What Does It Mean That God Desires All People To Be Saved?

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Cameron143

Cameron143

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oyster67 said:
1 Timothy 2:
3 For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;
4 Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
6 Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.

That is a beautiful passage. I fail to see how that would cause anyone to be troubled.


Revelation 3:20 certainly is for all men and certainly is about salvation. When a man opens his heart's door to Jesus, Jesus comes in to stay. That's not an opinion. That is a fact.
Revelation 3:20
“Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.”

This is part of a letter to a church of the day, but this can be said of the vast majority of NT writings. This is the Gospel of Jesus. It is the same message that is proclaimed in John 3. Jesus desires a personal relationship with every man, women, and child ever born... and yes, that is salvation. That is what He died on the cross to make freely available to all.


Mercy is freely available to all and to all who reject it justice shall be applied in it's stead.
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The reference to desire is the purpose of the thread. The passage is beautiful. I'm in no way troubled.
The initial address of Jesus to unbelievers is to repent, not sup. That's why I believe it deals with fellowship and not salvation.
 
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memmett

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Cameron143 said:
I believe this verse is speaking of fellowship with the believer and not salvation.
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The Lord asks believers to fellowship with Him but He does not get angry with those who refuse? Is this the same thing we see in Luke 14?

Luke 14:24
For I say unto you, That none of those men which were bidden shall taste of my supper.
 
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ForestGreenCook

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Cameron143 said:
Let's suppose I am going on a trip. I make all the arrangements, set a date, and wait. But I also would like it to be a family excursion. I desire their company.

Is it considered a desire if I only have a strong feeling of wanting? Do I need to do anything to make my desire a desire? If I volunteer to incur all the expenses for my family does this make it a desire when before it wasn't? What if I only volunteered to pay for some family members? Does this affect whether it is a desire or lessen the desire to have the company of my family?

I ask these questions so they will be top of mind when asking the same questions about God's desire that all people are saved? Can God's desire for the salvation of people be independent of people? Does God have to do anything for people in order for His desire to be genuine? If so, does He have to act equally towards all people for His desire to be real?

I'm not attempting to offer this as proof of one set of ideas over another. It is simply to understand the nature of what is entailed in a desire and what is not. Consequently, and perhaps impossibly, I am asking for unbiased thought. I am asking that as you consider the question, you set aside, as much as is possible, how you would answer based on your other held beliefs, and consider the question independently from other doctrine.

Thanks. And I look forward to your responses.
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Can you give me a scripture where God desires something. I thought God purposes, and wills things, and those thing will happen.
 
Nehemiah6

Nehemiah6

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ForestGreenCook said:
Can you give me a scripture where God desires something. I thought God purposes, and wills things, and those thing will happen.
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You would rather have God conform to your WARPED THEOLOGY than simply accept the truth. You are so brainwashed and indoctrinated that you would rather die defending lies than give them up for the truth. Extremely sad but an object lesson to all who are not committed to Gospel truth 100%.
 
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memmett

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ForestGreenCook said:
Can you give me a scripture where God desires something. I thought God purposes, and wills things, and those thing will happen.
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One of the most moving verses to me in the entire Bible is this:

Luke 22:15
And he said unto them, With desire I have desired to eat this passover with you before I suffer:
 
oyster67

oyster67

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Cameron143 said:
The initial address of Jesus to unbelievers is to repent, not sup. That's why I believe it deals with fellowship and not salvation.
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The initial address of Revelation 3:20 is to open the door of one's heart to Jesus. That is about salvation.
Revelation 3:20
“Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.”
 
Cameron143

Cameron143

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oyster67 said:
The initial address of Revelation 3:20 is to open the door of one's heart to Jesus. That is about salvation.
Revelation 3:20
“Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.”
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Given that there is no call to repentance which is the address Jesus uses for unbelievers and that the letter is addressed to the churches, I think we'll just have to agree to disagree.
 
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ForestGreenCook

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Cameron143 said:
1 Timothy 2:4
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I agree that God gives mankind the freedom to choose how he wants to live his life while he resides here on earth, That is why he choose an elect family, because no one desired to seek him. He desires that his elect follow his commandments, but he does not desire anyone to be saved (delivered) eternally, he purposes their eternal salvation (deliverance) by his grace.
 
Cameron143

Cameron143

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ForestGreenCook said:
I agree that God gives mankind the freedom to choose how he wants to live his life while he resides here on earth, That is why he choose an elect family, because no one desired to seek him. He desires that his elect follow his commandments, but he does not desire anyone to be saved (delivered) eternally, he purposes their eternal salvation (deliverance) by his grace.
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Thanks for taking the time to answer. I'm familiar with your understanding. The question is can God desire something without acting upon it?
 
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memmett

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ForestGreenCook said:
I agree that God gives mankind the freedom to choose how he wants to live his life while he resides here on earth, That is why he choose an elect family, because no one desired to seek him. He desires that his elect follow his commandments, but he does not desire anyone to be saved (delivered) eternally, he purposes their eternal salvation (deliverance) by his grace.
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Calvinists believe God chooses to condescend to love some people but the default position is that He hates all people in general and only choses to change His feelings towards those He decides to make likeable.
 
oyster67

oyster67

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ForestGreenCook said:
he does not desire anyone to be saved (delivered) eternally, he purposes their eternal salvation (deliverance) by his grace.
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This gives us a pretty good snapshot of how your mind functions. Please take a break and think things through.
 
Mem

Mem

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Cameron143 said:
Thanks for taking the time to answer. I'm familiar with your understanding. The question is can God desire something without acting upon it?
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Didn't God act upon it though? He gave His Son so that the world might be saved? Isn't that something like throwing everyone a lifejacket and all anyone has to do is put it on, and even explaining to everyone that it must be put on. But because there are those that look at it like it's a foolish looking vest and believe he's crazy...
 
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ForestGreenCook

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Nehemiah6 said:
You would rather have God conform to your WARPED THEOLOGY than simply accept the truth. You are so brainwashed and indoctrinated that you would rather die defending lies than give them up for the truth. Extremely sad but an object lesson to all who are not committed to Gospel truth 100%.
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I apologise, I did not word my post correctly.

Because God has given them the freedom to choose how they want to live their lives, God does desire that his elect follow his commandments as he sojourns here on earth, But God purposes their eternal deliverance.
 
oyster67

oyster67

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Cameron143 said:
The question is can God desire something without acting upon it?
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He can certainly desire something without forcing His desire onto it.

2 Peter 3:9
“The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.”

Pretty clear here that God is not going to force anyone to repent. He is waiting for man to choose.
 
Cameron143

Cameron143

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Mem said:
Didn't God act upon it though? He gave His Son so that the world might be saved? Isn't that something like throwing everyone a lifejacket and all anyone has to do is put it on, and even explaining to everyone that it must be put on. But because there are those that look at it like it's a foolish looking vest and believe he's crazy...
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God loved the world and acted. Love does require action. Does desire?
 
Mem

Mem

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Cameron143 said:
God loved the world and acted. Love does require action. Does desire?
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Is unrequited love any less love? God said of Jerusalem, "how often have I desired to gather you like a hen gathers her chicks, but you would not..."
 
Cameron143

Cameron143

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Mem said:
Is unrequited love any less love? God said of Jerusalem, "how often have I desired to gather you like a hen gathers her chicks, but you would not..."
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The question isn't about love, but desire.
 
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