What Happens if Someone Who Claims to be “Born Again”

[Runningman]

It's hard to convince people nowadays there's such a thing as true doctrine and false doctrine. But there's always been truth and falsehood. No one knows 100% of the truth, but there are gross errors that should be obvious to anyone. Peter gives one example in 2 Peter 2:1, "even denying the Lord who bought them." The teaching of transubstantiation is another; it's closely related to Peter's definition. It's a bit ironic that Catholics teach the very thing Peter warned about.

That's crystal clear. There aren't many clearly defined examples of heresy.

Maybe this one too?

2 Corinthians 11:4
4For if someone comes and proclaims a Jesus other than the One we proclaimed, or if you receive a different spirit than the One you received, or a different gospel than the one you accepted, you put up with it way too easily.

 

[RaceRunner]

God’s grace is sufficient.

God’s grace is sufficient; the Heretic is not sufficient.

 

[Komentaja]

Insufficient information.

EVERYBODY'S a "heretic" according to somebody else's "theology".

Very well said mr Carabbio. I have said this for the longest, I have family members who know I have studied theology and the Bible a lot and they always ask me "Is _such and such_ a heresy?" and I often times say: "It depends on who you ask"

If we are to go by the creeds, I am definitely a heretic as the only creed I would feel comfortable reciting is the Apostles' creed. Nicene? No way.

In my opinion what makes someone a heretic is being wrong in something pertaining to eternal life, so things like the phony rapture theory have no bearing on salvation.

 

[RaceRunner]

God’s grace is sufficient.

According to God, a Heretic is not justified.

 

[ResidentAlien]

Very well said mr Carabbio. I have said this for the longest, I have family members who know I have studied theology and the Bible a lot and they always ask me "Is _such and such_ a heresy?" and I often times say: "It depends on who you ask"

If we are to go by the creeds, I am definitely a heretic as the only creed I would feel comfortable reciting is the Apostles' creed. Nicene? No way.

In my opinion what makes someone a heretic is being wrong in something pertaining to eternal life, so things like the phony rapture theory have no bearing on salvation.

This is a convoluted way of saying there's no such thing as a heresy or heretics.

 

[Komentaja]

This is a convoluted way of saying there's no such thing as a heresy or heretics.

There is. As I said in the second part of my post: "In my opinion what makes someone a heretic is being wrong in something pertaining to eternal life"

 

[ResidentAlien]

There is. As I said in the second part of my post: "In my opinion what makes someone a heretic is being wrong in something pertaining to eternal life"

I'm sorry. I misunderstood what you said.

 

[JohnDB]

Faith is essentially synonomous with believing by the way people are using the terms.

And according to James, even Satan believes.

But simple belief that causes actions stemming from attitude changes which ultimately cause actions which rule over your entire life is saving faith.

However....
Cognitive Dissonance plays a role in this.
Some people are not capable of much love or demonstrating loving-kindness or even extending grace in a broad manner. If they don't know what these things look like because they haven't been modeled before by someone then they simply don't understand how to do these things.

God grades us on an "effort curve" scale.
"To whom much is given much is required" is the scale used.

 

[PennEd]

The doctrine people believe that a person can enter into heaven as a Heretic if God deems them to be a Heretic, this is a false doctrine.

So I can become a born again child of God, love the Lord with all my heart, mind, strength and soul, and people as myself, but deem that someone who believes differently on certain issues may still be saved, then I’M also a doomed heretic!?

 

[Jesusfollower]

Can this person who is a "Heretic" according to God just simply believe in Jesus?

No

 

[Jesusfollower]

Can this person who is a "Heretic" according to God just simply believe in Jesus?

No

 

[ResidentAlien]

The pretrib rapture theory can rise to the level of heresy if taken to the point of twisting scripture to make it work. 2 Thessalonians 2:3 is a case in point:

"Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the falling away comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition,"

The Greek translated "falling away" is ἀποστασία (apostasia); that is, apostasy. Since it can also mean "departure," as in departing from the faith, some erroneously claim it means departing as in the rapture. In other words, the rapture has to come first before the man of sin can be revealed. This usually goes hand-in-hand with the teaching that the "restrainer" (2 Thessalonians 2:7) is the Holy Spirit which will be also depart the earth at the rapture.

The whole thing is build on a shaky foundation of false interpretation. Apostasia never means a departure in space; that is, from one place to another. It is always a departure from one state to another, as in a departure from the faith.

 

[Komentaja]

The pretrib rapture theory can rise to the level of heresy if taken to the point of twisting scripture to make it work. 2 Thessalonians 2:3 is a case in point:

"Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the falling away comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition,"

The Greek translated "falling away" is ἀποστασία (apostasia); that is, apostasy. Since it can also mean "departure," as in departing from the faith, some erroneously claim it means departing as in the rapture. In other words, the rapture has to come first before the man of sin can be revealed. This usually goes hand-in-hand with the teaching that the "restrainer" (2 Thessalonians 2:7) is the Holy Spirit which will be also depart the earth at the rapture.

The whole thing is build on a shaky foundation of false interpretation. Apostasia never means a departure in space; that is, from one place to another. It is always a departure from one state to another, as in a departure from the faith.

Very true, and sometimes that belief can become cultic as we have seen. There is so much talk about rapture but no talk about the second coming.

I personally believe this pre-trib theory was invented so that people will be deceived to following the beast system as they think "Well, it can't be now, this can't be it because look we are still here, the rapture hasn't happened yet"

 

[RaceRunner]

So I can become a born again child of God, love the Lord with all my heart, mind, strength and soul, and people as myself, but deem that someone who believes differently on certain issues may still be saved, then I’M also a doomed heretic!?

God deems a person believing in or practicing heresy to be a "Heretic".

 

[Magenta]

The person I am referring to who claims to be "Born Again" and is actually a "Heretic", this is something God considers heresy.

You are not defining what God considers heresy, which is what I am asking for.

Without that, your questions are meaningless.

The person I am referring to who claims to be "Born Again" and is actually a "Heretic", this is something God considers heresy.

Define heresy according to God.

 

[Snacks]

God’s grace is sufficient; the Heretic is not sufficient.

You have much to learn. Remember this, like you, my theology is not perfect, hence we are both heretics. The difference between you and me is, I rely solely on God’s grace while you don’t. I reiterate, you have much to learn.

 

[RaceRunner]

You are not defining what God considers heresy, which is what I am asking for.

Without that, your questions are meaningless.

Define heresy according to God.

I already said, "God deems a person believing in or practicing heresy to be a "Heretic"."

 

[Runningman]

The pretrib rapture theory can rise to the level of heresy if taken to the point of twisting scripture to make it work. 2 Thessalonians 2:3 is a case in point:

"Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the falling away comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition,"

The Greek translated "falling away" is ἀποστασία (apostasia); that is, apostasy. Since it can also mean "departure," as in departing from the faith, some erroneously claim it means departing as in the rapture. In other words, the rapture has to come first before the man of sin can be revealed. This usually goes hand-in-hand with the teaching that the "restrainer" (2 Thessalonians 2:7) is the Holy Spirit which will be also depart the earth at the rapture.

The whole thing is build on a shaky foundation of false interpretation. Apostasia never means a departure in space; that is, from one place to another. It is always a departure from one state to another, as in a departure from the faith.

Another good example.

So heresy can also be changing words to mean something completely different. While Greek words may have multiple meanings, some simply don't have multiple meanings, such as is the case with ἀποστασία (apostasia.)That shaky foundation can create a domino effect leading to many false conclusions that ultimately place someone far away from the truth.

 

[RaceRunner]

You have much to learn. Remember this, like you, my theology is not perfect, hence we are both heretics. The difference between you and me is, I rely solely on God’s grace while you don’t. I reiterate, you have much to learn.

The person I am referring to who claims to be "Born Again" but, is actually a Heretic is refusing God's grace.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

Heresy just means something contrary to the Bible. The thing is that there are many Biblically viable doctrines that aren’t necessarily true. Part of the reason for vastly different Biblical interpretation is not only because the Bible says many different things, but rather because we speculate as to why those things are said.

Some common examples are whether or not water baptism is required and why, pre/post-trib rapture, the Trinity, and many many more. Heresy can be difficult to define in my opinion.

Like someone said, from someone’s perspective everyone is a heretic.

yeah it’s almost like we don’t all understand everything the same at the same time