Calvin did not invent the doctrines of grace

[VARob]

Anything not a gift is a work because we would have to achieve it of ourselves.
Not only would it be a work, but it would then also be a law.

No, VARob, it just doesn't say that. You contradict your own statement: If it is the work of God as you said, then how could
it be possible that anyone else could do it?

Signing off for now. If you want to hold to Calvinism, nobody can stop you, for now. One day Jesus Christ himself will explain to you that Calvinism is a false belief system.

 

[VARob]

Look, I think this is becoming unfruitful. I don't see much benefit in our continuing,

Agreed. God bless.

 

[FrankSophia]

Becoming born-again is that from which true faith comes, by God through the Holy Spirit to His elect, and to no one else.

What do you mean by born again?

Acts 19:1-7 shows both common answers are wrong, they believe and have been baptized by water but do not know the Spirit...

Jesus immerses us in the Spirit which is oneness, light and love... this is the second birth and our salvation.

 

[rogerg]

What do you mean by born again?

Acts 19:1-7 shows both common answers are wrong, they believe and have been baptized by water but do not know the Spirit...

Jesus immerses us in the Spirit which is oneness, light and love... this is the second birth and our salvation.

To be born again means that God makes someone spiritually alive (spiritually reborn), who had been spiritual dead (everyone ever born was born spiritually dead) upon which, the Holy Spirit indwells them and imparts unto them, the fruits of the Spirit - one of which is true faith - all by God, nothing by man.

[Eph 2:1 KJV] 1 And you [hath he quickened], who were dead in trespasses and sins;
[Col 2:13 KJV] 13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;

 

[FrankSophia]

To be born again means that God makes someone spiritually alive (spiritually reborn), who had been spiritual dead -
upon which, the Holy Spirit indwells them and imparts unto them, the fruits of the Spirit - one of which is true faith.

[Eph 2:1 KJV] 1 And you [hath he quickened], who were dead in trespasses and sins;
[Col 2:13 KJV] 13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;

All you have is concepts...

This is a reality for me, it has happened... I guess by your belief system it makes me one of the elect?

You are not speaking from the experience, you are just echoing positions you accept.

 

[Cameron143]

All you have is concepts...

This is a reality for me, it has happened... I guess by your belief system it makes me one of the elect?

You are not speaking from the experience, you are just echoing positions you accept.

Experience doesn't inform doctrine. Doctrine informs experience.

 

[FrankSophia]

Experience doesn't inform doctrine. Doctrine informs experience.

This is erroneous...

The Spirit came upon the followers at Pentecost, the things they wrote were inspired by this... they are not a replacement for it.

 

[rogerg]

All you have is concepts...

This is a reality for me, it has happened... I guess by your belief system it makes me one of the elect?

You are not speaking from the experience, you are just echoing positions you accept.

The Bible ALONE defines and reveals spiritual truth. It is from there that my positions originate.

 

[Cameron143]

This is erroneous...

The Spirit came upon the followers at Pentecost, the things they wrote were inspired by this... they are not a replacement for it.

Doctrine is truth. Experience is limited by truth. Otherwise, you have nothing to test the spirits by.

 

[rogerg]

This is erroneous...

The Spirit came upon the followers at Pentecost, the things they wrote were inspired by this... they are not a replacement for it.

The Holy Spirit inspired and caused their experiences as you say. Not the reverse.

 

[FrankSophia]

The Bible ALONE defines and reveals spiritual truth. It is from there that my positions originate.

My path has been quite the opposite...

The Spirit has guided me towards many things and then shown me how the new testament says the same...

I intuitively avoided Christians directly because they all seem to violate scripture, but I didn't know that back then so I ended up hating Christianity as such...

Today my mission is to bring all that is wrong in Christianity to an end so that no one else has to go the long way like me.

 

[FrankSophia]

Doctrine is truth. Experience is limited by truth. Otherwise, you have nothing to test the spirits by.

Since it is the same Spirit moving the authors and those speaking truth today there should be no conflict between them... but they may disagree with your interpretation in various ways.

 

[rogerg]

This contradicts your previous statement.

How so?

 

[Cameron143]

How so?

My fault. I thought a previous poster had said this. My apologies.

 

[rogerg]

My fault. I thought a previous poster had said this. My apologies.

No problem.

 

[Cameron143]

Since it is the same Spirit moving the authors and those speaking truth today there should be no conflict between them... but they may disagree with your interpretation in various ways.

The problem isn't the word of God. The problem is in interpreting according to one's experience. It opens the door to private interpretation.

 

[rogerg]

My path has been quite the opposite...

The Spirit has guided me towards many things and then shown me how the new testament says the same...

I intuitively avoided Christians directly because they all seem to violate scripture, but I didn't know that back then so I ended up hating Christianity as such...

Today my mission is to bring all that is wrong in Christianity to an end so that no one else has to go the long way like me.

Christianity is Christ and He as the Saviour. What could be wrong about that? If you believe that to be wrong, then you are
in very great jeopardy indeed.

 

[FrankSophia]

The problem isn't the word of God. The problem is in interpreting according to one's experience. It opens the door to private interpretation.

The problem is our reading will be through worldly interpretation...

Unless we have actually received the Spirit we will not understand what those speaking from it are really saying...

This is a huge problem, and relying on others superficial interpretations doesn't improve the situation.

 

[FrankSophia]

Christianity is Christ and He as the Saviour. What could be wrong about that? If you believe that to be wrong, then you are
in very great jeopardy indeed.

I am merely suggesting you are one of those he will send away because he doesn't know them...

In reality God is found through silence and stillness, all texts can do is create different disturbances...

The Orthodox call this hesychasm.

 

[Cameron143]

The problem is our reading will be through worldly interpretation...

Unless we have actually received the Spirit we will not understand what those speaking from it are really saying...

This is a huge problem, and relying on others superficial interpretations doesn't improve the situation.

I agree that one must be made alive to understand spiritual things correctly. I disagree that our experience is to serve as a barometer of truth.