Jesus' sparing the adulteress
- Thread starter AndrewMorgan
- Start date
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
They cant flee before getting caught.
They can only be presented when they are caught in the act.
The Pharisees said "this woman was caught" not "we caught or carched this woman"
The Greek used for caught is the aorist indicatve tense of the word catch.
Therefore it would seem that they are only relating the fact that she had been caught in adultery.
They can only be presented when they are caught in the act.
The Pharisees said "this woman was caught" not "we caught or carched this woman"
The Greek used for caught is the aorist indicatve tense of the word catch.
Therefore it would seem that they are only relating the fact that she had been caught in adultery.
Hypocrisy behind the Trap (8:3-6a)
It is clear that this was a "set-up." However, there were some serious legal problems with the Jews' test case:
1. Caught in the act. The accusers were clear that the woman had been caught in the actual act of adultery.[75] This isn't easy to do. Just finding a man and woman in the same room might not be enough. Careful planning must have been done to entrap the couple -- and to entrap Jesus. This wasn't an innocent inquiry to a rabbi concerning how to apply the Law of Moses.
2. Only the woman was brought. Where was the man? The Law specifically states:
"If a man commits adultery with another man's wife -- with the wife of his neighbor -- both the adulterer and the adulteress must be put to death." (Leviticus 20:10)
There was something fishy about the charge here.
3. Stoning wasn't specified for all cases of adultery. The Law of Moses doesn't specify stoning for all cases of adultery (though it might be implied), but only in the case when a betrothed virgin was caught in adultery, in which case both parties would be stoned (Deuteronomy 22:23-24).
4. Death for adultery was seldom carried out. In fact, the most common punishment for adultery in Jewish society in Jesus' day was not death, but divorce and financial compensation for the husband from the adulterer himself.[76]
Not my words (Jesus walk.com)
It is clear that this was a "set-up." However, there were some serious legal problems with the Jews' test case:
1. Caught in the act. The accusers were clear that the woman had been caught in the actual act of adultery.[75] This isn't easy to do. Just finding a man and woman in the same room might not be enough. Careful planning must have been done to entrap the couple -- and to entrap Jesus. This wasn't an innocent inquiry to a rabbi concerning how to apply the Law of Moses.
2. Only the woman was brought. Where was the man? The Law specifically states:
"If a man commits adultery with another man's wife -- with the wife of his neighbor -- both the adulterer and the adulteress must be put to death." (Leviticus 20:10)
There was something fishy about the charge here.
3. Stoning wasn't specified for all cases of adultery. The Law of Moses doesn't specify stoning for all cases of adultery (though it might be implied), but only in the case when a betrothed virgin was caught in adultery, in which case both parties would be stoned (Deuteronomy 22:23-24).
4. Death for adultery was seldom carried out. In fact, the most common punishment for adultery in Jewish society in Jesus' day was not death, but divorce and financial compensation for the husband from the adulterer himself.[76]
Not my words (Jesus walk.com)
-
1
- Show all
yeah he’s the mediator of the New Testament they were trying to follow Moses law but it’s for this
“Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God.
Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.”
Romans 3:19-20 KJV
we would t know what adultery is or that it’s sin if the law hadn’t said “ Thou shalt not commit adultery , anyone who commits adultery must surely be put to death “
the law is to teach us what sin is nd that it is a death sentance .
Jesus didn’t come to do that he came to save those who had been found sinners by the knowledge of sin the law is meant to do that but the gospel is this
“and said unto them, Thus it is written, and thus it behoved Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day: and that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem. And ye are witnesses of these things.”
Luke 24:46-48
the law makes us aware of sin and it’s consequence the gospel is for calling us to repentance and remission of sins
they are two parts of one plan to redeem
Mankind. If the law didn’t teach sin and it’s consequence no one could ever repent and have thier sins remitted because we would be ignorant of good and evil
what is sin ? That would be our understanding if God hadn’t given the law first and what is repentance from sin ? If we don’t know what it is how can we repent ?
we have to be made aware of sin before we can acknowledge our guilt , come to repentance and have our sins remitted
there’s two testaments Jesus is giving the new they were trying to enforce the old they were indeed trying to obey Moses
“thou shalt not commit adultery is the commandment “
a death sentance is the reply of breaking it they couldn’t be saved once they committed sin they had to be killed by the others
“And the man that committeth adultery with another man's wife, even he that committeth adultery with his neighbour's wife, the adulterer and the adulteress shall surely be put to death.”
Leviticus 20:10 KJV
if you look closer you find that Jesus is explaining why Moses law is different
Moses commanded them that if they took a wife d then we’re unhappy with the wife to write a bill of divorce and send her away then she could remarry another person Jesus revoked this also and says why
“And he answered and said unto them, What did Moses command you? And they said, Moses suffered to write a bill of divorcement, and to put her away.
And Jesus answered and said unto them, For the hardness of your heart he wrote you this precept.
But from the beginning of the creation God made them male and female. For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and cleave to his wife; and they twain shall be one flesh: so then they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder.
And he saith unto them, Whosoever shall put away his wife, and marry another, committeth adultery against her. And if a woman shall put away her husband, and be married to another, she committeth adultery.”
Mark 10:3-9, 11-12
that is not what Moses taught it’s contrary. The gospel is a New Testament the old is to point to sin and hold us guilty to a death sentance and the gospel is to come and save us turning our ears to God and his word rather than this law which cannot save us but was for them who will not repent having the knowledge of sin but not having the knowledge of the righteousness of Christ found only in the gospel
“knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers, for whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers, for liars, for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine;”
1 Timothy 1:9-10
we have to be born again by accepting the new beginning found in the gospel and the mediation of Jesus Christ the Lord
“Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God.
Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.”
Romans 3:19-20 KJV
we would t know what adultery is or that it’s sin if the law hadn’t said “ Thou shalt not commit adultery , anyone who commits adultery must surely be put to death “
the law is to teach us what sin is nd that it is a death sentance .
Jesus didn’t come to do that he came to save those who had been found sinners by the knowledge of sin the law is meant to do that but the gospel is this
“and said unto them, Thus it is written, and thus it behoved Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day: and that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem. And ye are witnesses of these things.”
Luke 24:46-48
the law makes us aware of sin and it’s consequence the gospel is for calling us to repentance and remission of sins
they are two parts of one plan to redeem
Mankind. If the law didn’t teach sin and it’s consequence no one could ever repent and have thier sins remitted because we would be ignorant of good and evil
what is sin ? That would be our understanding if God hadn’t given the law first and what is repentance from sin ? If we don’t know what it is how can we repent ?
we have to be made aware of sin before we can acknowledge our guilt , come to repentance and have our sins remitted
there’s two testaments Jesus is giving the new they were trying to enforce the old they were indeed trying to obey Moses
“thou shalt not commit adultery is the commandment “
a death sentance is the reply of breaking it they couldn’t be saved once they committed sin they had to be killed by the others
“And the man that committeth adultery with another man's wife, even he that committeth adultery with his neighbour's wife, the adulterer and the adulteress shall surely be put to death.”
Leviticus 20:10 KJV
if you look closer you find that Jesus is explaining why Moses law is different
Moses commanded them that if they took a wife d then we’re unhappy with the wife to write a bill of divorce and send her away then she could remarry another person Jesus revoked this also and says why
“And he answered and said unto them, What did Moses command you? And they said, Moses suffered to write a bill of divorcement, and to put her away.
And Jesus answered and said unto them, For the hardness of your heart he wrote you this precept.
But from the beginning of the creation God made them male and female. For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and cleave to his wife; and they twain shall be one flesh: so then they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder.
And he saith unto them, Whosoever shall put away his wife, and marry another, committeth adultery against her. And if a woman shall put away her husband, and be married to another, she committeth adultery.”
Mark 10:3-9, 11-12
that is not what Moses taught it’s contrary. The gospel is a New Testament the old is to point to sin and hold us guilty to a death sentance and the gospel is to come and save us turning our ears to God and his word rather than this law which cannot save us but was for them who will not repent having the knowledge of sin but not having the knowledge of the righteousness of Christ found only in the gospel
“knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers, for whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers, for liars, for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine;”
1 Timothy 1:9-10
we have to be born again by accepting the new beginning found in the gospel and the mediation of Jesus Christ the Lord
They didnt present the man which was also part of the law. He was to be punished as well.
Then also idolatry is compared to adultery how many times did Israel receive grace?
How many times did the men who brought her receive grace?
I think He gave her grace as a prophetic event foreshadowing of grace for a world of adulterers/idolators.
Then also idolatry is compared to adultery how many times did Israel receive grace?
How many times did the men who brought her receive grace?
I think He gave her grace as a prophetic event foreshadowing of grace for a world of adulterers/idolators.
-
1
- Show all
"At the mouth of two witnesses, or three witnesses, shall he that is worthy of death be put to death; but at the mouth of one witness he shall not be put to death." - Deuteronomy 17:6 KJV
"And they which heard it, being convicted by their own conscience, went out one by one, beginning at the eldest, even unto the last: and Jesus was left alone, and the woman standing in the midst. When Jesus had lifted up himself, and saw none but the woman, he said unto her, Woman, where are those thine accusers? hath no man condemned thee? She said, No man, Lord. And Jesus said unto her, Neither do I condemn thee: go, and sin no more." - John 8:9-11 KJV
Jesus was following the Law.
"And they which heard it, being convicted by their own conscience, went out one by one, beginning at the eldest, even unto the last: and Jesus was left alone, and the woman standing in the midst. When Jesus had lifted up himself, and saw none but the woman, he said unto her, Woman, where are those thine accusers? hath no man condemned thee? She said, No man, Lord. And Jesus said unto her, Neither do I condemn thee: go, and sin no more." - John 8:9-11 KJV
Jesus was following the Law.
-
1
- Show all
The man's escape raises a lot of questions.
-how did the man escape? Did he know someone was watching? Was this a setup?
-do these witnesses know who he was? And do they say as much?
-if they didn't see the mans identity, do they even know it wasn't her husband?
-have they ascertained that it was not a rape?
With both the man and woman, the facts unfold much easier.
Think about it. You're about to beat a person to death with rocks. Do you want any uncertainty or questions running through your head?
-how did the man escape? Did he know someone was watching? Was this a setup?
-do these witnesses know who he was? And do they say as much?
-if they didn't see the mans identity, do they even know it wasn't her husband?
-have they ascertained that it was not a rape?
With both the man and woman, the facts unfold much easier.
Think about it. You're about to beat a person to death with rocks. Do you want any uncertainty or questions running through your head?
Truly, I don't believe that there's enough information in the text to swing our opinion one way or another.
Any attempt to do so, seems vain and meaningless?
I think that with Scripture, it's best for me to try and understand what's actually there... what is the Truth that the Spirit will reveal to me? Not go off into my personal favorite past-time of fantasizing the what "might be's".
Any attempt to do so, seems vain and meaningless?
I think that with Scripture, it's best for me to try and understand what's actually there... what is the Truth that the Spirit will reveal to me? Not go off into my personal favorite past-time of fantasizing the what "might be's".
P
Theres a 3 fold event that takes place here.
The law required that both parties be present....this was not done.
He who is without sin cast the first stone....conviction ....accusers left.
What is missed is this...go and sin no more....forgiveness....jesus never said she was innocent but gave her a warning.
Its intresting to note here that jews did not have authority to put anyone to death under roman law even there own according to the law. So this situation was very complex.
Jesus was being tested as well as fulfilling his first coming advent...I have not come to judge but to save.
The law required that both parties be present....this was not done.
He who is without sin cast the first stone....conviction ....accusers left.
What is missed is this...go and sin no more....forgiveness....jesus never said she was innocent but gave her a warning.
Its intresting to note here that jews did not have authority to put anyone to death under roman law even there own according to the law. So this situation was very complex.
Jesus was being tested as well as fulfilling his first coming advent...I have not come to judge but to save.
-
2
- Show all
I must admit - I hadn't gone through it in detail. I just thought - If the man got away, it seems the woman should have faced the evidence available. I'm not sure what that would have entailed.
As for Jesus' comment - obviously in any such confrontation, there would be no sinless person, so there could be no dealing justice if this was the stipulation.
I don't know if I'm expressing this clearly.
They were not obeying the mosaic law, the mosaic law states bring both the man and the woman. That is exactly why Jesus did not OK the execution
I can post you the verse, instead of giving commentary:
Leviticus 20:10 “’If a man commits adultery with another man’s wife—with the wife of his neighbor—both the adulterer and the adulteress are to be put to death.
Christians are very ignorant of the law of Moses which leads them to these fantasy land interpretation of this event and makes them invent all sorts of explanations, usually what they end up doing is defending the sin of adultery and turning a blind eye to such wickedness as "grace" which is what the Bible warns against doing:
Jude 1:4 For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.
I can post you the verse, instead of giving commentary:
Leviticus 20:10 “’If a man commits adultery with another man’s wife—with the wife of his neighbor—both the adulterer and the adulteress are to be put to death.
Christians are very ignorant of the law of Moses which leads them to these fantasy land interpretation of this event and makes them invent all sorts of explanations, usually what they end up doing is defending the sin of adultery and turning a blind eye to such wickedness as "grace" which is what the Bible warns against doing:
Jude 1:4 For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.
You are explaining fine: I just think the least likely explanation (with a 0% likelihood) is that Jesus was contradicting the law of moses, or telling someone else not to do what was in the law of moses, before it was fulfilled.
To add a stipulation that someone had to be sinless to excecute a sentance is not consistent with the OT or even any NT ideas, so I'm pretty confident that this is not a good understanding of the text.
To add a stipulation that someone had to be sinless to excecute a sentance is not consistent with the OT or even any NT ideas, so I'm pretty confident that this is not a good understanding of the text.
If you read what Jesus said as "He among you who is without error, first cast a stone at her" It suggest to me that Jesus is saying 2 things:
1)The jews were wrong in their application of the law
2)Jesus was not afraid to say someone should be stoned if the law was being followed correctly.
1)The jews were wrong in their application of the law
2)Jesus was not afraid to say someone should be stoned if the law was being followed correctly.
-
1
- Show all