Do you think transgenders go to heaven?

[HealthAndHappiness]

For me, when a member quits the site or is banned, it is like a death in the family. Kind of sad, really.

Sorry , but I disagree.
I've lost family members.
Some stranger who has a fictional name who is deleted from participating in a written correspondence with strangers they just met is not to be compared.

The moderator did not just kill someone.

 

[Gideon300]

And if you don't try to produce sorrow over sin, period, you will not be able to produce godly sorrow and thus they will not repent unto salvation.

What? Try to produce sorrow? In other words, fake it. True conviction is from the Holy Spirit, not something we have to conjure up ourselves. I faked sorrow often as a child. It helped me get away with wrongdoing and made me a hypocrite. God prefers the honest sinner to the self righteous hypocrite.

 

[Nehemiah6]

How much better might it be if the Christians that unbelievers see weren't hypocrites in the first place!

Well calling Christians "hypocrites" is the easy way to dodge the issue of self-examination, repentance, and faith. No doubt there are hypocritical Christians (and in fact just about everyone could be said to be guilty of that, just as Peter happened to fail into that mode at one point). But that is no excuse for anyone to see the perfection of Christ and believe on Him.

 

[Gideon300]

Every single sin has been paid for and forgiven, repentance is once, belief is once, the rest is discipleship and growing in the Lord and Saviour.

I see no scripture for your last statement, that believer loses forgiveness.

There are two issues here. The first is eternal life, the second is the Kingdom of God. It is possible to have eternal life yet miss out on God's kingdom. 1 Corinthians 6:9 is often used to condemn the sin of unbelievers. This is a misuse of the passage. Paul wrote to the church. The warning is that those who refuse to change their behaviour will not inherit the kingdom of God.

We get one life in which to prepare for God's kingdom. There are great rewards for those prepared to seek God's kingdom first. Those who live for themselves only will have little to show for their lives on earth.

 

[heartwashed]

Well you have to understand like I mentioned people deal with things that greatly affect them, he had a lot of self worth issues and feared God hated him he was told all the time how he was a sinner how verse after verse was shown to him he also struggled with suicidal thoughts as well as axiety he was always told what was wrong with him so even though he wanted to know God and wanted to believe in forgiveness he because of his mental issues when mainly just recieving from people how he was a sinner more than being shown the love understanding and willingness to listen

We have to remember that even Christians deal with depression or axiety or suicidal thoughts or being good enough not everyone has a solid stable mind if even Christians who have the hope of salvation deal with this imagine someone who struggles with the stuff we are talking about who may not have that.

The Bible teaches that God loves us even though we are sinners (Romans 5:8).

This is what he needed to hear most; without being negligent to tell him that he was a sinner.

It is important for us to know; even for our salvation (see 1 John 1:8-10).

 

[HeIsHere]

There are two issues here. The first is eternal life, the second is the Kingdom of God. It is possible to have eternal life yet miss out on God's kingdom. 1 Corinthians 6:9 is often used to condemn the sin of unbelievers. This is a misuse of the passage. Paul wrote to the church. The warning is that those who refuse to change their behaviour will not inherit the kingdom of God.

We get one life in which to prepare for God's kingdom. There are great rewards for those prepared to seek God's kingdom first. Those who live for themselves only will have little to show for their lives on earth.

I had not thought of it this way, I need to go and read the passages, but this makes sense to me, thank you I like a fresh approach or a new insight.

I have become keenly aware now that many people on this Christian Chat site do not know the Gospel based on how they counseled this person who was banned.

Seriously, there should be victory in Christ, if there isn't we might as well all call it a day, to tell a person they are too focused on their sin and just go about their day is about the worst advice any Christian can give.

Sin is destructive, would one say to an anorexic "oh don't worry if you don't eat and vomit what little you do eat, you will be fine."
That is not love nor is it truth.
I have seen non believers take a stronger stand again sin.
Very sad.

 

[heartwashed]

What? Try to produce sorrow? In other words, fake it. True conviction is from the Holy Spirit, not something we have to conjure up ourselves. I faked sorrow often as a child. It helped me get away with wrongdoing and made me a hypocrite. God prefers the honest sinner to the self righteous hypocrite.

I meant trying to produce godly sorrow in others in the power of the Holy Ghost.

 

[heartwashed]

Well calling Christians "hypocrites" is the easy way to dodge the issue of self-examination, repentance, and faith. No doubt there are hypocritical Christians (and in fact just about everyone could be said to be guilty of that, just as Peter happened to fail into that mode at one point). But that is no excuse for anyone to <not-fify> see the perfection of Christ and believe on Him.

Nevertheless, many sinners see it as a valid excuse.

Consider Philemon 1:6 (kjv)...

Phm 1:6, That the communication of thy faith may become effectual by the acknowledging of every good thing which is in you in Christ Jesus.

 

[HeIsHere]

A lot of people still don't seem to understand that LGBTQ activists are coming for the church. They have no intention of being conformed to God's will or to Christ. They expect the church, God and Jesus to conform to them. It's important to distinguish who is who and treat them accordingly. Yes, we should treat everyone with love and respect but that doesn't mean we turn our brains off. If we do, people are going to look up and see their church going the way of the UMC or others who have caved to the LGBTQ agenda.

They are coming for the children, the church is in the way, but from the dialogue on this thread perhaps the church has already become impotent.

 

[heartwashed]

Every single sin has been paid for and forgiven, repentance is once, belief is once, the rest is discipleship and growing in the Lord and Saviour.

I see no scripture for your last statement, that believer loses forgiveness.

There are four types of soil in the parable of the sower and only one type endures bearing fruit to the end.

One of the types is not a believer at all.

Two of the types are believers in my opinion (the shallow ground and the thorny ground)...the plants grow but one dies quickly for lack of moisture and the other is choked out) for all practical purposes.

If one type the shallow soil, falls away, then that indicates that "believers can fall away"

And if another type is choked out by thorns then that indicates that believers can be overcome by the world.

It is only the fourth type of soil...an honest and good heart that bears fruit an hundredfold (Luke 8:15), that can be said to have eternal security as it is promised to us in such passages as John 5:24 and John 10:27-30.

Therefore, if two types of soil do not have eternal security, and they are believers, then a believer can lose forgiveness.

 

[heartwashed]

Sorry , but I disagree.
I've lost family members.
Some stranger who has a fictional name who is deleted from participating in a written correspondence with strangers they just met is not to be compared.

The moderator did not just kill someone.

However, when certain godly ministers are banned, it is the same as martyring them.

If they had been standing right in front of certain moderators and preaching, and those same moderators did not have the option of pressing a button in order to squelch their voice, I have no doubt that if the preaching became incessant they would burn those ministers at the stake in order to squelch their voice.

I am not necessarily talking about these boards.

 

[Cameron143]

There are four types of soil in the parable of the sower and only one type endures bearing fruit to the end.

One of the types is not a believer at all.

Two of the types are believers in my opinion (the shallow ground and the thorny ground)...the plants grow but one dies quickly for lack of moisture and the other is choked out) for all practical purposes.

If one type the shallow soil, falls away, then that indicates that "believers can fall away"

And if another type is choked out by thorns then that indicates that believers can be overcome by the world.

It is only the fourth type of soil...an honest and good heart that bears fruit an hundredfold (Luke 8:15), that can be said to have eternal security as it is promised to us in such passages as John 5:24 and John 10:27-30.

Therefore, if two types of soil do not have eternal security, and they are believers, then a believer can lose forgiveness.

If it doesn't produce a harvest isn't it cut down and cast into the fire. Perhaps only one ground was actually believers.

 

[heartwashed]

Are you feeling triggered?

I can assure John is not preaching sinless perfectionism.

"sinless perfectionism" is a misnomer that is applied to the doctrine of "entire sanctification" in order to create a straw man that is easily toppled by 1 John 1:8.

While "entire sanctification" as a doctrine, does not preach that sin is eradicated from the body; but rather that the element of sin within the body is rendered dead (Romans 6:6, Galatians 5:24, Romans 7:8) so that it no longer has any say over our behaviour (Romans 6:14, Romans 8:12 (nlt)).

scriptures:

1Jo 1:8, If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
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Rom 6:6, Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.

Gal 5:24, And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.

Rom 7:8, But sin, taking occasion by the commandment, wrought in me all manner of concupiscence. For without the law sin was dead.
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Rom 6:14, For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.

Rom 8:12 (nlt), Therefore, dear brothers and sisters, you have no obligation to do what your sinful nature urges you to do.

 

[heartwashed]

If it doesn't produce a harvest isn't it cut down and cast into the fire. Perhaps only one ground was actually believers.

Only one ground was actually the elect.

The scripture is clear that the seed planted on shallow ground represents someone who "believes for a while and then falls away".

1) they believe, for a while;

and,

2) in order to fall away, you have to fall away from something.

 

[heartwashed]

Repentance if not feeling sorrow about one's sin.
You can feel sorry all you want but that is not what Jesus requires of us.

However, godly sorrow leads to genuine repentance (2 Corinthians 7:10).

 

[Cameron143]

Only one ground was actually the elect.

The scripture is clear that the seed planted on shallow ground represents someone who "believes for a while and then falls away".

1) they believe, for a while;

and,

2) in order to fall away, you have to fall away from something.

Or...they have a superficial belief which is evidenced by the lack of roots and easily choked out by their earthly concerns.

They merely had a form of godliness without any attendant power.

 

[heartwashed]

Or...they have a superficial belief which is evidenced by the lack of roots and easily choked out by their earthly concerns.

They merely had a form of godliness without any attendant power.

Yes, I would say that their belief is, indeed, superficial.

Belief nevertheless; even a belief that can obtain some of the promises for a season.

 

[Cameron143]

Yes, I would say that their belief is, indeed, superficial.

Belief nevertheless; even a belief that can obtain some of the promises for a season.

That's my point...they never attained anything. Whatever they thought they had was shown to not exist. Otherwise, their roots would have grown deep and they wouldn't have been overcome by the cares of this world.
When God grants eternal life, He forges and everlasting bond to the believer. No one can take them out of His or the Father's hand.

 

[Blain]

The Bible teaches that God loves us even though we are sinners (Romans 5:8).

This is what he needed to hear most; without being negligent to tell him that he was a sinner.

It is important for us to know; even for our salvation (see 1 John 1:8-10).

Yes and I did all I could to help him understand that but at the time there was a thread on the subject and this was more than brutal as some hard head came on here created the thread and sadly he saw it and got involved with this guy before I could get a hold of him.

He had a family that never understood him and he always felt alone this guy was smart too as he draws you in as seemingly sincere but then eventually shows his true colors.

So it was a tragic situation and that is one of the stories I have as God seems to draw these type of people into my life one way or another I met one about three years ago who is one of those people you only hear about those people who literally just by being shown actual care understanding and just listening was brought to tears and was shocked to find out I was a Christian he literally told me I was the first actual Christian he ever met


So this is why in a way I am not unaware that accepting being transgender is a sin I also know the damage that telling them what they have heard over and over again is not going to reach them they have heard it all before

And rather honestly with this I find results much more just by getting to know them just showing an actual interest creating a connection

 

[heartwashed]

That's my point...they never attained anything. Whatever they thought they had was shown to not exist. Otherwise, their roots would have grown deep and they wouldn't have been overcome by the cares of this world.
When God grants eternal life, He forges and everlasting bond to the believer. No one can take them out of His or the Father's hand.

In the latter three types of ground, you are dealing with living plants.