Have i committed the what is described in Hebrews 10:26 please any help would be appreciated
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Out of courtesy and respect for you, I will answer this one last question, even though you have yet to answer any of the questions that I posed to you, and then I will allow this thread to return to its original topic without participating in any further derailments myself.
You said "those verses", but your question seems to pertain to only one of them or to what Jesus said here:
Luke 9:61-62
"And another also said, Lord, I will follow thee; but let me first go bid them farewell, which are at home at my house. And Jesus said unto him, No man, having put his hand to the plough, and looking back, is fit for the kingdom of God."
Jesus told this man that no man having put his hand to the plow, and looking back, is fit for the kingdom of God, and this man merely wanted to bid farewell to his relatives before following Jesus.
Jesus not only told him that he would not be fit for the kingdom of God if he did so, but that no man who did so would be fit for it.
Why then are you directing your question towards me?
Why do you not just ask Jesus instead what he meant by his statement?
It seems rather clear to me what he said and meant, and what he did not say nor mean.
In other words, he did not say, "Hey, you can always look forward again and be fit after turning back."
Basically, the difference between exegesis and eisegesis or the difference between taking something out of the text that it says as opposed to adding something to the text that it does not say.
You said "those verses", but your question seems to pertain to only one of them or to what Jesus said here:
Luke 9:61-62
"And another also said, Lord, I will follow thee; but let me first go bid them farewell, which are at home at my house. And Jesus said unto him, No man, having put his hand to the plough, and looking back, is fit for the kingdom of God."
Jesus told this man that no man having put his hand to the plow, and looking back, is fit for the kingdom of God, and this man merely wanted to bid farewell to his relatives before following Jesus.
Jesus not only told him that he would not be fit for the kingdom of God if he did so, but that no man who did so would be fit for it.
Why then are you directing your question towards me?
Why do you not just ask Jesus instead what he meant by his statement?
It seems rather clear to me what he said and meant, and what he did not say nor mean.
In other words, he did not say, "Hey, you can always look forward again and be fit after turning back."
Basically, the difference between exegesis and eisegesis or the difference between taking something out of the text that it says as opposed to adding something to the text that it does not say.
I recommend you seek out a ministry that will help you overcome your addiction. Purelife Ministries.
FYI most men who fail in this area are or were bound by pornography. In addition, a stronghold has been made in the person's life that needs deliverance. You need to know that the thoughts and temptations will not go away.
You need to understand that only lust causes you to be a willful participant. Being tempted is not a sin. it is the wilful interaction in thought, role play and that leads to a manifestation in the flesh. You did the sexual act in your mind before you ever completed the act in the flesh.
You can go 1, 2, or 6mo not doing the physical, or sexual act, yet role-playing and thinking about it every day is the where you need to battle.
The physical, sexual act is not the cause. It is the effects of a wilful person engaging in the temptation or suggestion to do the sexual act. Movie, social media, porn, etc... it is the lack of self-control and a stronghold over the person.
You need to come to terms with the fact that YOU are not attacking the thoughts and suggestions coming into your mind with the word of God.
Is God a liar? Is His word authoritative? Are His promises absolute but Conditional?
No, God doesn't lie.
Yes, His word is Authoritative.
Yes, His promises are absolute but Conditional.
James 4:7-10
7 Therefore submit to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you.
8 Draw near to God, and He will draw near to you. Cleanse your hands, you sinners, and purify your hearts, you double-minded. 9 Lament and mourn and weep! Let your laughter be turned to mourning and your joy to gloom. 10 Humble yourselves in the sight of the Lord, and He will lift you up.
As Temptation is a suggestion that appeals to the flesh, which, if left unchecked will produce an effect on the person
God's word says :
1. Submit to God and resist the devil. IF you do this, the devil will flee from you
2. Cleans your hand, you sinners, and Purify your heart, you double-minded.
A person who is Double minded is UNSTABLE IN ALL HIS WAYS (James 1:8), Meaning they have no self-control. Only a Pure Heart can see GOD Blessed are the pure in heart they shall see God Matthew 5:8
3. Humble yourself, and the Lord will lift you up.
You want victory over this sin? This sexual sin. Stop making excuses.
If you are submitting to God your life, then you are able to resist the Devil, and he MUST leave you.
If you are purifying your heart and mind through Prayer and the word of God and humbling yourself to God, and drawing close to HIM, HE will Draw closer to you.
Most in sexual sin like the sexual act and have no real desire to stop. Therefore it seems the word of God is to no effect to defeat the cause of the sexual act.
1. You must humble yourself to God and ask Him to forgive you for that which is a sin
2. You must draw close to him in worship and HIS word
3. you must separate yourself from all things that have caused this sexual stronghold. Porn, Web, friends who are engaging with you in this.
4. You need to fully understand as the world will justify sin and provide what seems to be reasonable excuses why one can commit sexual sin; you must reject that and not be double-minded.
Jesus was Tempted and did not sin. The Holy Spirit in the temptation WILL Provide a way of escape. YOU must take it !!! 1Corthiains 10:13
God will not force you to do so. This is your walk. Your willful obedience. Yet you are not alone in this many have been and are on this same road and battle.
Be encouraged. Victory is in Christ. And IF Christ is in you, then you are victorious.
FYI most men who fail in this area are or were bound by pornography. In addition, a stronghold has been made in the person's life that needs deliverance. You need to know that the thoughts and temptations will not go away.
You need to understand that only lust causes you to be a willful participant. Being tempted is not a sin. it is the wilful interaction in thought, role play and that leads to a manifestation in the flesh. You did the sexual act in your mind before you ever completed the act in the flesh.
You can go 1, 2, or 6mo not doing the physical, or sexual act, yet role-playing and thinking about it every day is the where you need to battle.
The physical, sexual act is not the cause. It is the effects of a wilful person engaging in the temptation or suggestion to do the sexual act. Movie, social media, porn, etc... it is the lack of self-control and a stronghold over the person.
You need to come to terms with the fact that YOU are not attacking the thoughts and suggestions coming into your mind with the word of God.
Is God a liar? Is His word authoritative? Are His promises absolute but Conditional?
No, God doesn't lie.
Yes, His word is Authoritative.
Yes, His promises are absolute but Conditional.
James 4:7-10
7 Therefore submit to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you.
8 Draw near to God, and He will draw near to you. Cleanse your hands, you sinners, and purify your hearts, you double-minded. 9 Lament and mourn and weep! Let your laughter be turned to mourning and your joy to gloom. 10 Humble yourselves in the sight of the Lord, and He will lift you up.
As Temptation is a suggestion that appeals to the flesh, which, if left unchecked will produce an effect on the person
God's word says :
1. Submit to God and resist the devil. IF you do this, the devil will flee from you
2. Cleans your hand, you sinners, and Purify your heart, you double-minded.
A person who is Double minded is UNSTABLE IN ALL HIS WAYS (James 1:8), Meaning they have no self-control. Only a Pure Heart can see GOD Blessed are the pure in heart they shall see God Matthew 5:8
3. Humble yourself, and the Lord will lift you up.
You want victory over this sin? This sexual sin. Stop making excuses.
If you are submitting to God your life, then you are able to resist the Devil, and he MUST leave you.
If you are purifying your heart and mind through Prayer and the word of God and humbling yourself to God, and drawing close to HIM, HE will Draw closer to you.
Most in sexual sin like the sexual act and have no real desire to stop. Therefore it seems the word of God is to no effect to defeat the cause of the sexual act.
1. You must humble yourself to God and ask Him to forgive you for that which is a sin
2. You must draw close to him in worship and HIS word
3. you must separate yourself from all things that have caused this sexual stronghold. Porn, Web, friends who are engaging with you in this.
4. You need to fully understand as the world will justify sin and provide what seems to be reasonable excuses why one can commit sexual sin; you must reject that and not be double-minded.
Jesus was Tempted and did not sin. The Holy Spirit in the temptation WILL Provide a way of escape. YOU must take it !!! 1Corthiains 10:13
God will not force you to do so. This is your walk. Your willful obedience. Yet you are not alone in this many have been and are on this same road and battle.
Be encouraged. Victory is in Christ. And IF Christ is in you, then you are victorious.
Thank you very much for your reply, seekingthemindofChrist, I really appreciate it. And if you wouldn't mind me replying to it, actually, I perceive it to be in the reverse. What I mean is, per your conclusion, were it to be true, that would then force man into being his own saviour because salvation would be dependent solely upon his actions to bring in and keep in Christ, but not of Christ's doing, thereby making Christ a fait accompli to salvation; that is, should man do so and be saved by it, it would have been through his own actions; should he not be saved, then that also would be because of himself. This then relegates Christ to a secondary role but not one as Saviour. But, as we are informed in the Bible, beyond dispute, Christ IS the Saviour. As such, He alone must have accomplished/achieved everything necessary for those who are to become saved, to become saved, otherwise, He simply, logically and truthfully, could not be the Saviour, yet we know the Bible cannot be wrong.
In closing, let me ask you this: what do you think Christ the Saviour means in terms of salvation? If you'd rather not
answer and continue this discussion, that's fine - after all, I guess it is not really appropriate for this thread.
Hope this make sense. If not, let me know and I'll try to clarify.
[Heb 7:25 KJV] 25 Wherefore he is able also to save them to the uttermost that come unto God by him, seeing he ever liveth to make intercession for them.
[2Pe 3:18 KJV] 18 But grow in grace, and [in] the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. To him [be] glory both now and for ever. Amen.
[2Ti 1:10 KJV] 10 But is now made manifest by the appearing of our Saviour Jesus Christ, who hath abolished death, and hath brought life and immortality to light through the gospel:
[Tit 2:13 KJV] 13 Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ;
[Tit 3:5-6 KJV]
5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;
6 Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour;
In closing, let me ask you this: what do you think Christ the Saviour means in terms of salvation? If you'd rather not
answer and continue this discussion, that's fine - after all, I guess it is not really appropriate for this thread.
Hope this make sense. If not, let me know and I'll try to clarify.
[Heb 7:25 KJV] 25 Wherefore he is able also to save them to the uttermost that come unto God by him, seeing he ever liveth to make intercession for them.
[2Pe 3:18 KJV] 18 But grow in grace, and [in] the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. To him [be] glory both now and for ever. Amen.
[2Ti 1:10 KJV] 10 But is now made manifest by the appearing of our Saviour Jesus Christ, who hath abolished death, and hath brought life and immortality to light through the gospel:
[Tit 2:13 KJV] 13 Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ;
[Tit 3:5-6 KJV]
5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;
6 Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour;
I mean you no offense, but I honestly am not following your logic, unless you are a Calvinist who believes that God chooses who will be saved apart from their mutual consent or without them having any free will choice or say in the matter.
From my vantage point, and it is a vantage point which can be seen throughout the entirety of the Bible, the relationship between Christ and the church is likened to a marriage covenant. A covenant is a willful agreement, or an agreement between two consenting parties, and especially a marriage covenant. If not, then Christ has abducted his bride against her will. I do not know if you adhere to such a belief or not because I do not know any of your beliefs beyond what you have expressed in this thread, but I can assure you that I definitely do not believe that. Instead, I believe that, in a figurative sense, we are invited by God to enter into a Divine marriage covenant with his son, Jesus Christ, and we can either willfully accept or willfully reject the invitation. For example, I believe that this exact scenario is shown to be true here:
Matthew 22:1-9
"And Jesus answered and spake unto them again by parables, and said, The kingdom of heaven is like unto a certain king, which made a marriage for his son, And sent forth his servants to call them that were bidden to the wedding: and they would not come. Again, he sent forth other servants, saying, Tell them which are bidden, Behold, I have prepared my dinner: my oxen and my fatlings are killed, and all things are ready: come unto the marriage. But they made light of it, and went their ways, one to his farm, another to his merchandise: And the remnant took his servants, and entreated them spitefully, and slew them. But when the king heard thereof, he was wroth: and he sent forth his armies, and destroyed those murderers, and burned up their city. Then saith he to his servants, The wedding is ready, but they which were bidden were not worthy. Go ye therefore into the highways, and as many as ye shall find, bid to the marriage."
I did not quote the entire parable for the sake of space, but we clearly see here that God is inviting or bidding people, first Jews, and then Gentiles, to a marriage for his son, and those who were bidden had the option of either accepting or rejecting the invitation. Because people were given the option to either accept or reject God's invitation, does this make Christ any less the Bridegroom? No, it does not.
Carry this same principle over to salvation which is what the marital covenant represents.
God offers salvation to everyone through Christ, and we have the free will option or choice to either accept or reject his gracious offer.
If we accept God's offer, does that make Christ any less the Savior? Of course, it does not. It simply means that we chose to receive him as our Savior.
Well, what if we reject God's offer? Does that make Christ any less the Savior? Again, of course, it does not. It simply means that we chose to reject him as our Savior to our own peril.
That seems pretty cut and dry to me all throughout the Bible.
The short answer is that Jesus died, was buried, rose again, and ascended back to the Father's right hand in order to save us or redeem us from our sins and bring us back into right standing with our heavenly Father. Not everyone is going to receive him as their Savior though, unless you believe in "Universalism". Assuming that you are not a Universalist, then does Christ cease from being the Savior just because many will ultimately reject him as such? Of course, he does not, so I really do not follow your line of reasoning unless you adhere to either Calvinism or Universalism, and I fully reject both of them.
From my vantage point, and it is a vantage point which can be seen throughout the entirety of the Bible, the relationship between Christ and the church is likened to a marriage covenant. A covenant is a willful agreement, or an agreement between two consenting parties, and especially a marriage covenant. If not, then Christ has abducted his bride against her will. I do not know if you adhere to such a belief or not because I do not know any of your beliefs beyond what you have expressed in this thread, but I can assure you that I definitely do not believe that. Instead, I believe that, in a figurative sense, we are invited by God to enter into a Divine marriage covenant with his son, Jesus Christ, and we can either willfully accept or willfully reject the invitation. For example, I believe that this exact scenario is shown to be true here:
Matthew 22:1-9
"And Jesus answered and spake unto them again by parables, and said, The kingdom of heaven is like unto a certain king, which made a marriage for his son, And sent forth his servants to call them that were bidden to the wedding: and they would not come. Again, he sent forth other servants, saying, Tell them which are bidden, Behold, I have prepared my dinner: my oxen and my fatlings are killed, and all things are ready: come unto the marriage. But they made light of it, and went their ways, one to his farm, another to his merchandise: And the remnant took his servants, and entreated them spitefully, and slew them. But when the king heard thereof, he was wroth: and he sent forth his armies, and destroyed those murderers, and burned up their city. Then saith he to his servants, The wedding is ready, but they which were bidden were not worthy. Go ye therefore into the highways, and as many as ye shall find, bid to the marriage."
I did not quote the entire parable for the sake of space, but we clearly see here that God is inviting or bidding people, first Jews, and then Gentiles, to a marriage for his son, and those who were bidden had the option of either accepting or rejecting the invitation. Because people were given the option to either accept or reject God's invitation, does this make Christ any less the Bridegroom? No, it does not.
Carry this same principle over to salvation which is what the marital covenant represents.
God offers salvation to everyone through Christ, and we have the free will option or choice to either accept or reject his gracious offer.
If we accept God's offer, does that make Christ any less the Savior? Of course, it does not. It simply means that we chose to receive him as our Savior.
Well, what if we reject God's offer? Does that make Christ any less the Savior? Again, of course, it does not. It simply means that we chose to reject him as our Savior to our own peril.
That seems pretty cut and dry to me all throughout the Bible.
The short answer is that Jesus died, was buried, rose again, and ascended back to the Father's right hand in order to save us or redeem us from our sins and bring us back into right standing with our heavenly Father. Not everyone is going to receive him as their Savior though, unless you believe in "Universalism". Assuming that you are not a Universalist, then does Christ cease from being the Savior just because many will ultimately reject him as such? Of course, he does not, so I really do not follow your line of reasoning unless you adhere to either Calvinism or Universalism, and I fully reject both of them.
If don't care to answer my questions I'm ok with that. You are new here and I'm trying to understand what you believe.
As the discussion has gone on, other veins of conversation have opened up. I didn't start them. I'm merely asking questions about what you and others have added.
For example, the man who puts his hand to the plow and turns. The explanation Jesus gives is that if one turns, they were not meet for the kingdom to begin with. The evidence for this is found in the turning. His heart is divided. Jesus is not first in his life.
As the discussion has gone on, other veins of conversation have opened up. I didn't start them. I'm merely asking questions about what you and others have added.
For example, the man who puts his hand to the plow and turns. The explanation Jesus gives is that if one turns, they were not meet for the kingdom to begin with. The evidence for this is found in the turning. His heart is divided. Jesus is not first in his life.
Luke 9:61-62
"And another also said, Lord, I will follow thee; but let me first go bid them farewell, which are at home at my house. And Jesus said unto him, No man, having put his hand to the plough, and looking back, is fit for the kingdom of God."
This man called Jesus "Lord", and he told him that he would follow him, but he desired to first say farewell to those who were at home at his house. Jesus responded by saying that no man, and not just this man, having put his hand to the plow, or having begun laboring for the Lord, can even look back afterwards or else they are not fit for the kingdom of God. In other words, Jesus was referring to those who began following him and laboring for him only to later look back. Are we to believe that during the timeframe of laboring for the Lord these men were not saved? That seems ludicrous to me.
"And another also said, Lord, I will follow thee; but let me first go bid them farewell, which are at home at my house. And Jesus said unto him, No man, having put his hand to the plough, and looking back, is fit for the kingdom of God."
This man called Jesus "Lord", and he told him that he would follow him, but he desired to first say farewell to those who were at home at his house. Jesus responded by saying that no man, and not just this man, having put his hand to the plow, or having begun laboring for the Lord, can even look back afterwards or else they are not fit for the kingdom of God. In other words, Jesus was referring to those who began following him and laboring for him only to later look back. Are we to believe that during the timeframe of laboring for the Lord these men were not saved? That seems ludicrous to me.
No offense taken, many have said they think me a Calvinist, but I have never knowingly read anything from Calvin - not that I wouldn't just that I haven't, however, I believe we have come to many of the same conclusions regarding salvation. That should come as no surprise given there is only one salvation in/of the Bible. To answer your question, yes, I believe that it is God alone who saves with no approval, acquiescence, nor consent needed from those He has chosen to save to be saved - He is God.
The unsaved were the abducted to begin with - which we all were of at one time or another. Satan, through Adam's and Eve's transgression, abducted all of mankind. By that, mankind became spiritually dead, servants of Satan, therefore blinded to the stipulation of God's marriage contract. A spiritually dead man is oblivious to spiritual stimuli just as a physically dead man is oblivious to physical stimuli, not having spiritual eyes that see, nor ears that hears, nor a heart that perceives. Since all those He saves He made full made payment for, it was/is His divine prerogative and good pleasure to apply it to whomsoever He wanted to (God makes clear that He was/is under no requirement to do otherwise). Therefore, by that payment, were they made His servants - no longer belonging to themselves nor to Satan but to God. However, once receiving spiritual life from spiritual death solely and completely as a free gift, none would ever choose to return back to that state of spiritual death - would you choose to give back a gazillion dollars just because someone put it in your bank account without your permission? In the below verses, we can see that God uses the word "dead". It was not meant figurately, but as an actual description of spiritual reality.
None of the unsaved understands God's marriage contract stipulation - their belief being that it can only be satisfied by force - through their actions and their strength - instead of by God's actions and His strength, which actions, alone satisfies its stipulation - that those saved should come to a true belief in Christ alone as Saviour.
[Eph 2:1 KJV]
1 And you [hath he quickened], who were dead in trespasses and sins;
[Col 2:13 KJV]
13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;
There is no such thing as spiritual free will to those spiritually dead in sin. How could there be? They cannot know the things of the Spirit. All of the unsaved are dead in sin until and unless becoming born again - that is why God calls it being born-again. To accept the offer is in accepting its stipulation, yet only those saved do so, and do so through/by God. They are those who have been given a new mind, a new heart, and a new spirit, through Christ.
[1Co 2:14 KJV] 14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know [them], because they are spiritually discerned.
[Rom 9:13-16 KJV]
13 As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated. 14 What shall we say then? [Is there] unrighteousness with God? God forbid.
15 For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion. 16 So then [it is] not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy.
Have to disagree - no disrespect intended but I believe that you've left a big gap in your reply. The verse I posted says "come to God BY him" - come to God by Christ, not by man, which, were by man, it would then be of man, not Christ; that is, if man must do something, anything, to obtain salvation, then Christ simply can't be the Saviour, right? It can't be both ways at the same time, can it -that man must do something in order to save himself, yet Christ still being the Saviour? How does that work?
To the contrary, Christ does not stop being the Saviour because many reject Him, that establishes it. And I never said that many would be saved because I don't believe that doctrine to be the case - not sure where you got that from?
I'll just say this - that it all comes down to this one simple and most fundamental doctrine - that Christ alone and in all ways is the Saviour and man is not and is not in any sense. Everything in the Bible was based upon that - were it more complicated, I would never be able to comprehend it.
If you can't follow my line of reasoning that's fine, many can't - no problem. In any event, I've enjoyed the dialogue.
Take care.
The unsaved were the abducted to begin with - which we all were of at one time or another. Satan, through Adam's and Eve's transgression, abducted all of mankind. By that, mankind became spiritually dead, servants of Satan, therefore blinded to the stipulation of God's marriage contract. A spiritually dead man is oblivious to spiritual stimuli just as a physically dead man is oblivious to physical stimuli, not having spiritual eyes that see, nor ears that hears, nor a heart that perceives. Since all those He saves He made full made payment for, it was/is His divine prerogative and good pleasure to apply it to whomsoever He wanted to (God makes clear that He was/is under no requirement to do otherwise). Therefore, by that payment, were they made His servants - no longer belonging to themselves nor to Satan but to God. However, once receiving spiritual life from spiritual death solely and completely as a free gift, none would ever choose to return back to that state of spiritual death - would you choose to give back a gazillion dollars just because someone put it in your bank account without your permission? In the below verses, we can see that God uses the word "dead". It was not meant figurately, but as an actual description of spiritual reality.
None of the unsaved understands God's marriage contract stipulation - their belief being that it can only be satisfied by force - through their actions and their strength - instead of by God's actions and His strength, which actions, alone satisfies its stipulation - that those saved should come to a true belief in Christ alone as Saviour.
[Eph 2:1 KJV]
1 And you [hath he quickened], who were dead in trespasses and sins;
[Col 2:13 KJV]
13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;
There is no such thing as spiritual free will to those spiritually dead in sin. How could there be? They cannot know the things of the Spirit. All of the unsaved are dead in sin until and unless becoming born again - that is why God calls it being born-again. To accept the offer is in accepting its stipulation, yet only those saved do so, and do so through/by God. They are those who have been given a new mind, a new heart, and a new spirit, through Christ.
[1Co 2:14 KJV] 14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know [them], because they are spiritually discerned.
[Rom 9:13-16 KJV]
13 As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated. 14 What shall we say then? [Is there] unrighteousness with God? God forbid.
15 For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion. 16 So then [it is] not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy.
Have to disagree - no disrespect intended but I believe that you've left a big gap in your reply. The verse I posted says "come to God BY him" - come to God by Christ, not by man, which, were by man, it would then be of man, not Christ; that is, if man must do something, anything, to obtain salvation, then Christ simply can't be the Saviour, right? It can't be both ways at the same time, can it -that man must do something in order to save himself, yet Christ still being the Saviour? How does that work?
To the contrary, Christ does not stop being the Saviour because many reject Him, that establishes it. And I never said that many would be saved because I don't believe that doctrine to be the case - not sure where you got that from?
I'll just say this - that it all comes down to this one simple and most fundamental doctrine - that Christ alone and in all ways is the Saviour and man is not and is not in any sense. Everything in the Bible was based upon that - were it more complicated, I would never be able to comprehend it.
If you can't follow my line of reasoning that's fine, many can't - no problem. In any event, I've enjoyed the dialogue.
Take care.
I follow your line of reasoning, and it is by no means the first time that I have encountered someone with your beliefs, but I do not agree with it for a host of reasons.
Rather than get into some long, drawn-out debate, I am content to just say that I enjoyed our dialogue as well, and I appreciate the fact that it remained cordial throughout its entirety.
Have a good night, Roger. You seem like a good guy, even though we disagree on this topic.
Rather than get into some long, drawn-out debate, I am content to just say that I enjoyed our dialogue as well, and I appreciate the fact that it remained cordial throughout its entirety.
Have a good night, Roger. You seem like a good guy, even though we disagree on this topic.
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In Hebrews 10:26, the term "sin willfully" carries the idea of deliberate intention which is habitual and stems from rejecting Christ deliberately. This is continuous action, a matter of practice. Now we don't walk along our daily life and "accidentally" fall into a pit called sin. We exercise our will but, the use of the participle clearly shows willful, continuous action. The unrighteous practice sin (1 Corinthians 6:9-10; Galatians 5:19-21); not the righteous, who are born of God. (1 Corinthians 6:11; 1 John 3:9)
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Read my post #49. The Hebrew letter was written to THEM and the scripture in question primarily relates to them as well; newly converted Jews, Hebrews, who were in danger of and being warned of denying Christ and returning to their old covenant ways. The willful sin, no more sacrifice for sin, the knowledge of the truth, etc relates to sacrifices for sin made under the old covenant vs. being in Christ under the NT. Is there application to us today? Could be if we were to deny Christ as they were warned of, but the verse relates to the Jews, at that time, and for a different reason than most people today erroneously view this as being applicable.
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Read my post #121 from the link below:
Can we be forgiven for sins we won't repent of? - Christian Chat Rooms & Forums
Also read my post #51 from the link below:
Hebrews 6 - Christian Chat Rooms & Forums
Can we be forgiven for sins we won't repent of? - Christian Chat Rooms & Forums
Also read my post #51 from the link below:
Hebrews 6 - Christian Chat Rooms & Forums
