Does God desire the salvation of all mankind?

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
26,074
13,778
113
#1
There are many who claim that God does not desire the salvation of all human beings. But that is simply a lie of the devil. This one verse from Isaiah 45:22 refutes that idea: Look unto me, and be ye saved, all the ends of the earth: for I am God, and there is none else. This is confirmed below in John 3:16,17.

"All the ends of the earth" encompasses the whole world of humanity. Therefore if God were electing people for salvation, He would elect everyone and save everyone. But that is not how God offers salvation to mankind. Instead God wants that the Gospel be preached in all the world and to "every creature". And when the Gospel is preached, those hearing the Gospel must also hear that (1) God now commands all men everywhere to repent and (2) God now commands all men everywhere to believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and be saved. It is through repentance toward God and faith toward our Lord Jesus Christ that sinners are saved from Hell (Acts 20:21).

At the same time God and Christ know that all men will not be saved, because many love darkness rather than light. So what we are seeing today is that evil is triumphing over good, and evil is increasing day by day, while that which is righteous is attacked, rejected and reviled.

Nonetheless, the true Gospel must continue to be propagated, and what it says is this (John 3:1-21;29-36 ). These are the words of Christ Himself as well as His forerunner John the Baptist. So these are the words of God.

1 There was a man of the Pharisees, named Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews:
2 The same came to Jesus by night, and said unto him, Rabbi, we know that thou art a teacher come from God: for no man can do these miracles that thou doest, except God be with him.
3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.
4 Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter the second time into his mother's womb, and be born?
5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.
8 The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.
9 Nicodemus answered and said unto him, How can these things be?
10 Jesus answered and said unto him, Art thou a master of Israel, and knowest not these things?
11 Verily, verily, I say unto thee, We speak that we do know, and testify that we have seen; and ye receive not our witness.
12 If I have told you earthly things, and ye believe not, how shall ye believe, if I tell you of heavenly things?
13 And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.
14 And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up:
15 That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.
16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
19 And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.
20 For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved.
21 But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God...
29 He that hath the bride is the bridegroom: but the friend of the bridegroom, which standeth and heareth him, rejoiceth greatly because of the bridegroom's voice: this my joy therefore is fulfilled.
30 He must increase, but I must decrease.
31 He that cometh from above is above all: he that is of the earth is earthly, and speaketh of the earth: he that cometh from heaven is above all.
32 And what he hath seen and heard, that he testifieth; and no man receiveth his testimony.
33 He that hath received his testimony hath set to his seal that God is true.
34 For he whom God hath sent speaketh the words of God: for God giveth not the Spirit by measure unto him.
35 The Father loveth the Son, and hath given all things into his hand.
36 He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.
 
Nov 26, 2021
1,125
545
113
India
#2
1 Tim 2:1-4 also does not agree with Limited Atonement and related ideas.

1 Tim 2:1-4: God will have all men to be saved, and to come to the knowledge of the Truth:

"Call to Prayer
1I exhort therefore, that, first of all, supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks, be made for all men; 2For kings, and for all that are in authority; that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and honesty. 3For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour; 4Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
 
Mar 4, 2020
8,614
3,691
113
#4
God wills all to be saved. All will not be saved. Either people chose to place their faith in the correct thing, in accordance with their free will, or they don't chose that. If not, then God selects who is saved and who isn't my imparting them with prerequisite faith or not imparting them with prerequisite faith.

The only options are people choose to have faith or not, all are saved, or there is an elect for salvation.

In my view, people must chose to have faith and keep their faith until the end; that's Biblical.
 

studentoftheword

Well-known member
Nov 12, 2021
1,747
609
113
#5
All Sin for all people is dealt with ---so all can be saved -----how------ they need to do as the Word Who Is Jesus tells them to do -----which He gives clear instructions in His Word on How to be Saved -----

Romans 10:9 tells Us how to be Saved -----very clearly laid out in plain language ----we either choose to do as Jesus says or we reject to do as Jesus says ----all up to us -----

Romans 10:9

Berean Literal Bible
that if you confess with your mouth, "Jesus is Lord," and believe in your heart that God raised Him out from the dead, you will be saved.

Amplified Bible says this

Amplified Bible
because if you acknowledge and confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord [recognizing His power, authority, and majesty as God], and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved.

I say ------No one today goes to Hell for their sins ------Jesus took care of that ----the person today Chooses to go to Hell by rejecting the free offer brought about by Jesus Christ through the Shedding of His Blood to cover all Sin for all time for all people ----


The only options are people choose to have faith or not, all are saved, or there is an elect for salvation.

In my view, people must chose to have faith and keep their faith until the end; that's Biblical.
I say -----I think people are very confused about Faith -------we cannot choose to have Faith ----All Faith is given by God Not us ------it is not Faith that we can personally choose ------

It is not our Faith ------it is God's faith and only He can open our heart to the Right Faith to be saved ----God's Faith that He inparts to us by and through the Word has to be in Jesus Christ -------

This Scripture lays out who's faith it is ------

Galatians 3 Amp

22 But the Scripture has imprisoned [a]everyone [everything—the entire world] under sin, so that [the inheritance, the blessing of salvation] which was promised through faith in Jesus Christ might be given to those who believe [in Him and acknowledge Him as God’s precious Son].


Galatians 3:22

Amplified Bible, Classic Edition



22 But the Scriptures [picture all mankind as sinners] shut up and imprisoned by sin, so that [the inheritance, blessing] which was promised through faith in Jesus Christ (the Messiah) might be given (released, delivered, and committed) to [all] those who believe [who adhere to and trust in and rely on Him].
Read full chapter

i say
So you see here that it is not just saying that you believe ---Belief here is much deeper than just saying you believe -----you are to Adhear to ---and Trust in and Rely on Him --------so Your Faith is IN JESUS and when you mature your faith IN Jesus Grows -------
 

ForestGreenCook

Well-known member
Jul 8, 2018
8,441
1,213
113
#6
There are many who claim that God does not desire the salvation of all human beings. But that is simply a lie of the devil. This one verse from Isaiah 45:22 refutes that idea: Look unto me, and be ye saved, all the ends of the earth: for I am God, and there is none else. This is confirmed below in John 3:16,17.

"All the ends of the earth" encompasses the whole world of humanity. Therefore if God were electing people for salvation, He would elect everyone and save everyone. But that is not how God offers salvation to mankind. Instead God wants that the Gospel be preached in all the world and to "every creature". And when the Gospel is preached, those hearing the Gospel must also hear that (1) God now commands all men everywhere to repent and (2) God now commands all men everywhere to believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and be saved. It is through repentance toward God and faith toward our Lord Jesus Christ that sinners are saved from Hell (Acts 20:21).

At the same time God and Christ know that all men will not be saved, because many love darkness rather than light. So what we are seeing today is that evil is triumphing over good, and evil is increasing day by day, while that which is righteous is attacked, rejected and reviled.

Nonetheless, the true Gospel must continue to be propagated, and what it says is this (John 3:1-21;29-36 ). These are the words of Christ Himself as well as His forerunner John the Baptist. So these are the words of God.

1 There was a man of the Pharisees, named Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews:
2 The same came to Jesus by night, and said unto him, Rabbi, we know that thou art a teacher come from God: for no man can do these miracles that thou doest, except God be with him.
3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.
4 Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter the second time into his mother's womb, and be born?
5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.
8 The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.
9 Nicodemus answered and said unto him, How can these things be?
10 Jesus answered and said unto him, Art thou a master of Israel, and knowest not these things?
11 Verily, verily, I say unto thee, We speak that we do know, and testify that we have seen; and ye receive not our witness.
12 If I have told you earthly things, and ye believe not, how shall ye believe, if I tell you of heavenly things?
13 And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.
14 And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up:
15 That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.
16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
19 And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.
20 For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved.
21 But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God...
29 He that hath the bride is the bridegroom: but the friend of the bridegroom, which standeth and heareth him, rejoiceth greatly because of the bridegroom's voice: this my joy therefore is fulfilled.
30 He must increase, but I must decrease.
31 He that cometh from above is above all: he that is of the earth is earthly, and speaketh of the earth: he that cometh from heaven is above all.
32 And what he hath seen and heard, that he testifieth; and no man receiveth his testimony.
33 He that hath received his testimony hath set to his seal that God is true.
34 For he whom God hath sent speaketh the words of God: for God giveth not the Spirit by measure unto him.
35 The Father loveth the Son, and hath given all things into his hand.
36 He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.
Your eternal salvation by good works theory has too many contradictions with scriptures to be the doctrine that Jesus taught.


You claim that Jesus died for the remission of sins for all mankind, which is a contradiction to John 6:37, which says that he only died for those that God gave to him, furthermore, Jesus's sacrifice was to God, for God's acceptance, and not to mankind, for mankind's acceptance.

Jesus death on the cross was successful in redeeming the sins of those that he died for, and promised every one of them an eternal inheritance.

It does not matter who accepts Jesus work on the cross, or who does not , because his work of redemption was effective regardless of who accepts it or not.

The house of Israel (who is Jacob) encompasses all of God's elect, who are from every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation. When the house of Israel turned away from God and started worshiping idols, God blinded their eyes that they could not see the truth of Jesus doctrine (this includes the eternal salvation by works theory, such as yourself). They lost their fellowship with God, temporary, until they repent, but they did not lose their eternal inheritance.

Thankfully, God left in the midst of the house of Israel, a remnant of them that shall trust in the name of the Lord, and shall not do iniquity, nor speak lies, neither shall a deceitful tongue be found in their mouth (Zeph 3:11-13).
 

Snacks

Well-known member
Feb 10, 2022
1,410
771
113
#7
Your eternal salvation by good works theory has too many contradictions with scriptures to be the doctrine that Jesus taught.


You claim that Jesus died for the remission of sins for all mankind, which is a contradiction to John 6:37, which says that he only died for those that God gave to him, furthermore, Jesus's sacrifice was to God, for God's acceptance, and not to mankind, for mankind's acceptance.

Jesus death on the cross was successful in redeeming the sins of those that he died for, and promised every one of them an eternal inheritance.

It does not matter who accepts Jesus work on the cross, or who does not , because his work of redemption was effective regardless of who accepts it or not.

The house of Israel (who is Jacob) encompasses all of God's elect, who are from every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation. When the house of Israel turned away from God and started worshiping idols, God blinded their eyes that they could not see the truth of Jesus doctrine (this includes the eternal salvation by works theory, such as yourself). They lost their fellowship with God, temporary, until they repent, but they did not lose their eternal inheritance.

Thankfully, God left in the midst of the house of Israel, a remnant of them that shall trust in the name of the Lord, and shall not do iniquity, nor speak lies, neither shall a deceitful tongue be found in their mouth (Zeph 3:11-13).
Are you saying that having faith is a work?
 

Cameron143

Well-known member
Mar 1, 2022
20,075
6,882
113
62
#8
Are you saying that having faith is a work?
Before anyone asks this question they should be required to provide popcorn to anyone following the thread.
PS...I like the cheddar flavor.
 
Nov 26, 2021
1,125
545
113
India
#9
Another verse that rejects Limited Atonement and shows Christ really died for all, and God wants all of us to be saved.

2 Pet 3:9: God does not want anyone to perish, but everyone to come to repentance:

"The Lord is not slow in keeping his promise, as some understand slowness. Instead he is patient with you, not wanting anyone to perish, but everyone to come to repentance.

That God would create someone for eternal damnation is a horrible doctrine. Just imagine if you were that one person who allegedly was created for damnation. Would you not hate a God who supposedly created you just to damn you? Sorry, that has more in common with the Allah of the Quran, than the Loving God, Our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, of the Holy Bible.

God Loves all, died for all, and gives everyone the opportunity to believe in Him and be saved. Those alone will go to hell who persist in rejecting His Grace until death - not that He refused to have them in Heaven, but that they refused His Love.

God Bless.
 

Cameron143

Well-known member
Mar 1, 2022
20,075
6,882
113
62
#11
FYI...did you know that Jesus often used the one word answer "Yes" when conversing with the disciples. But like any good teacher, He instructed the disciples to write using complete sentences. Had He foregone such instruction, the shortest verse in the Bible would be "Yes". And that is why "Jesus wept " ended up being the shortest verse in the Bible.
Little known fact.
 

Snacks

Well-known member
Feb 10, 2022
1,410
771
113
#12
FYI...did you know that Jesus often used the one word answer "Yes" when conversing with the disciples. But like any good teacher, He instructed the disciples to write using complete sentences. Had He foregone such instruction, the shortest verse in the Bible would be "Yes". And that is why "Jesus wept " ended up being the shortest verse in the Bible.
Little known fact.
Are you saying I’m Christ-like? 😉
 

arthurfleminger

Well-known member
Aug 18, 2021
1,405
780
113
#13
It is God's Will that ALL be saved. However, we have a free will to accept or reject the salvation which Jesus freely offers us.

Notice that, in the Parable of the Prodical Son, the Father never forced the son to stay, never pleaded with him to stay, and let him exercise his free will to reject the Father for the things of the world.

Jesus did not want Judas to betray Him and then go out and hang himself.

God respects our free will. Free will is a gift given to us when God made us in His Own Image. And God forces us to do nothing, we are free to do as we choose, for God or against God.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
61,137
30,281
113
#14
You claim that Jesus died for the remission of sins for all mankind, which is a contradiction to John 6:37, which says that he only died for those that God gave to him, furthermore, Jesus's sacrifice was to God, for God's acceptance, and not to mankind, for mankind's acceptance.
Why do you claim Scriptures says something it does not? John 6:37 ~

New International Version
All those the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me I will never drive away.


New Living Translation
However, those the Father has given me will come to me, and I will never reject them.


English Standard Version
All that the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me I will never cast out.


Berean Standard Bible
Everyone the Father gives Me will come to Me, and the one who comes to Me I will never drive away.


Berean Literal Bible
All that the Father gives Me will come to Me, and the one coming to Me, I shall not cast out.


King James Bible
All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.


New King James Version
All that the Father gives Me will come to Me, and the one who comes to Me I will by no means cast out.
 
Jun 20, 2022
6,460
1,330
113
#15
Are you saying that having faith is a work?
Great Question since we know God Himself gave to us each a measure of Faith.

So using something that has been gifted can never be seen as a WORKS unless it doesn't fit into the narrative of a False Doctrine.
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
26,074
13,778
113
#16
Your eternal salvation by good works theory has too many contradictions with scriptures to be the doctrine that Jesus taught.
The words of Christ Himself were posted from the Gospel of John. But you are calling them "eternal salvation by good works". Which means that you have made God a liar.
 

Snacks

Well-known member
Feb 10, 2022
1,410
771
113
#18
Great Question since we know God Himself gave to us each a measure of Faith.

So using something that has been gifted can never be seen as a WORKS unless it doesn't fit into the narrative of a False Doctrine.
Well said, brother. 🙏
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
61,137
30,281
113
#20
Jesus did not want Judas to betray Him and then go out and hang himself.
What gives you that idea???

When Judas had taken the morsel, Satan entered into him. Then Jesus said to Judas, “What you are about to do, do quickly.”

Jesus submitted to the will of God, not His desire to escape what He faced, which was the reason for His incarnation.


“Father, if You are willing, take this cup from Me. Yet not My will, but Yours be done.”

Then an angel from heaven appeared to Him and strengthened Him.…