tithing a way out of poverty

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Zandar

Well-known member
May 16, 2023
1,651
653
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#61
I'd rather tithe and be able to ask the Lord for help than not tithe and ask. If you tithe, you can pray to the Lord and say, Lord you know I support my church and its ministry and now I need your help because I don't see how to get through this situation.
 

GRACE_ambassador

Well-known member
Feb 22, 2021
3,242
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Midwest
#62
op: tithing a way out of poverty?

No ( Ephesians 4:28; 1 Thessalonians 4:11-12 ).
+
"Facts On Tithing​

1. The English word “tithe” as well as its Hebrew-Greek equivalents
“ma`aser” and “apodekatoo” means a tenth.

2. Many Christian churches preach tithing as a means of supporting
the work of the Lord today. There are many variations of this theme.
Some pay the local church one tenth of their income after taxes and
bills are paid; some pay before.

Others demand tithing on unemployment, inheritance, gifts, tax refunds,
social security and even gambling winnings. The tithing issue has caused
a great deal of strife and division in our churches over the years.

3. The most well known passage on tithing comes from the Old
Testament book of Malachi 3:7-10. This Scripture has given rise to
the practice of “Storehouse Tithing.” Simply stated, the congregation
is exhorted from the pulpit to channel all of their Christian giving
through the local church (storehouse).

If they wish to give to a Christian organization, radio or television
broadcast, etc., it must go through their denominational machinery
in order for the local church to get “credit.” Also the pastor and elders
often must make the determination if the cause supported by the giver
is “worthy.”

4. This use of the Malachi passage is a good example of Scripture
being taken out of its historical and dispensational context. “This
whole nation” in verse 9 is the backslidden nation of Israel, NOT
the present day church (Malachi 1:1; 3:6).

They were under the law of Moses as a system of conditional blessing.
Believers today are not under the law but under Grace (Romans 6:14).
As such we have already been blessed by God with all spiritual blessings
in heavenly places in Christ (Ephesians 1:3) and are under a system of
unconditional blessing with Grace on the throne (Romans 5:21).

5. This should put an end to the common charge that believers who
don’t tithe are “robbing God” and will be “cursed with a curse.” The
storehouse mentioned in verse 10 is not a local church but a storage
bin or silo in the Jewish temple where the grain from the Hebrew’s
tithes was stored (2 Chronicles 31:4-12). [ Ga says: Amen! ]

6. Under the law only agricultural products were tithed. They included
grain, fruit, and livestock. Only products produced within the boundaries
of the land of Israel were to be tithed. Jews living in Gentile lands were
exempt (Leviticus 27:30-34).

7. Others exempt from the tithing law included the hired hands,
fishermen, miners, lumber workers, construction workers, soldiers,
weavers, potters, manufacturers, merchants, government workers,
and priests. In short, all who were not farmers were exempt.

8. A farmer with only 9 cattle did not tithe because the law specified
the “tenth which passeth under the rod.” Likewise a farmer with 19
sheep paid only 1 sheep to the Lord’s tithe.

9. The Jewish farmers in the land could redeem (buy back) the tithes of
their crops with a penalty of one fifth. In other words, if a farmer wishes
to keep his tithe of grain worth $1,000, he could pay the cash equivalent
of $1,200 (Leviticus 27:31).

10. Livestock could not be brought back nor could the farmer exchange
a good animal for a bad one or vice versa. Any attempt to substitute any
other animal other than the tenth which passed under the rod would be
penalized by the farmer forfeiting both the tenth and its substitute
(Leviticus 27:33).

11. God ordained the Levites to be the ones to whom the tithe was paid
(Numbers 18:21). They were one of the 12 tribes of Israel to whom no
inheritance was given in the land. The Lord Himself and the tithes of the
children of Israel was their inheritance. It was used for the service of the
tabernacle (later the temple) (Numbers 18:20-28).

12. It was unlawful for anyone outside of the tribe of Levi to receive the
tithe, such as prophets, preachers, kings or evangelists.

13. The Levites paid one tenth of their tithes to the high priest. Not all
Levites were priests but only the sons of Aaron. The priests did not tithe.

14. The Lord Jesus Christ did not ask for or receive a tithe for support
of His ministry. Being of the tribe of Judah (not Levi) He could not
without breaking the law (Hebrews 7:14; Revelation 5:5).

15. Neither Peter (not of the tribe of Levi) nor Paul (of the tribe of
Benjamin) could receive tithes for the support of their ministries.

16. Even the Jews do not practice tithing today because there are no
Levites, priests, or temple worship in Jerusalem. Jewish rabbis know
biblical law well enough to know that tithing under the present
circumstances is unlawful. According to them, when the temple
is rebuilt in Jerusalem with a consecrated altar with priests and
Levites officiating, all Jews living within the biblical tithing zones
will tithe.

17. Some Christian ministries today continue to support tithing,
using the argument that it predates Moses and the law. But this
reasoning is not valid, for the Sabbath also predates the giving of
the law (Exodus 16:23-29) and yet it is not binding on God’s people
today (Romans 14:5,6; Galatians 4:9,10; Colossians 2:16,17).

18. Abraham gave tithes to Melchisedec, king of Salem, but this was
the spoils of war, not the legalistic tithe of the land which Moses
commanded. Also, God did not command the tithe, Abraham chose to
give it of his own free will (Genesis 14:17-23; Hebrews 7:1-10).

19. The only other scriptural reference to tithing before Moses is
Jacob. Again there is no command to tithe. In fact Jacob puts up
numerous conditions to be met before he will pay the tithe to
the Lord (Genesis 28:20-22).

20. The biblical references which address the tithing issues are:
Genesis 14:20; 28:22; Leviticus 27:30-32; Numbers 18:20-28;
Deuteronomy 12:6,11,17; 14:22,23,28; 26:12; 2 Chronicles 31:5,6,12;
Amos 4:4; Malachi 3:8-10; Matthew 23:23; Luke 11:42; 18:12;
Hebrews 7:5-9. ( see Notes below... )

21. Paul the apostle to the Gentiles for this present dispensation of
Grace does not mention tithing but says a great deal about Christian
giving. Romans 15:25,26; 1 Corinthians 9:7-14; 16:1-3; 2 Corinthians
chapters 8 & 9; Galatians 6:6-10; Philippians 4:10-19; 1 Timothy 5:9-18.

WHO is to give to the Lord’s work? The Christian! He gives​
systematically, sacrificially, and joyfully. TO WHOM does he give?​
To Christ! FOR WHAT does he give? For the cause of Christ! NOT​
to a man or to a church, not for gain, but for the Gospel.​
Notes:

According to Deuteronomy 14:22,23,28; 26:12; and Amos 4:4,​
the tithe was only given every three years."​
( K Lawson F.O.T. )

heart THANKSGIVING of Paul.png
 

Zandar

Well-known member
May 16, 2023
1,651
653
113
#63
I think why people repel away from giving tithes is because a lot of people say its mandatory.

Me personally, I feel like the Lord wants me to tithe, and it does seem fair to me because if I'm a member of a church and everyone is giving a tithe then you have some not giving so its on the ones thats giving to support the church. The early church didnt give a tithe they gave it all. Then divided it to the ones that had need.
 

Blade

Well-known member
Nov 19, 2019
1,803
631
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#64
is tithing the way out of poverty?
There is a truth in what you ask. When we give we give because He has blessed us and He always blesses us in return. There are times we give when we don't have it to give.. that takes faith no doubt and man He always comes through ever time. Its like you have not because you ask not or "your asking wrong". Asking wrong is making it personal..ooh I could use a new TV!.. no that prayer will never work your asking wrong. He LOVES to bless us always in everything. You give.. He gives back even greater! Every Faith preacher out there is not evil. They do know faith which does not get touched just like prayer. To of the greatest things yet almost never touched.

See its not what anyone says here for we just tell you what we personally believe. So you look into this you find what GOD said not what man tell us God said. So if you find something GOD said.. then its done and you do not have to pray to receive it..it has been already given. What does He say about giving? You give and He will "Give, and it will be given to you. They will pour into your lap a good measure—pressed down, shaken together, and running over [with no space left for more]. For with the standard of measurement you use [when you do good to others], it will be measured to you in return.”

Cast your bread.. God loves a cheerful giver. We always given believing knowing He will give us back more then we ever gave to Him. I don't believe John 3:16 hoping maybe He will give me every lasting life. The point is.. He made us promises. So you take them receive them or not. If GOD said.. then its done.. you don't have to pray hoping He will do something He already promised you. You are as Isaac was children of promise. You are a joint heir with Christ. You just never give like one so called prophet .. not seen any more odd but "if you give $87 dollars today God will protect your children. But you have to give now and if you do God will also protect your children from being shot". Now a truth yet not. You can give and expect God to bless you.. He promised. But you never have to give to have God protect you.. no that was no faith preacher.

So if you give.. He knows what you need.. expect Him to always help.. you never have to give GOD a dime to get Him to help you with money with a job ..if you never gave a dime.. you still get blessed ..if you believe walk by faith.
 

ThyKingdomComeSoon

Well-known member
Apr 1, 2023
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#65
probably someone brought this up but the apostles had a system to counter poverty then;

Act 4:32 And the multitude of them that believed were of one heart and of one soul: neither said any of them that ought of the things which he possessed was his own; but they had all things common.
Act 4:33 And with great power gave the apostles witness of the resurrection of the Lord Jesus: and great grace was upon them all.
Act 4:34 Neither was there any among them that lacked: for as many as were possessors of lands or houses sold them, and brought the prices of the things that were sold,
Act 4:35 And laid them down at the apostles' feet: and distribution was made unto every man according as he had need.

Blessings,
 

hornetguy

Senior Member
Jan 18, 2016
7,181
1,802
113
#66
I absolutely believe Tithing works.
Tithing "works" ???
Works for what? To make you more wealthy?
Tithing, or giving, is not supposed to "work" to make you more wealthy.
Sometimes, that can be the result, because God told us that we cannot "out-give" Him.... but that is not the reason we should do it.
 
F

FollowingtheWay

Guest
#67
I found a good teaching on giving and our attitude towards it .It’s called the Treasure principal by Randy Alcorn. The synopsis is - we cannot take our treasures with us, but we can send it on ahead in the age to come. Yes God loves to take care of His children but Are we thinking eternally when we give or are we trying to focus on our best life lived now? Good read and I’d encourage those curious to read it or watch his video series.
 

ThyKingdomComeSoon

Well-known member
Apr 1, 2023
974
596
93
#68
Giving to the Needy
Mat 6:1 Take heed that ye do not your alms before men, to be seen of them: otherwise ye have no reward of your Father which is in heaven.
Mat 6:2 Therefore when thou doest thine alms, do not sound a trumpet before thee, as the hypocrites do in the synagogues and in the streets, that they may have glory of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward.
Mat 6:3 But when thou doest alms, let not thy left hand know what thy right hand doeth:
Mat 6:4 That thine alms may be in secret: and thy Father which seeth in secret himself shall reward thee openly.

Lay Up Treasures in Heaven
Mat 6:19 Lay not up for yourselves treasures upon earth, where moth and rust doth corrupt, and where thieves break through and steal:
Mat 6:20 But lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust doth corrupt, and where thieves do not break through nor steal:
Mat 6:21 For where your treasure is, there will your heart be also.
 
Jun 20, 2022
6,460
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#69
Tithing "works" ???
Works for what? To make you more wealthy?
Tithing, or giving, is not supposed to "work" to make you more wealthy.
Sometimes, that can be the result, because God told us that we cannot "out-give" Him.... but that is not the reason we should do it.
Has nothing to do with anything you've inquired.
It all has to do with seeing if the Promises God made then are still in effect today.
If something is true 100 years ago, it should be true today.
I am applying that same concept to 4,800 years ago, because, it is God, making the Promise!
 
Oct 9, 2021
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#70
Probably (or should we say certainly) for the preachers who harp on this for their own benefit. "The message of many televangelist revolves around the concept of seed faith, in which money is the seed for your faith. By donating money to these televangelists, you are showing your faith to God. They highly stress tithes, even saying that not tithing is equivalent to robbing God...And while televangelists may use this verse to tell you to give more in order to show that you don't love money, the issue here is that these televangelists are manipulating people into giving them money because THEY love money. And they show their love for money and material goods by buying 10 million dollar homes and 60 million dollar jets for personal use (although some claim it's for use by the "church").
https://www.messiah-of-god.com/weekly-sermon-prosperity-gospel-tithing-televangelists.html
I do not like television evangelists for they seem phony, and they do love money, but if that is the case then they do not love people then they have no salvation, because charity, love in action, is greater than faith, and hope, and the love of money is the root of all evil for it neglects the poor and needy, and love is the fulfilling of the law.

Without love you are nothing, your faith is dead, and the love of God does not dwell in you.

Television evangelists do not love people they love money, and the Bible says do not love in word, neither in tongue, but in deed, works, and truth, so their talking that they love does no good if they are heaping money to themselves neglecting the poor and needy.

When I first was interested in Christianity I contacted a television evangelist named Rod Parsley with a question for I did not they were phony, and he was hitting me up right away to donate money to him for that is what they care about money even before you become a Christian.
 

studentoftheword

Well-known member
Nov 12, 2021
1,747
609
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#71
When I first was interested in Christianity I contacted a television evangelist named Rod Parsley with a question for I did not they were phony, and he was hitting me up right away to donate money to him for that is what they care about money even before you become a Christian.
Well ---maybe this is a lie -----but seems to me this Ron Parsley is doing what he is suppose to do with his Donations --feed the poor -----and you refuse to give so he can continue to do so ----doesn't sound like a Good Christian move to me ----seems you only see and hear what you want to see and hear -------like all the others who have no idea what their funds really do and where they go ------

Seems your glasses are full of trees so you can't see any forest ------




From youtube

Become a Breakthrough Covenant Partner today, and help Pastor Rod Parsley shape the future for thousands of people in need of the loving hand of an all-sufficient Savior. Your partnership will also help Pastor Parsley preach the gospel of Jesus Christ through the Breakthrough television broadcast






Kenneth Copland Ministries ------seems to me there is some work going on for God through his ministry ---but we don't want to see that-----OH MY !!! ----all we want to see is his huge house and plane and living beyond his needs ------Don't want to see that just maybe there is some good being done ------now only God knows where Kenneth"s heart lies in doing this -----So Only God can be his judge ------all we can do is trash and bash the man for what he possesses ---as we don't know what his motive is in doing God's work -----

https://blog.kcm.org/kindnessmatters-in-south-africa/

We are excited to announce that #KindnessMatters has gone global! In the last few months, KCM Africa has provided food to the hungry and given hope to the hopeless.
Through #KindnessMatters, we have done what Jesus told us to do when He said, “‘I tell you the truth, when you did it to one of the least of these my brothers and sisters, you were doing it to me!’” (Matthew 25:40).
Now, the #KindessMatters outreach has extended around the world through the work of our South Africa Kenneth Copeland Ministries office.

#KindnessMatters in Johannesburg, South Africa
In December, KCM Africa partnered with Rhema Faith Life Church to pack and distribute 250 buckets full of groceries to a poor community in Johannesburg, South Africa. What a blessing it was to make a tangible difference in the lives of people in that city!
#KindnessMatters in Krugersdorp, South Africa
Also in December, KCM Africa provided more food containers to two informal settlements in Krugersdorp, South Africa. One hundred families living below the poverty line, without running water, electricity or any hope received a container filled with enough food to see them through the Christmas season.
 

studentoftheword

Well-known member
Nov 12, 2021
1,747
609
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#72
Creflo Dollar is another one people like to trash and bast for his possessions -----seems to me he also is doing some of God's work

Creflo Dollar Ministries South Africa
March 2, 2022 ·
Creflo Dollar Global Missions has partnered with Botlokwa Primary School in Limpopo for the past ten years. We would like to continue providing the school with tablets, white boards, and a projector for their library & classrooms in an effort to give every learner the chance to reach their full potential as they increase their computer literacy.

Notice this ---no demanding of any money -----just supplies for the school -----

Should an individual or organisation wish to donate such items please do get in touch with our office.


Creflo Dollar Global Missions
September 18, 2021 ·

Our CDGM #HopeInDisaster team is dedicated to serving the needs of international and domestic communities devastated by natural disasters.
Currently, we are reaching out to the families who have been impacted in any way by the recent hurricanes and floods.

Creflo is a TEACHER of the Word ------- not a PREACHER ------

Don't listen to this Sermon you just might learn some truth -----straight from the Word ----

 

studentoftheword

Well-known member
Nov 12, 2021
1,747
609
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#73
As Far as Donations goes EVERY CHURCH asks for Donations ------the church has bills to pay heat --lights and a Minister to pay and up keep to the Building plus it needs funds to help the poor ------your church plate is passes around for your donation and that is separate from your Tithe -----and some Churches have a benevolent fund that people donate to also to help the poor ------

All Churches need money to survive and help people in need -------you think it is cheap to run a TV service ----well think again ---

From Google
May 30, 2013 — The average church doesn't have the budget to get on a national TV station or even the budget to produce a nationally televised broadcast, ...

Churches need donations to be on TV ------

here is something to ponder ---and this is just 30 seconds

30 SECOND TV COMMERCIAL COST?

In fact, a professional-looking 30 second commercial can potentially be produced for as low as $10,000.
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
25,614
13,863
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#74
As Far as Donations goes EVERY CHURCH asks for Donations ------the church has bills to pay heat --lights and a Minister to pay and up keep to the Building plus it needs funds to help the poor ------your church plate is passes around for your donation and that is separate from your Tithe -----and some Churches have a benevolent fund that people donate to also to help the poor
If ‘donations’ are for bills, salaries and the poor, what are ‘tithes’ for, in your view, and what verses do you use to support your position?
 

hornetguy

Senior Member
Jan 18, 2016
7,181
1,802
113
#75
As Far as Donations goes EVERY CHURCH asks for Donations ------the church has bills to pay heat --lights and a Minister to pay and up keep to the Building plus it needs funds to help the poor ------your church plate is passes around for your donation and that is separate from your Tithe -----and some Churches have a benevolent fund that people donate to also to help the poor ------

All Churches need money to survive and help people in need -------you think it is cheap to run a TV service ----well think again ---

From Google
May 30, 2013 — The average church doesn't have the budget to get on a national TV station or even the budget to produce a nationally televised broadcast, ...

Churches need donations to be on TV ------

here is something to ponder ---and this is just 30 seconds

30 SECOND TV COMMERCIAL COST?

In fact, a professional-looking 30 second commercial can potentially be produced for as low as $10,000.
Most of what you say is true....
I think the rub comes in when the "pastor" seems to think it is necessary to wear $4000 suits, Rolex watches, and drive Bentleys....
I know of one of those in the Dallas area that does just that, yet a woman from his congregation came to talk to me (I was the deacon over the benevolence funds at the time) at our church, that was about 25 miles away.
She had asked for help from her mega-church, and they told her they would "pray for her", and that was it. Yet the "pastor" did exactly as I described above....
That's the type of behavior that really turns people off to televangelists....
 

studentoftheword

Well-known member
Nov 12, 2021
1,747
609
113
#78
If ‘donations’ are for bills, salaries and the poor, what are ‘tithes’ for, in your view, and what verses do you use to support your position?
In the Old Testament there were 3 types of tithe ---all had different functions ------the Tithe should be used for advancing God's Kingdom ----many Churches give tithe money to missionaries ------

The three different types are as follows:

1. The Levitical, or sacred tithe (Num. 18: 21, 24).

2. The tithe of the feasts (Deut. 14:22-27).

3. The tithe for the poor (Deut. 14:28, 29).


1 Corinthians 16

Common English Bible

Collection for Jerusalem
16 Concerning the collection of money for God’s people: You should do what I have directed the churches in Galatia to do. 2 On the first day of the week, each of you should set aside whatever you can afford from what you earn so that the collection won’t be delayed until I come. 3 Then when I get there, I’ll send whomever you approve to Jerusalem with letters of recommendation to bring your gift. 4 If it seems right for me to go too, they’ll travel with me.
 

Paran

Active member
Feb 25, 2023
119
53
28
#79
is tithing the way out of poverty?
Getting a Job is the beginning of financial security.

And regarding "tithing"...

Understand it like this.

Everything you have, belongs to God, if you are born again, and not just water baptized and religious.
So, that includes your money.
Its His, and you get to use it.
And that means, when you give a Tithe or Offering, or give to the Poor..., you are investing His money, and that always brings a return, because all things with God are life and increase.

Learn to see it like that.
 

studentoftheword

Well-known member
Nov 12, 2021
1,747
609
113
#80
And here is a big glitch in people Tithing and Donating their money to the Church----they donate and Tithe cause they get a receipt from the church to claim on their income tax so they get a portion of it back ------so they are really not Giving freely to God or the Church -----they are actually expecting a return and relying on the government not God for their blessing in that return -----