thy sins be forgiven thee; or to say, Arise, and take up thy bed, and walk?
3. Remissions of sins
Luke 1:77 (KJV_Cambridge)
To give knowledge of salvation unto his people by the remission of their sins,

 

[fredoheaven]

The gospel of the kingdom is only for the Jews. It is concerning their promised Messiah who would deliver them from their enemies so they could serve God without fear. It is to be the restoration of the kingdom of Israel.

Matthew 10
5 These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying, Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not:
6 But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.
7 And as ye go, preach, saying, The kingdom of heaven is at hand.
8 Heal the sick, cleanse the lepers, raise the dead, cast out devils: freely ye have received, freely give.

Thy kingdom come, thy will be done in earth as it is in heaven.

The good tidings that Christ came is for all people.
Luke 2:10
KJV_Cambridge(i) 10 And the angel said unto them, Fear not: for, behold, I bring you good tidings of great joy, which shall be to all people.
Luke 2:30-32
KJV_Cambridge(i) 30 For mine eyes have seen thy salvation, 31 Which thou hast prepared before the face of all people;
32 A light to lighten the Gentiles, and the glory of thy people Israel.

 

[Clayman]

Precious friend, we can do this - it may take some time to prayerfully and
Carefully go through all 12 points that were referred to in the 'link' from
the op #1 - please be very Richly Encouraged And Edified:

Sure we can go through your points if ya want as long as there is give and take, you answer or address some of my points as well?

Point # 2:

The Gospel of the Kingdom was preached by John the Baptist (Baptizer),
Jesus Christ, and the twelve apostles, and only to the people of Israel
(Matt. 3:2; 4:17,23; 10:5-7; Rom. 15:8).

Yet, John the Baptist, was a Levite through and through, one of the Jobs of the Levite priest was to certify the sacrifice was indeed suitable, without blemish. he said "Behold the Lamb of God whom taketh away the sin of the world" He Identified Jesus Christ at the start of His ministry as the perfect sacrifice, not only for the people of Israel but for sins of the whole world.

So yes he was preaching "the kingdom of heaven is at hand" for the one who came to take away our sins and the cross was now at hand. Lines up with and adds to the one and only gospel.

And we can see the whole purpose of the Lords coming as man was to take our place in judgment, not to restore the kingdom to Israel.

Rightly Divided (2 Timothy 2:15) From “Things That Differ!” (online):

2 Tim 2:15 Be diligent to present yourself approved to God, a worker who does not need to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.

What I really want to know though is, how you, Grace ambassador thinks, please don't be ashamed to answer it. The question I keep asking is, is there a way to receive eternal life from God other than through the Lords sacrifice at Calvary which provided payment for our sins, and I mean for anyone that ever and or will exist?

Did you give any thought to verses I provided like John 18:36 Jesus answered, “My kingdom is not of this world. If My kingdom were of this world, My servants would fight, so that I should not be delivered to the Jews; but now My kingdom is not from here.”

Or "You say rightly I am king, for this cause I was born, and for this cause I have come into this world"

Do you think He is king now or not?

 

[Nehemiah6]

Yet, John the Baptist, was a Levite through and through, one of the Jobs of the Levite priest was to certify the sacrifice was indeed suitable, without blemish.

Except that John did not function as a priest or Levite at any time. Why? Because God appointed him to be a prophet. Moses too was in the same position. But God made his brother Aaron a priest and he would begin theline of Israelite priests.

 

[DJT_47]

Ive been reading this thread and becoming more confused with the more than one gospel position, I guess I dont understand.

Obviously Abel offering the sacrifice had no saving quality to it, so how is it good news unless its the figuratively pointing to Christ which it obviously is, but are not some here saying it is not? but then again even the offering of first fruits points to Christ and His resurrection.

What Im wanting to know from your perspective is does the act of obeying Gods commands in the Old testament equal salvation, does the following of the law equal reward from God or good news, or am I misunderstanding your meaning of Good news?

I suspect this question will be dodged for if you say yes, then you know Im going to ask why did the Lord Jesus need to die and suffer the horrible wrath of God, if there is another way for salvation to take place for us sinful men, aka another Gospel!

And if you say no Im going to ask how then is this good news its terrible news, they need the good news which is exactly what the Lord the apostles and Paul all provided which is the Good news of Jesus providing the way and giving all Salvation. Which the scriptures pointed to all along.

Also in reference to the kingdom of God, the Pharisee's wrongly understood this as an earthly kingdom, they were confused about the Lords hidden meanings when He said things like "My kingdom is not of this world" etc etc or "the kingdom is inside you" etc etc

In other Words the kingdom of God was a spiritual kingdom, it always has been when you read the scriptures with open spiritual eyes, for instance with open eyes when reading the Old testament it has Jesus Christ and the gospel all through them that's why Paul backs up what he says continually with Old testament scripture, and the kingdom Jesus was speaking of was not the millennial kingdom, that future kingdom where Israel will rule is an earthly kingdom, and is not the kingdom of God like unbelieving Israel were hoping for.

But in that earthly kingdom of Israel although like now people will be saved by the gospel, its not a physical kingdom that saves people, there will also be unsaved people there, people will die there, there will be sin there etc etc. So logically people cant be unsaved and be literally in the kingdom of God can they?

To me saying the gospel of the kingdom is a different gospel to Paul's gospel is accidently agreeing with the Pharisees who thought the kingdom of God was their coming earthly kingdom and salvation by following laws, I just mean try and re-read the gospel accounts from the mindset the Lord was talking about the kingdom of God as the heavenly kingdom, and it fits into the giant jigsaw picture scripture is, into one account that agrees with itself from Genesis to Revelation without contradiction.

I have a few more questions, but if you or anyone can clarify if someone can be saved without the cross and the shedding of blood for their sins please acknowledge it if it so and provide the how if you can?

For example can water baptism save the old testament saint is that good news?

I have to admit I stubbornly refuse to follow links you have provided, so I am in the dark but it would be greatly appreciated if you or someone can explain it as I'm getting more confused by reading this thread, or clarify what another gospel is if I've got the wrong end of the stick!

There is one gospel, the good news about Christ and his kingdom. People get confused or are unknowing and mislead, and thereby mislead others. The kingdom here on earth is the church which is the body of Christ, established after his death, and you become part of his body by being baptized into it and added to the church by the Lord himself. Acts 2:38-47.

 

[mailmandan]

There is one gospel, the good news about Christ and his kingdom. People get confused or are unknowing and mislead, and thereby mislead others. The kingdom here on earth is the church which is the body of Christ, established after his death, and you become part of his body by being baptized into it and added to the church by the Lord himself. Acts 2:38-47.

Which baptism places us into the body of Christ? 1 Corinthians 12:13 - For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body—whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free—and have all been made to drink into one Spirit. This is not water baptism, but Spirit baptism.

At what point are we placed into the body of Christ and added to His church?

Ephesians 1:13 - In Him, you also, after listening to the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation—having also believed, you were sealed in Him with the Holy Spirit of promise.

Acts 4:4 - However, many of those who heard the word believed; and the number of the men came to be about five thousand.

Acts 5:14 - And believers were increasingly added to the Lord, multitudes of both men and women.

 

[John146]

The Jews were looking for a king to deliver them and that is the natural thinking of every Jew since they look one to deliver them from their enemies but the deliverance by which Jesus did was not only for physical one but also spiritual one. Actually, Christ did not deliver them from the hands of the Romans.

It's not the natural thinking, it was the truth. It was promised to them. Zacharias is prophesying through the Holy Spirit. The Spirit is not lying.

 

[John146]

The good tidings that Christ came is for all people.
Luke 2:10
KJV_Cambridge(i) 10 And the angel said unto them, Fear not: for, behold, I bring you good tidings of great joy, which shall be to all people.
Luke 2:30-32
KJV_Cambridge(i) 30 For mine eyes have seen thy salvation, 31 Which thou hast prepared before the face of all people;
32 A light to lighten the Gentiles, and the glory of thy people Israel.

Agreed brother, but the whole meaning of that was a mystery.

 

[Clayman]

Except that John did not function as a priest or Levite at any time. Why? Because God appointed him to be a prophet. Moses too was in the same position. But God made his brother Aaron a priest and he would begin theline of Israelite priests.

I agree that John did not perform priestly duties in the temple, but there seems to be a deeper truth or picture in Johns ability to play a priestly role. There is a changing of priesthood that had to occur for we are all now priests with the Lord our high priest.

There is so many deeper or hidden truths to the fact John acted in a Levitical priestly role, again I say deeper as its not spelt out in black and white.

The fact that the Lord is our high priest shows a duel role where the descendants of Aaron could wash and anoint a high priest and also the sacrificial lamb, John Said “He must increase, but I must decrease.” (John 3:30)

A priests role could also be similar to that of a prophets for he was also a messenger of the Lord of hosts

“For the priest’s lips should keep knowledge, and they should seek the law at his mouth: for he is the messenger of the LORD of hosts.” (Mal. 2:7)

Jesus. “Behold, I will send my messenger, and he shall prepare the way before me: and the Lord, whom ye seek, shall suddenly come to his temple, even the messenger of the covenant.” (Mal. 3:1) Mk 1:2

“prepare ye the way of the Lord.” (Mk 1:3)

The fact scripture Identifies Johns father as the high priest at the time, and his mother a descendant of Aaron seems to be for a reason.

I agree Moses a prophet did not have a priestly role, yet when we think of prophets and offering sacrifices the one that comes immediately to mind is that of Elijah the prophet. A fore runner of John the Baptist which has an interesting point or two.

Even the Lamb being washed and the Jordan speak of gems for us to dwell upon and enjoy, another time maybe.

Or I could have it all wrong, who knows its not exactly spelt out that John is both the last Aaronic priest and prophet for the changing of the guard, from the old to the new.

 

[Nehemiah6]

Or I could have it all wrong, who knows its not exactly spelt out that John is both the last Aaronic priest and prophet for the changing of the guard, from the old to the new.

Actually Christ spelled it out very clearly.

For I say unto you, Among those that are born of women there is not a greater prophet than John the Baptist: but he that is least in the kingdom of God is greater than he. (Luke 7:28)

No mention of any priestly role. "Greater prophet" clears the confusion.

 

[Clayman]

There is one gospel, the good news about Christ and his kingdom. People get confused or are unknowing and mislead, and thereby mislead others. The kingdom here on earth is the church which is the body of Christ, established after his death, and you become part of his body by being baptized into it and added to the church by the Lord himself. Acts 2:38-47.

Agreed there is only one gospel, Im not even sure yet what the other gospel is that others are talking about, maybe one day ill work it out

Im more inclined to see the church as positionally part of the kingdom of heaven, while I see the kingdom on earth is in darkness?

When we become born again we are translated from this world into the kingdom of His Son.

Eph 2:4But God, who is rich in mercy, because of His great love with which He loved us, even when we were dead in trespasses, made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved), and raised us up together, and made us sit together in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus,

 

[John146]

The everlasting gospel...nothing about the d,b,r for sins. The passage literally gives us the message of the everlasting gospel. If one is living at the time of Revelation 14, you better head the preaching of this angel. You better fear God and give glory to him because the hour of judgment is come. This is right before the second coming of Jesus as the Judge of the earth, King of kings and Lord of lords.

Revelation 14:
6 And I saw another angel fly in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people,
7 Saying with a loud voice, Fear God, and give glory to him; for the hour of his judgment is come: and worship him that made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and the fountains of waters.

 

[DJT_47]

Agreed there is only one gospel, Im not even sure yet what the other gospel is that others are talking about, maybe one day ill work it out

Im more inclined to see the church as positionally part of the kingdom of heaven, while I see the kingdom on earth is in darkness?

When we become born again we are translated from this world into the kingdom of His Son.

Eph 2:4But God, who is rich in mercy, because of His great love with which He loved us, even when we were dead in trespasses, made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved), and raised us up together, and made us sit together in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus,

Good! The ones here that claim multiple gospels are simply blabbering voices. And being "born again" and being saved are one in the same thing, and bring translated into the kingdom likewise happens simultaneously. The aforementioned scriptures, Acts 2:38-47 clearly tells how and when that happens. Your sins are forgiven, you receive the gift of the Spirit, and the Lord adds you to his church which IS the kingdom on earth.