Can a Christian lose salvation?

[Runningman]

Ok. Looks like it's time for the Bi-Annual list of 101 Reasons proving Eternal Security. The "you can lose your salvation, and become unborn again crowd need to refute each and every one of these!

1. The believer has everlasting or eternal life.


John 5:24: “Verily, verily, I say unto you, he that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.”

What if one stops believing? They can still go be a devil, like Judas was toward the end, with their eternal life firmly in grasp?

Luke 18
28Peter said to him, “We have left all we had to follow you!”

29“Truly I tell you,” Jesus said to them, “no one who has left home or wife or brothers or sisters or parents or children for the sake of the kingdom of God 30will fail to receive many times as much in this age, and in the age to come eternal life.”

 

[PennEd]

Alright...who released the Kraken?

God's Word Did!

 

[HeIsHere]

What if one stops believing? They can still go be a devil, like Judas was toward the end, with their eternal life firmly in grasp?

Luke 18
28Peter said to him, “We have left all we had to follow you!”

29“Truly I tell you,” Jesus said to them, “no one who has left home or wife or brothers or sisters or parents or children for the sake of the kingdom of God 30will fail to receive many times as much in this age, and in the age to come eternal life.”

Stop believing what exactly?

 

[BreatheFocusBet]

"Partaker" means "one who takes part in." The meaning is very clear, as is the context.

Agreed. The writer makes it clear in v9-10 that it is because of their works (as it happens), God's faithfulness, plus their love in God's name that he is confident the examples in v4-8 won't apply to them (who believed and had a share of the Holy Spirit Himself, which the writer could have meant in v4) which is silly if they were safe regardless of their works and love.

If verses 4-6 are not clear, verses 7 and 8 seem to be analogous of verses 4-6 (a warning against receiving blessings yet becoming unfruitful). Even if not totally analogous, consider that the land in verse 7 doesn't seem to be in danger of being burned like in verse 8. Unbelievers are still in danger. So is the land in v7 symbolic of unbelievers then? If not, consider the meaning of the analogy overall.

 

[Runningman]

Stop believing what exactly?

I mean in reference to John 5:24
"he that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, "

 

[HeIsHere]

I mean in reference to John 5:24
"he that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, "

Not sure if we discussed this in the past, but the faith which saves is a moment in time event, do you agree with this biblical truth?

 

[Papermonkey]

How could they be saved as in "born again" when Jesus had not completed the plan of salvation?

Their sins had not yet been atoned for, correct?

Jesus taught no one is saved, comes to him, unless the father calls them.

If Jesus was God, as he said, then the apostles were saved when Jesus said, come follow me.

 

[BreatheFocusBet]

Agreed. The writer makes it clear in v9-10 that it is because of their works (as it happens), God's faithfulness, plus their love in God's name that he is confident the examples in v4-8 won't apply to them (who believed and had a share of the Holy Spirit Himself, which the writer could have meant in v4) which is silly if they were safe regardless of their works and love.

If verses 4-6 are not clear, verses 7 and 8 seem to be analogous of verses 4-6 (a warning against receiving blessings yet becoming unfruitful). Even if not totally analogous, consider that the land in verse 7 doesn't seem to be in danger of being burned like in verse 8. Unbelievers are still in danger. So is the land in v7 symbolic of unbelievers then? If not, consider the meaning of the analogy overall.

*for* God's name, not in His name, sorry.

 

[Stach]

Precious friend, A Very Warm Welcome To Chat.

IF 'one can lose salvation,' then please kindly explain how God "Nullifies
And Reverses" His 12-Dozen Plain And Clear Passages, Found Here:

God's OPERATION On all HIS New-born babes In Christ
+
God's Eternal Assurance
-------------------------------
Please Be Very RICHLY Encouraged And Edified In
The LORD JESUS CHRIST, And His Word Of Truth, Rightly
Divided (+ I and II).

Grace, Peace, And JOY!...

I believe we can walk away from God after being saved. God will allow you. He won’t leave you but you can leave him. Basically you changed your mind about being saved. Will that work to lose your salvation?

 

[Papermonkey]

I believe we can walk away from God after being saved. God will allow you. He won’t leave you but you can leave him. Basically you changed your mind about being saved. Will that work to lose your salvation?

Is there anything in the Bible that says it will? We are saved by God's choice of us. His grace, bestows faith in his words when the natural mind otherwise cannot understand the things of God.

 

[ResidentAlien]

"Then you will say, 'Branches were broken off so that I might be grafted in.' That is true. They were broken off because of their unbelief, but you stand fast through faith. So do not become proud, but fear. For if God did not spare the natural branches, neither will he spare you. Note then the kindness and the severity of God: severity toward those who have fallen, but God’s kindness to you, provided you continue in his kindness. Otherwise you too will be cut off." Romans 11:19-22

Anyone who says God would never cut anyone off should read and pay attention. Israel was God's chosen people but He didn't spare them when they rebelled. Could He have? Of course, but He didn't. And a believer in Christ may be cut off too. That's no me saying it but the scripture that's right in front of you.

 

[Stach]

Is there anything in the Bible that says it will? We are saved by God's choice of us. His grace, bestows faith in his words when the natural mind otherwise cannot understand the things of God.

Thank you for correcting me trust me, I really appreciate that. What I should’ve said is God save you one time when you ask there’s no need to ask him over and over again to be saved. You just need to repent! I am sorry I left out the repentance the first time that’s on me.

 

[Runningman]

Not sure if we discussed this in the past, but the faith which saves is a moment in time event, do you agree with this biblical truth?

I believe Jesus was referring to a future event in context of John 5:24

24“Very truly I tell you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life and will not be judged but has crossed over from death to life. 25Very truly I tell you, a time is coming and has now come when the dead will hear the voice of the Son of God and those who hear will live. 26For as the Father has life in himself, so he has granted the Son also to have life in himself. 27And he has given him authority to judge because he is the Son of Man.

28“Do not be amazed at this, for a time is coming when all who are in their graves will hear his voice 29and come out—those who have done what is good will rise to live, and those who have done what is evil will rise to be condemned.

 

[Evmur]

I'm not sure what they are saying either. All those that are currently saved are the Church Bride. Those that are not ready (not saved) at the time of the Rapture will not be the in the Church Bride, but they will still have another chance to come to Jesus if they do not take the Mark of the Beast during the 7-year Tribulation. Many of these will be Jews. That is why the 7-year Tribulation is sometimes called "The Time of Jacob's Trouble."

I BELIEVE [more as I get older] in what is called The Wider Mercy, the church is indeed the Bride, but others can be saved. it is the Bride who says "let him who thirsts come and drink of the water of life" in Revs.

As Lafter says the maidens, whether wise or foolish are not the Bride ... when the Bridegroom comes she comes with Him.

Just think, the last judgement that determines final destinies, in Matt. or Revs. comes on the last day, after the 1, 000 years.

We have been reigning with Christ for a 1, 000 years, the Jews have been reigning on earth. There is NO WAY that we are going to be judged on that day. We have says John passed from judgement to life. Paul says God will bring us with Him when He comes to judge.

Therefore ....

We can't be the sheep on His right hand. Down the ages since the Church Fathers [so called] the sheep have been represented as the church and the goats as everybody else.

I say, even I, this is wrong.

Many, too many to count will be saved.

 

[GRACE_ambassador]

I believe we can walk away from God after being saved. God will allow you. He won’t leave you but you can leave him. Basically you changed your mind about being saved. Will that work to lose your salvation?

"What Saith The Scripture?" is the only Determination to find what will "work to
lose salvation":

1) Christ's Precious BLOOD Shed On Calvary Is ALL-Sufficient to Forgive ALL sin.

2) True believers (with ALL sin Forgiven) now:

a) Have A "New Owner" - 1Co 6:19:

"What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost ​

Which Is In you, Which ye have Of God, and ye are not your own?"​

b) Are Purchased By God Himself:

Eph 1:14:

"Which is the earnest of our inheritance until the Redemption ​

of the Purchased Possession, unto the Praise of His Glory."​

​

Act 20:28:

"Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over​

the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the​

church of God, Which He Hath Purchased With HIS OWN BLOOD."​

----------------------------------------
Thus, those who "are saved on man's terms," of course, can 'walk away,'
on man's terms, But:

those of us with God's Relationship, Established By HIS OPERATION,"
Eternally Saved On God's Terms," cannot lose ETERNAL Life, But:

Certainly Can 'be OUT of Fellowship' With Him, and
"lose rewards" At Judgment, Correct?:

1Co 3:15

"If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss:​

but he himself SHALL BE Saved; yet so as by fire."​

​

So, ONE last Scriptural question?:

1Co 3:16

"Know ye not that ye are the temple of God,​

and that the Spirit of God Dwelleth in you?"​

​

Thus, if Unsure, the please "re-examine yourself" - 2Cor 13:5

​

"Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove​

your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that​

Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates?"​

-----------------------------
('Examination link' =) Grace, Peace, And JOY

In Christ, And In His Word Of Truth, Rightly
Divided (+ I and II)!

 

[GRACE_ambassador]

I BELIEVE [more as I get older] in what is called The Wider Mercy

Seems to me hyper/ultra/WIDER Mercy would Definitely fit in with:

hyper/ultra/WIDER Grace and:

hyper/ultra/WIDER dispensationalism, eh?

 

[oyster67]

I BELIEVE [more as I get older] in what is called The Wider Mercy, the church is indeed the Bride, but others can be saved. it is the Bride who says "let him who thirsts come and drink of the water of life" in Revs.

As Lafter says the maidens, whether wise or foolish are not the Bride ... when the Bridegroom comes she comes with Him.

Just think, the last judgement that determines final destinies, in Matt. or Revs. comes on the last day, after the 1, 000 years.

We have been reigning with Christ for a 1, 000 years, the Jews have been reigning on earth. There is NO WAY that we are going to be judged on that day. We have says John passed from judgement to life. Paul says God will bring us with Him when He comes to judge.

Therefore ....

We can't be the sheep on His right hand. Down the ages since the Church Fathers [so called] the sheep have been represented as the church and the goats as everybody else.

I say, even I, this is wrong.

Many, too many to count will be saved.

The Gospel is very clear and there is no wiggle room for new theories.
John 14:6
“Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.”

 

[HeIsHere]

Jesus taught no one is saved, comes to him, unless the father calls them.

If Jesus was God, as he said, then the apostles were saved when Jesus said, come follow me.

Jesus is speaking about election to service not spiritual salvation. Unconditional election for spiritual salvation is not biblical.

We still have no evidence that spiritual salvation occurred before Jesus actually atoned for sin.

 

[HeIsHere]

I believe Jesus was referring to a future event in context of John 5:24

24“Very truly I tell you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life and will not be judged but has crossed over from death to life. 25Very truly I tell you, a time is coming and has now come when the dead will hear the voice of the Son of God and those who hear will live. 26For as the Father has life in himself, so he has granted the Son also to have life in himself. 27And he has given him authority to judge because he is the Son of Man.

28“Do not be amazed at this, for a time is coming when all who are in their graves will hear his voice 29and come out—those who have done what is good will rise to live, and those who have done what is evil will rise to be condemned.

I am asking about the nature of individual spiritual salvation here on earth, not the raising of the dead, or do you believe they are the same?

 

[Runningman]

I am asking about the nature of individual spiritual salvation here on earth, not the raising of the dead, or do you believe they are the same?

Jesus was talking about the raising of the dead in John 5. That’s when he said eternal life comes, a future thing.

Luke 20
34Jesus replied, “The people of this age marry and are given in marriage. 35But those who are considered worthy of taking part in the age to come and in the resurrection from the dead will neither marry nor be given in marriage, 36and they can no longer die; for they are like the angels. They are God’s children, since they are children of the resurrection.

So as to whether or not there is immortality right now, I don’t think so. Consider what Paul said too:


1 Corinthians 15
52in a flash, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed. 53For the perishable must clothe itself with the imperishable, and the mortal with immortality. 54When the perishable has been clothed with the imperishable, and the mortal with immortality, then the saying that is written will come true: “Death has been swallowed up in victory.”

So a question of reflection:

Have you been raised imperishable and clothed with immortality at the last trumpet? Wouldn’t it follow that before the last trumpet one is perishable and mortal?