But Whom Say Ye That I am?

Walter · Feb 13, 2023

Monday 2-13-23 2nd. Day Of The Weekly Cycle Shevat 21, 5783 55th. Winter Day

We like to identify as what Jesus has said in:

John 4: 24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.

Jesus Himself understood the speculation about His identity. He asked His disciples, "Who do people say that I am?"

Peter gave the right answer: "You are the Christ, the Son of the living God" (Matthew 16:16). Jesus affirmed the truth of Peter’s answer and promised that, upon that truth, He would build His church (Matthew 16:18).

The true nature and identity of Jesus Christ has eternal significance. Every person must answer the question Jesus asked His disciples: "Who do you say that I am?"

He gave us the correct answer in many ways. In John 14:9-10, Jesus said, "Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, ‘Show us the Father’? Don’t you believe that I am in the Father, and that the Father is in me? The words I say to you I do not speak on my own authority. Rather, it is the Father, living in me, who is doing his work."

The Bible is clear about the divine nature of the Lord Jesus Christ (see John 1:1-14). Philippians 2:6-7 says that, although Jesus was "in very nature God, He did not consider equality with God something to be used to his own advantage; rather, he made himself nothing by taking the very nature of a servant, being made in human likeness." Colossians 2:9 says, “In Christ all the fullness of the Deity lives in bodily form.”

Jesus is fully God and fully man, and the fact of His incarnation is of utmost importance. He lived a human life but did not possess a sin nature as we do. He was tempted but never sinned (Hebrews 2:14-18; 4:15). Sin entered the world through Adam, and Adam’s sinful nature has been transferred to every baby born into the world (Romans 5:12)—except for Jesus. Because Jesus did not have a human father, He did not inherit a sin nature. He possessed the divine nature from His Heavenly Father.

God Was Manifest In The Flesh

Who Is Jesus?

Love, Walter and Deebbie

Locoponydirtman · Feb 14, 2023

You have to remember that John said Jesus was before him, and the the book of John says He was in the beginning and all things were made through him.

Walter · Feb 14, 2023

Locoponydirtman said:

Hello Locoponydirtman, Amen.

Love, Walter

Seeking-the-Truth · Feb 15, 2023

The Word of God. The only begotten Son of God. Fully man and fully divine. I think it is crucial that we understand who it is that we identify as “Jesus”. Unfortunately, there are differing views expressed throughout the various faiths and religious denominations throughout the world. Biblically, there is only One Savior, One true Messiah. Scriptures contain more than 300 prophecies regarding the Messiah.
Each of us needs to assure the one we embrace as the Messiah is He who has fulfilled the Messianic prophecies that have been fulfilled to date.

Nehemiah6 · Feb 15, 2023

Locoponydirtman said:

Correct. And that word "beginning" really means long before the earth was created. It means "eternity past". So the Only Begotten Son of God was with God eternally. Therefore His goings forth have been "from old, from everlasting".

But thou, Bethlehem Ephratah, though thou be little among the thousands of Judah, yet out of thee shall He come forth unto me that is to be ruler in Israel; whose goings forth have been from of old, from everlasting. (Micah 5:2)

awelight · Feb 15, 2023

Walter said:

Very nice post Walter.

I could not agree with you more - one must have the proper understanding of who our Lord is and you brought out two of the Great Truths about Jesus.

He is fully God and fully man - the God-Man and only John writes about Jesus as such in his inspired book. This is why John's account of the Lord's ministry on earth is so unique as compared to Matthew, Mark and Luke.

Secondly, that Jesus was not born with the sin nature. Scripture says He was born as: "that Holy thing". Adam was considered to be "upright" before the fall but Jesus was far more than "upright", He was perfectly Holy. Only a perfectly Holy Nature could be combined with a perfectly Holy Divine Nature. Therefore, any "testing" or "temptation" to sin, would never find any traction in Jesus' mind.

Thirdly, while Christ is said to have "emptied Himself" to become incarnate; this should never be understood as meaning the Second Person of the Godhead emptied Himself of His deity.

Thanks again. It was a nice read.

thomas64 · Feb 15, 2023

“But what about you?” he asked. “Who do you say I am?”
16 Simon Peter answered, “You are the Messiah, the Son of the living God.”
17 Jesus replied, “Blessed are you, Simon son of Jonah, for this was not revealed to you by flesh and blood, but by my Father in heaven.

An alternative conversation:

But what about you?” he asked. “Who do you say I am?”

16 Simon Peter answered, “You are the Messiah, the Son of the living God.”

Jesus shakes his head. ‘’No Peter, that is not enough to believe as to who I am. You must believe I am part of an equal trinity and have been for infinitum. The Father the Holy Spirit and I are all equally God. In the ontological sense of Trinity I am and always have been equal to God, but in the economic sense of Trinity I am subject to the Father.’’

Peter shakes his head and walks away, he doesn’t understand.

awelight · Feb 15, 2023

thomas64 said:

Do you always post items speaking for Jesus Christ? I hope not.

Ask yourself this - Did you know that Jesus Christ was the Messiah when you first came to know Him? The One that was the fulfillment of the Old Testament Prophecies? Probably not. Did you know that Jesus Christ and the Great I Am are one and the same? Probably not.

However, as one grows in Grace and Knowledge of the Truth, one should come to understand these things, just as Peter and the rest will. Once known, believers should use them to test what we believe about Christ and what others believe. Testing the spirits is commanded in Scripture and the test is not whether one knows these things but rather, whether one is receptive to these things or resistant.

thomas64 · Feb 15, 2023

awelight said:

The greatest power and most rapid growth of the church was seen before the emergence of the scholar and theologian who emerged after the passing of the Apostles. Evermore they searched the scriptures, looking for some new doctrine to instill in the church

Locoponydirtman · Feb 15, 2023

Nehemiah6 said:

I know its hard for a human to wrap our minds around this stuff. Its so far beyond our capacity amd our human language falls far too short.

thomas64 · Feb 15, 2023

Locoponydirtman said:

Don't worry, God gives us understanding of what he desires us to know

awelight · Feb 15, 2023

thomas64 said:

You are aware, right? That growth in any church is based solely on God. Scripture clearly teaches that God gives the increase. Therefore, Doctrine or the lack thereof will not necessarily effect this.

Doctrine is for the believers edification and not for the unbeliever.

The Apostles certainly believed in the importance of Doctrine. The Greek word for Doctrine is: διδαχή and it means either "Doctrine" or "Teachings". It appears in 44 verses in the KJV, so I think we can say it is important. This particular verse seems appropriate for our conversation about doctrinal growth:

Heb_6:1 Wherefore leaving the doctrine of the first principles of Christ, let us press on unto perfection; not laying again a foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God,

thomas64 · Feb 15, 2023

awelight said:

How about arguing/debating a pre trib rapture for instance, is that really for the edification of believers? Or how about fillique? Will delving into that edify believers? Or how about all can be saved as opposed to the elect? It seems to me some make a god out of head theology, and in many instances it would not aid their spiritual walk at all. I disagree that doctrine cannot affect the growth of the church. The power is in the truth.

awelight · Feb 15, 2023

thomas64 said:

If the subject is in the Scriptures, then God deemed it important.

You seem to be bucking up against "BAD" doctrine and not doctrine in general because you mentioned the Truth. You said the power is in the Truth but how can one know the Truth apart from sound doctrine. The Scriptures, which are true, become the basis of Sound Doctrine, if and only if, they are based on sound - discerned - understanding. Just as one cannot know the Truth from just one verse of Scripture or the views of another, truth must be discerned from many Scriptures and by the utilization of the "context" that the verses are found within and this, only, by a true believer and not someone trying to intellectually understand without spiritual guidance.

The Holy Spirit does not teach the Truth apart from the Scriptures and the ability to discern Scripture, is a gift of the Holy Spirit.

True Doctrinal teaching, is nothing more or less, than putting together many verses of Scripture, both from the OT and NT, to create a comprehensive lesson about a particular subject. Using only one or two verses of Scripture can get one into a lot of trouble.

thomas64 · Feb 15, 2023

awelight said:

How is delving into a pre trib rapture for instance important for your christian walk?
Yes, the scriptures which are true are the basis of sound doctrine. And I agree, do not build a doctrine on one verse of scripture. On the internet, context is often used to turn a scripture on its head, to say something completely different than it plainly states. The Holy Spirit teaches the truth from the scriptures, agreed. The scriptures also say:

Do not go beyond what is written.” 1Cor4:6
Why do you think then, the greatest power and most rapid growth in the christian church was seen before the emergence of the scholar and theologian after the Apostles had passed away. After all, they created doctrine after doctrine, based on their understanding of the scriptures.

Nehemiah6 · Feb 15, 2023

Locoponydirtman said:

That's absolutely right. But what scarcely get's noticed is that the scribes and the chief priests of Israel deliberately failed to quote the last half of Micah 5:2, because it would mean that God had taken human form as Jesus of Nazareth. Here is all that they quoted (inaccurately) to Herod: When Herod the king had heard these things, he was troubled, and all Jerusalem with him. And when he had gathered all the chief priests and scribes of the people together, he demanded of them where Christ should be born. And they said unto him, In Bethlehem of Judaea: for thus it is written by the prophet, And thou Bethlehem, in the land of Juda, art not the least among the princes of Juda: for out of thee shall come a Governor, that shall rule my people Israel.,,, (Mt 2:3-6) What's missing is this critical piece of information...whose goings forth have been from of old, from everlasting.

Herod was troubled because he would lose his throne. The chief priests and scribes were troubled because God would come to Israel as a Man and demand repentance.

awelight · Feb 16, 2023

thomas64 said:

Your stand on the usefulness of Doctrine is becoming a little more reasonable.

As to why delve into Eschatology and in particular something like the Pre-Trib Rapture? In a single word "Assurance".

If one believes that the "Great Tribulation" is still future, (Of which I do.), then there is great assurance in the knowledge that the church (Universal aspect) which Christ is building, will not go through this Tribulation period. When one reads of the judgements that are to befall those living on the earth, it is comforting to know, that believers of the church age will not have to endure them. This knowledge, puts additional joy into the believers life and thus, improves their walk.

As to your belief, that the church experienced a decline, after scholars came onto the scene. This belief, is flawed from the very beginning. 1) What makes you think it caused a decline? 2) Why do you think there were no scholars in the early church years?

1) There is no evidence, that suggests the churches did not grow as God intended for them to grow. On this, one should take to heart this verse of Scripture:

Acts 2:47 Praising God, and having favor with all the people. And the Lord added to the church daily such as should be saved.

2) Within Judaism, there were scholars, even at the time of Jesus' earthly ministry. Of which, Saul (later Paul), was one, by his own admission:

Php_3:5 circumcised the eighth day, of the stock of Israel, of the tribe of Benjamin, a Hebrew of Hebrews; as touching the law, a Pharisee;

Some of the early church fathers would have been considered scholars. Ignatius of Antioch and Polycarp of Smyrna, for example. Polycarp was taught directly by the Apostles and later, wrote many great letters to the early church.

Do not throw all scholars under the bus. There are good ones and bad ones. As believers, we must separate for ourselves, the good from the bad. I understand, in part, what you are saying. I too hate the scholars of higher education, who believe they may speak for Scripture but have no real knowledge of God in their personal life.

Blade · Feb 16, 2023

You know every time ..every time I hear read this "Whom do they say I am and Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God. Jesus answered and said to him, “Blessed are you, Simon Bar-Jonah, for flesh and blood has not revealed this to you, but My Father who is in heaven. "

I can picture it as all darkness and then this huge explosion of light. Like you see him...then the next second you see Him and bow and kneel...you are the Christ the Son of the living God". So holy Just want to stay in that moment forever.

Thank you Father for Walter sharing this.. but most of all thank you for sharing it with us by your sweet holy Spirit. As the song says "One Desire

arthurfleminger · Feb 16, 2023

Jesus Asked, “Who Do You Say That I Am?”

Jesus asked His Disciples an important question, “Who do men say that I Am?”

So, who is Jesus? Let’s take a look at His life and begin with a plain fact. Throughout all history, it would be hard to find anyone whose life has had a greater impact on the world than Jesus’.

A famous author, an atheist named, H.G. Wells said, “I am not a believer, but as an historian, I must confess that this penniless preacher from Nazareth is easily the most dominant person in all history.”

Jesus’ impact on the world is amazing when we recall that he lived 2,000 years ago in a small town. We know almost nothing about His first 30 years on earth. He never traveled far from home as an adult, never held political office, never wrote a book, never invented something, never discovered anything, never led an army into battle, and He never amassed great wealth.

The three short years of His public ministry were spent in small villages. He avoided publicity and commanded His followers not to tell anyone of the miracles that they saw Him perform. He never did any of the things that are considered to be historic.

Indeed, He is remembered by eyewitnesses for being rejected by his own people, that He died naked, penniless, shamed, virtually alone, and in great agony. He appeared to be a spectacular failure.

So how is it then that Jesus has become the most influential person in the history of the world? Christians see Him as their Savior, other religions regard Him as a holy man. Nations, Cultures, even people of no Christian faith have been deeply influenced by Jesus and His teachings.

So, what sets this man apart from the billions of others who have lived upon this earth? Jesus appears to be like some other religious figures, preaching love of neighbor and urging people to turn to God. But something separates Jesus from all the others.

Other religious leaders like Moses, Buddha, Mohammed, or Confucius had a message about God or about the right way of living. But the most they had to say about themselves was that they were prophets or wise teachers.

Unlike all these other religious figures Jesus made a far more radical claim. He claimed to be a more than a messenger from God, He claimed to be the actual Message, the Very Word of God. In short, His identity is the issue.

Jesus demanded the apostles make a decision and asked them, “Who do you say that I Am?”

Actually, the possible answers to this question are surprisingly limited.

Let’s look at some of the non-believer attempts to explain Jesus.

Many non-Christians see Jesus just as being a good man, a wise man, and a great teacher.

And yet, we miss the point entirely if we treat Jesus merely as a good and wise teacher, because Jesus made far greater claims. In fact, Jesus claimed, both directly and indirectly, to be God!

When Jesus claimed to forgive sins, He was making the claim that it was He was the One who was offended by men’s sins. He was criticized for forgiving sins, because only God can forgive sins. And his critics were right, Only God can forgive sins, and Jesus never disputed that.

Jesus claimed that before Abraham was, I Am. Understand what Jesus claimed here. Jesus claimed to be, “I Am”, and I Am is the Name by which God revealed Himself to Moses. Jesus is claiming to be the same eternal God who spoke to Moses from the burning bush. The religious leaders understood perfectly what He was saying and they picked up stones and attempted to kill Him for blasphemy. (John 8:58)

Jesus guided by word and example, forgiving, loving and caring for others. But far more than showing us the way, Jesus claimed that He is the Way, and the Truth, and the Life; and that no one can come to the Father but by Me.

When Jesus appeared to the Apostle Thomas, Thomas fell to the ground and worshiped Jesus praying to Him, My Lord and my God!” Being strict Jews, Jesus and the apostles worshiped only one God, but when Thomas fell down and worshiped Jesus as God, neither Jesus nor any of the other apostles corrected him. It is clear that none of Jesus disciples thought that Jesus was only a good and wise teacher.

Instead, Jesus accepted Thomas’ worship, acknowledging that He is the one God of Israel.

If Jesus’ claims of being God weren’t true, then He could not have been a wise man, a good man, or a great teacher. Instead He would have been an egomaniac, an evil and ignorant man who didn’t teach truth. But, if Jesus’ claims are true then He is certainly much more than a good and wise teacher.

Because Jesus taught that He is God and that we are not. He emphasized that He is from above and that we are from below, that we are sinners and that He is without sin, and that God is one. Jesus had a thoroughly Jewish concept of the God of Israel; and Jesus clearly stated a number of times, “I Am!”

One time atheist, who converted to Christianity, was the great Protestant thinker and writer, C.S. Lewis. He wrote, “Jesus claimed to be God, so there are only two possibilities, either He is God or He is not God.” There are no other possibilities.

He added, if Jesus is not God, then we are left with two options: He either knows that He is not God and is a liar, or he is a lunatic and mistakenly thinks that He is God.

If Jesus was a liar, His lies were about the most important things imaginable. For a man to lie about such claims to His friends and followers, He would have to been deeply evil.

Liars tell lies in the pursuit of some gain. So, if Jesus was a liar, for what purpose? What does Jesus gain as a result of His lies? Earthly power? No, when men try to crown Him, He runs away. Status? No, He only wins the admiration of unimportant people; prostitutes, tax collectors, fishermen, along with the undying hatred of powerful men bent on His destruction.

When He is on trial for His life, why would He lie when asked if He is the Christ, the Son of God? He didn’t hesitate. He answered, I AM, (Mark 14:62) thereby inviting crucifixion, the most horrific death known to man. No liar, bent on earthly gain would do this.

So, if Jesus is not God and not a liar, we are left with only one other alternative; He was mistakenly insane. The trouble with this thought is that there is nothing in Scripture to indicate that Jesus was insane. Study His interactions with His enemies or His warm conversations with His friends. No one ever thought that He was a deranged man, out of His wits.

So, if Jesus wasn’t a compulsive liar or insane, it begins to look as though there is difficulty in accounting for Jesus in any other way but the way that Peter did. When Jesus asked him, “Who do you say that I AM.” Peter answered, “You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.”

And Jesus asks the same question to all people, throughout time, He asks the same question of you and me, “Who do you say that, I Am?”

ONE FINAL THOUGHT

The Apostles were the people who knew Jesus best. And they believed His claims. They believed so much that they would go out into a world filled with wolves and spread Jesus’ Gospel. Except for John, all of them willingly gave up their lives in martyrdom for their Lord and God.

soberxp · Feb 16, 2023

The word is God, and the word became flesh.
Jesus is the living word of God.
I say that you are all gods, you are all children of God, but you are not the only one true God until you became as one in father and the word of father lives in you.

But Whom Say Ye That I am?

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