And the SMOKE of their torment...No eternal damnation for anyone, except the Devil

[Thewatchman]

This what Jesus say

46 “Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life.”

eternal punishment

also the story Lazarus and rich man in hell. Rich man fell thirsty and ask Abraham send Lazarus to bring a drop of water, rich man not cease to exist

Here is the meaning of torments as used in Luke and the rest of the New Testament

Torment Strong's Concordance New Testament Greek

#928

1) to test (metals) by the touchstone, which is a black siliceous stone used to test the purity of gold or silver by the colour of the streak produced on it by rubbing it with either metal

2) to question by applying torture

3) to torture

4) to vex with grievous pains (of body or mind), to torment

5) to be harassed, distressed

5a) of those who at sea are struggling with a head wind

Part of Speech:verb

Relation:from G931

Usage:

This word is used12 times:

Matthew 8:6: "home sick of the palsy, grievously tormented."
Matthew 8:29: "Jesus, thou Son of God? art thou come hither to torment us before"
Matthew 14:24: "in the midst of the sea, tossed with waves: for the"
Mark 5:7: "of the most high God? I adjure thee by God, that thou torment me"
Mark 6:48: "And he saw them toiling in rowing; for the wind"
Luke 8:28: "Jesus, thou Son of God most high? I beseech thee, torment me"
2 Peter 2:8: "in seeing and hearing, vexed his righteous soul from day to"
Revelation 9:5: "them, but that they should be tormented five months: and their"
Revelation 11:10: "these two prophets tormented them that dwelt on the earth."
Revelation 12:2: "she being with child cried, travailing in birth, and pained to be delivered."
Revelation 14:10: "of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone"
Revelation 20:10: "the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night forever and ever"




Strong's #929: basanismos (pronounced bas-an-is-mos')

from 928; torture:--torment.

Thayer's Greek Lexicon:

́basanismos

1) to torture, a testing by the touchstone, which is a black siliceous stone used to test the purity of gold or silver by the colour of the streak produced on it by rubbing it with either metal

2) torment, torture

2a) the act of tormenting

2b) the state or condition of those tormented

Part of Speech: noun masculine

Relation: from G928




Strong's #931: basanos (pronounced bas'-an-os)

perhaps remotely from the same as 939 (through the notion of going to the bottom); a touch-stone, i.e. (by analogy) torture:--torment.

1) a touchstone, which is a black siliceous stone used to test the purity of gold or silver by the colour of the streak produced on it by rubbing it with either metal

2) the rack or instrument of torture by which one is forced to divulge the truth

3) torture, torment, acute pains

3a) of the pains of a disease

3b) of those in hell after death

Part of Speech: noun masculine

Relation: perhaps remotely from the same as G939 (through the notion of going to the bottom)

Usage:

This word is used 3 times:

Matthew 4:24: "that were taken with divers diseases and torments, and those which were possessed with devils, and"
Luke 16:23: "eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off,"
Luke 16:28: "into this place of torment."




Strong's #2851: kolasis (pronounced kol'-as-is)

from 2849; penal infliction:--punishment, torment.

Thayer's Greek Lexicon:

́kolasis

1) correction, punishment, penalty

Part of Speech: noun feminine

Relation: from G2849

Citing in TDNT: 3:816, 451

Usage:

This word is used 2 times:

​

Matthew 25:46: "shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into"
1 John 4:18: "because fear hath torment. He that feareth is not made perfect"

 

[Runningman]

Here is the meaning of torments as used in Luke and the rest of the New Testament

Torment Strong's Concordance New Testament Greek

#928

1) to test (metals) by the touchstone, which is a black siliceous stone used to test the purity of gold or silver by the colour of the streak produced on it by rubbing it with either metal

2) to question by applying torture

3) to torture

4) to vex with grievous pains (of body or mind), to torment

5) to be harassed, distressed

5a) of those who at sea are struggling with a head wind

Part of Speech:verb

Relation:from G931

Usage:

This word is used12 times:

Matthew 8:6: "home sick of the palsy, grievously tormented."
Matthew 8:29: "Jesus, thou Son of God? art thou come hither to torment us before"
Matthew 14:24: "in the midst of the sea, tossed with waves: for the"
Mark 5:7: "of the most high God? I adjure thee by God, that thou torment me"
Mark 6:48: "And he saw them toiling in rowing; for the wind"
Luke 8:28: "Jesus, thou Son of God most high? I beseech thee, torment me"
2 Peter 2:8: "in seeing and hearing, vexed his righteous soul from day to"
Revelation 9:5: "them, but that they should be tormented five months: and their"
Revelation 11:10: "these two prophets tormented them that dwelt on the earth."
Revelation 12:2: "she being with child cried, travailing in birth, and pained to be delivered."
Revelation 14:10: "of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone"
Revelation 20:10: "the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night forever and ever"




Strong's #929: basanismos (pronounced bas-an-is-mos')

from 928; torture:--torment.

Thayer's Greek Lexicon:

́basanismos

1) to torture, a testing by the touchstone, which is a black siliceous stone used to test the purity of gold or silver by the colour of the streak produced on it by rubbing it with either metal

2) torment, torture

2a) the act of tormenting

2b) the state or condition of those tormented

Part of Speech: noun masculine

Relation: from G928




Strong's #931: basanos (pronounced bas'-an-os)

perhaps remotely from the same as 939 (through the notion of going to the bottom); a touch-stone, i.e. (by analogy) torture:--torment.

1) a touchstone, which is a black siliceous stone used to test the purity of gold or silver by the colour of the streak produced on it by rubbing it with either metal

2) the rack or instrument of torture by which one is forced to divulge the truth

3) torture, torment, acute pains

3a) of the pains of a disease

3b) of those in hell after death

Part of Speech: noun masculine

Relation: perhaps remotely from the same as G939 (through the notion of going to the bottom)

Usage:

This word is used 3 times:

Matthew 4:24: "that were taken with divers diseases and torments, and those which were possessed with devils, and"
Luke 16:23: "eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off,"
Luke 16:28: "into this place of torment."




Strong's #2851: kolasis (pronounced kol'-as-is)

from 2849; penal infliction:--punishment, torment.

Thayer's Greek Lexicon:

́kolasis

1) correction, punishment, penalty

Part of Speech: noun feminine

Relation: from G2849

Citing in TDNT: 3:816, 451

Usage:

This word is used 2 times:

​

Matthew 25:46: "shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into"
1 John 4:18: "because fear hath torment. He that feareth is not made perfect"

yes, the eternal torment crowd requires the definition of punishment to be changed to torment in Matthew 25:46, but the word torment is an entirely different word than punishment in the New Testament.

I’ve seen this too many times in Bible discussions. People start fiddling with word definitions, allegorizing, spiritualizing, and making literal concepts not literal; presto-changeo! Now the Bible says anything they want it to say and the plain text of the Bible is thrown out the window in favor of their pet doctrines.

Now death isn’t death, destruction isn’t destruction, punishment means torment, death isn’t punishment, and everyone and their worms get eternal life in hell.

It’s really sad, but I believe some of us are too honest and passionate about the Bible to stand by idly and turn a blind eye.

So thank you for posting that.

 

[Gideon300]

Let’s be clear here. Adam and Eve hid in the garden among the trees. That isn’t what death is.

Someone said to me that death is separation from God and yes the eternal torment doctrine requires death not be literal in the Bible. If death is literal then the whole eternal torment doctrine falls apart.

Again, there’s nothing about death being a separation from God in the Bible. However, if you or anyone has proof to the contrary I’m interested.

The proof is in God's word. I assume that you believe it to be true.

1 Corinthians 15:
…21For since death came through a man, the resurrection of the dead comes also through a man. 22For as in Adam all die, so in Christ all will be made alive

Genesis 2:
16And the LORD God commanded him, “You may eat freely from every tree of the garden, 17but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil; for in the day that you eat of it, you will surely die.”

Genesis 3:
4“You will not surely die,” the serpent told her.

7And the eyes of both of them were opened, and they knew that they were naked; so they sewed together fig leaves and made coverings for themselves.

8Then the man and his wife heard the voice of the LORD God walking in the garden in the breeze of the day, and they hid themselves from the presence of the LORD God among the trees of the garden.

Ephesians 2:

1And you were dead in your trespasses and sins, 2in which you used to walk when you conformed to the ways of this world and of the ruler of the power of the air, the spirit who is now at work in the sons of disobedience.

Death is literal but it obviously is not physical. Neither is it mental, emotional or of the will. People can still think, feel and choose. So there is only one part of man left. That is his spirit. That is the part that is dead in trespass and sin. That is the part that is made alive When we are born again.

Still not convinced?

Isaiah 59

2But your wickedness has separated you from your God, and your sins have hidden His face from you so that He does not hear.

 

[Thewatchman]

Strong's # 86 Greek Dictionary

Hades (Hell)

The place (state) of the departed souls: - grave, hell



aiónios: agelong, eternal

Original Word: αἰώνιος, ία, ιον
Part of Speech: Adjective
Transliteration: aiónios
Phonetic Spelling: (ahee-o'-nee-os)
Definition: agelong, eternal
Usage: age-long, and therefore: practically eternal, unending; partaking of the character of that which lasts for an age, as contrasted with that which is brief and fleeting.



Matthew 25:46 Everlasting #166 Strong's Concordance Greek Dictionary

aionios, from 165 perpetual: (From Merriam-Webster per;pet·u·al | \ pər-ˈpe-chə-wəl , -chəl; -ˈpech-wəl \ Definition of perpetual1a: continuing forever : EVERLASTINGperpetual motionb(1): valid for all timea perpetual right

(2): holding something (such as an office) for life or for an unlimited time​

2: occurring continually : indefinitely long-continuedperpetual problems​

3: blooming continuously throughout the season)​

Back to the Strong's #166 From 165; (perpetual) also used for past time, or past and future as well);- eternal, for ever, everlasting, world (began)​

​

From 165 so lets look at that: #165 From the same as 104; properly an age; by extension (when a general term can denote an entire class of things) perpetuity (Also past); by implied, or implication the world; (specific or specifically) (Jewish) a Messianic period (present, or future):- age, course, eternal, (for) ever (-more) In-lever, (beginning of the, while the) world (began, without end)​

​

From the same as 104 so lets go look at #104. From an obsolete primitive noun (apparent or apparently meaning continued duration) “ever” by qualification regularly; by implication earnestly :- always, forever​

After all that we see that eternal dose have a time limit set by God, not man and it has nothing to do with mans time but is all in Gods time.​

​

 

[Jackson123]

It seem some believe not all unsaved go to eternal punishment, they believe some are cease to exist

my question is who go to eternal punishment who cease to exist?

 

[Thewatchman]

Here we go again more definitions.



Strong's # 86 Greek Dictionary

Hades (Hell)

The place (state) of the departed souls: - grave, hell



aiónios: agelong, eternal

Original Word: αἰώνιος, ία, ιον
Part of Speech: Adjective
Transliteration: aiónios
Phonetic Spelling: (ahee-o'-nee-os)
Definition: agelong, eternal
Usage: age-long, and therefore: practically eternal, unending; partaking of the character of that which lasts for an age, as contrasted with that which is brief and fleeting.



Matthew 25:46 Everlasting #166 Strong's Concordance Greek Dictionary

aionios, from 165 perpetual: (From Merriam-Webster per;pet·u·al | \ pər-ˈpe-chə-wəl , -chəl; -ˈpech-wəl \ Definition of perpetual1a: continuing forever : EVERLASTINGperpetual motionb(1): valid for all timea perpetual right

(2): holding something (such as an office) for life or for an unlimited time​

2: occurring continually : indefinitely long-continuedperpetual problems​

3: blooming continuously throughout the season)​

Back to the Strong's #166 From 165; (perpetual) also used for past time, or past and future as well);- eternal, for ever, everlasting, world (began)​

​

From 165 so lets look at that: #165 From the same as 104; properly an age; by extension (when a general term can denote an entire class of things) perpetuity (Also past); by implied, or implication the world; (specific or specifically) (Jewish) a Messianic period (present, or future):- age, course, eternal, (for) ever (-more) In-lever, (beginning of the, while the) world (began, without end)​

​

From the same as 104 so lets go look at #104. From an obsolete primitive noun (apparent or apparently meaning continued duration) “ever” by qualification regularly; by implication earnestly :- always, forever​

After all that we see that eternal dose have a time limit set by God, not man and it has nothing to do with mans time but is all in Gods​

​

 

[Runningman]

The proof is in God's word. I assume that you believe it to be true.

1 Corinthians 15:
…21For since death came through a man, the resurrection of the dead comes also through a man. 22For as in Adam all die, so in Christ all will be made alive

Genesis 2:
16And the LORD God commanded him, “You may eat freely from every tree of the garden, 17but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil; for in the day that you eat of it, you will surely die.”

Genesis 3:
4“You will not surely die,” the serpent told her.

7And the eyes of both of them were opened, and they knew that they were naked; so they sewed together fig leaves and made coverings for themselves.

8Then the man and his wife heard the voice of the LORD God walking in the garden in the breeze of the day, and they hid themselves from the presence of the LORD God among the trees of the garden.

Ephesians 2:

1And you were dead in your trespasses and sins, 2in which you used to walk when you conformed to the ways of this world and of the ruler of the power of the air, the spirit who is now at work in the sons of disobedience.

Death is literal but it obviously is not physical. Neither is it mental, emotional or of the will. People can still think, feel and choose. So there is only one part of man left. That is his spirit. That is the part that is dead in trespass and sin. That is the part that is made alive When we are born again.

Still not convinced?

Isaiah 59

2But your wickedness has separated you from your God, and your sins have hidden His face from you so that He does not hear.

I’m still not convinced about death being separation from God. Sin separates people from God, but it’s nuanced. God has different types of presences and manifests in ways that can be either seen or unseen.

God is omnipresent and knows the thoughts and intentions of all people from the chiefest sinner to the holiest saint. In that sense God is present. The difference is that God listens to one and doesn’t listen to the other, yet it’s still nuanced. God hears all prayers, but doesn’t regard or dignify them all.

Otherwise when an unrepentant sinner finally comes to Christ God would be incapable of hearing their prayer.

While the wages of sin is death that’s in reference to the judgement. If someone is judged by their sins then what they’ve earned is death. We aren’t judged until a later time post-resurrection.

Death is plainly death. Still not convinced?

 

[Thewatchman]

It seem some believe not all unsaved go to eternal punishment, they believe some are cease to exist

my question is who go to eternal punishment who cease to exist?

I am glad to see you ask a real question instead of telling someone or multiple people that they are trying to change things by posting information or questing what they post

If you will take the time I am just about finished with a bible study on Ezekel 44 that covers a lot of that. From Ezekel 40 to the end there is more about the millennium than in the book of Revelation.

 

[FreeGrace2]

Your doctrine of eternal torment was designed by the devil to either scare people into church

Wow, are you confused. Why on earth would Satan want to "scare people into church"? Maybe just the liberal socialist ones.

God wants people to come to Him because they love Him. Our God is merciful and righteous and doesn’t eternally torment all of the unsaved for anything.

You have been shown Dan 12:2, Matt 25:46 and Rev 20:10-15, so you have no excuse for your maudlin sentiments.

[QUTE] The Bible says they will perish and not receive eternal life.[/QUOTE]
They will be punished for eternity. That doesn't mean "cease to exist for eternity". There is no experience for one who has ceased to exist, but you are just too dishonest to admit that.

 

[Jackson123]

I’m still not convinced about death being separation from God. Sin separates people from God, but it’s nuanced. God has different types of presences and manifests in ways that can be either seen or unseen.

God is omnipresent and knows the thoughts and intentions of all people from the chiefest sinner to the holiest saint. In that sense God is present. The difference is that God listens to one and doesn’t listen to the other, yet it’s still nuanced. God hears all prayers, but doesn’t regard or dignify them all.

Otherwise when an unrepentant sinner finally comes to Christ God would be incapable of hearing their prayer.

While the wages of sin is death that’s in reference to the judgement. If someone is judged by their sins then what they’ve earned is death. We aren’t judged until a later time post-resurrection.

Death is plainly death. Still not convinced?

Death is death

some go to heaven some go to eternal punishment

death is not cease to exist

 

[FreeGrace2]

Because people can lose their entire body in hell.

No one gets "burned up in hell". In fact, the unbeliever's body stays in the grave while their soul goes to Hades (hell). If you are a student of the Word, you are also a poor teacher, since you admit you don't go to church or listen to pastors.

They'll be burned up and completely reduced to ashes.

Their sous? Where do you get this? How does an immaterial soul become material ashes. Please don't make an ASH of yourself.

There is no immortality in hell.

Opinion.

Why lose your entire body if losing a hand or eye will prevent that?

The Bible does teach that unbelievers will lose their entire body when cast into the LOF.

Matthew 10:28
28Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Instead, fear the One who can destroy both soul and body in hell.

The words "can" and "will" are not the same.

Better question.... do you believe Jesus wants us to chop our hands and feet off and gouge our eyeballs out? seriously? would you do it?

Jesus was speaking figuratively, obviously.

 

[Jackson123]

I am glad to see you ask a real question instead of telling someone or multiple people that they are trying to change things by posting information or questing what they post

If you will take the time I am just about finished with a bible study on Ezekel 44 that covers a lot of that. From Ezekel 40 to the end there is more about the millennium than in the book of Revelation.

You mean, you posting about that subject here ?

 

[FreeGrace2]

Let’s put the scriptures in harmony. So none of them say all of the unsaved receive eternal conscious torment, but the rest say they perish. Sometimes it says they are destroyed or they have death.

You have no excuse. Dan 12:2 speaks of ETERNAL CONTEMPT. That is an experience. Matt 25:46 speaks of ETERNAL PUNISHMENT. That is an experience.

So both verse are CLEAR that what is in store for all unbelievers is an EXPERIENCE of contempt and punishment. That means for ever and ever, just as Rev 20:10 states.

So given the evidence of the majority of scriptures against one or two verses, what is the eternal punishment?

Contempt. That is the punishment, from the Bible. And btw, there are NO verses which are "against" 1 of 2 verses.

What a ridiculous comment. The whole Bible is in perfect harmony. Whatever 1 verse says in plain language is not contradicted in any other verse, much less "the majority of Scriptures". Pure hogwash.

 

[FreeGrace2]

yes, the eternal torment crowd requires the definition of punishment to be changed to torment in Matthew 25:46, but the word torment is an entirely different word than punishment in the New Testament.

Now you're just grasping at straws. Dan 12:2 speaks of eternal contempt, which is experienced. For eternity.

Do you not think contempt is a torment? If you felt a strong contempt, wouldn't you be tormented by that? Of course you would.

 

[Bob-Carabbio]

Let’s put the scriptures in harmony. So none of them say all of the unsaved receive eternal conscious torment, but the rest say they perish. Sometimes it says they are destroyed or they have death.

So given the evidence of the majority of scriptures against one or two verses, what is the eternal punishment?

Eternal separation from God, shared with a TRUCKLOAD of lousy neighbors.

 

[Lucy-Pevensie]

Why on earth would Satan want to "scare people into church"?

OWN GOAL!!!

 

[Runningman]

You have no excuse. Dan 12:2 speaks of ETERNAL CONTEMPT. That is an experience. Matt 25:46 speaks of ETERNAL PUNISHMENT. That is an experience.

So both verse are CLEAR that what is in store for all unbelievers is an EXPERIENCE of contempt and punishment. That means for ever and ever, just as Rev 20:10 states.


Contempt. That is the punishment, from the Bible. And btw, there are NO verses which are "against" 1 of 2 verses.

What a ridiculous comment. The whole Bible is in perfect harmony. Whatever 1 verse says in plain language is not contradicted in any other verse, much less "the majority of Scriptures". Pure hogwash.

Daniel 12 doesn’t say that those who are resurrected to shame and everlasting contempt will be the one’s experiencing those feelings.

I’ve gone over this a few times before, but I’ll expound on it again.

Daniel 12 talks about the two resurrections. As we know, the resurrection occurs before the New Heavens and New Earth where only righteousness dwells according to Peter.

If you’ll look at Isaiah 66, you’ll see this state of contempt explained more in detail.

Isaiah 66:22-24
22For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the LORD, so shall your seed and your name remain.
23And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the LORD.
24And they shall go forth, and look upon the carcases of the men that have transgressed against me: for their worm shall not die, neither shall their fire be quenched; and they shall be an abhorring unto all flesh.

The word abhorring used in verse 24 is the same word used in Daniel 12:2. As you can see, their bodies are lifeless carcasses who don’t feel anything. They’re being burned to ashes and consumed by worms. They aren’t alive experiencing anything, but rather they will be an abhorring to all flesh who are alive i.e. the righteous people who are alive in the New Heavens and New Earth.

Now back to Daniel 12. Post resurrection, they’ll have a second death in the lake of fire. Isaiah 66 puts that in perspective. The people who will feel shame and contempt are those who are not in the lake of fire, i.e., the saved people.

That’s why context and studying matters. I recommend you really dig deeper into the Bible to form a solid understanding rather than half-baked, recycled, and continually refuted talking points.

 

[Thewatchman]

I’m still not convinced about death being separation from God. Sin separates people from God, but it’s nuanced. God has different types of presences and manifests in ways that can be either seen or unseen.

God is omnipresent and knows the thoughts and intentions of all people from the chiefest sinner to the holiest saint. In that sense God is present. The difference is that God listens to one and doesn’t listen to the other, yet it’s still nuanced. God hears all prayers, but doesn’t regard or dignify them all.

Otherwise when an unrepentant sinner finally comes to Christ God would be incapable of hearing their prayer.

While the wages of sin is death that’s in reference to the judgement. If someone is judged by their sins then what they’ve earned is death. We aren’t judged until a later time post-resurrection.

Death is plainly death. Still not convinced?

The phrase I put in bold is not true.

They did not die of a physical death in the very next moment, they actually got to live a lot of years on earth, but separated from God (spiritual death): they used to live in the garden Eden and after their sin, they have been chased out of heaven (being chased out of Eden means being separated from God). So, the first death Adam and Eve experienced, was not the physical one, but the spiritual one. After a couple of years, during which Adam and Eve had a lot of sons and daughters, they suffered of the physical death, too. Death is the consequence of sin. God is life; death and life cannot coexist. God incarnated in order to reverse what man has done to himself: spiritual and physical death. Just as Adam died first of a spiritual death, so is the new man in Christ experiencing first a spiritual resurrection. Than his body dies and, at the second coming of Christ man will experience the complete resurrection: that of the body too.

There are three kinds of death in the Bible: spiritual, physical, and the second death (eternal torment). Adam and Eve experienced death in the following order: first spiritual, then physical. They did not experience what Revelations calls 'the second death', which is ultimate and irreversible. The first two kinds of death (spiritual and physical) are reversible.



... I did not invent the expression 'second death'... it's in the Bible, in the very verses about the devil, demons and false prophets being cast into the lake of fire, as a 'second death'.

First the Garden of Eden is not heaven, and was not heaven. It was a garden a special place God prepaired for The Man Adam God Created on the 8th day the day after God rested. Then some time later God took the rib (curve I thank DNA from Adam ) to make woman that Adam named Eve. Can you tell me was that on the same day God created Adam which was after the day of rest or was it sometime later.





How can you say God does not dignify prayers.


Revelation 5:8


Berean Literal Bible
And when He had taken the scroll, the four living creatures and the twenty-four elders fell down before the Lamb, each having a harp, and golden bowls being full of incenses, which are the prayers of the saints.

King James Bible
And when he had taken the book, the four beasts and four and twenty elders fell down before the Lamb, having every one of them harps, and golden vials full of odours, which are the prayers of saints.





Revelation 8:3


Berean Literal Bible
And another angel having a golden censer came and stood at the altar, and much incense was given to him, that he will offer it with the prayers of all the saints upon the golden altar before the throne.

King James Bible
And another angel came and stood at the altar, having a golden censer; and there was given unto him much incense, that he should offer it with the prayers of all saints upon the golden altar which was before the throne.



Verse 4.


Berean Literal Bible
And the smoke of the incense went up before God, with the prayers of the saints, out of the hand of the angel.

King James Bible
And the smoke of the incense, which came with the prayers of the saints, ascended up before God out of the angel's hand.





Psalms 56:8


Berean Study Bible
You have taken account of my wanderings. Put my tears in Your bottle—are they not in Your book?

King James Bible
Thou tellest my wanderings: put thou my tears into thy bottle:are they not in thy book?

 

[Thewatchman]

You mean, you posting about that subject here ?

It ties in and is a very good study

 

[kleronomos]

And if hell mean cease to exist, more drug user chose go to hell, one of my drug user neighbor kill himself
i talk to his mom, do you know why, she say “ his life is like hell(suffer)” so he think kill himself is avoid suffer, because hell mean cease to exist?

so this doctrine have vested interest, design by devil to invite more people to hell

What does this mean to you?
Psalm 37:20 But the wicked shall perish, and the enemies of the LORD shall be as the fat of lambs: they shall consume; into smoke shall they consume away.



What about this?
Revelation 21:4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death,



What about ?
neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.


Ecclesiastes 1:11 There is no remembrance of former things; neither shall there be any remembrance of things that are to come with those that shall come after.



Isaiah 65:16 That he who blesseth himself in the earth shall bless himself in the God of truth; and he that sweareth in the earth shall swear by the God of truth; because the former troubles are forgotten, and because they are hid from mine eyes.

Isaiah 65:17 For, behold, I create new heavens and a new earth: and the former shall not be remembered, nor come into mind.


This?


Psalm 105:8 He hath remembered his covenant for ever, the word which he commanded to a thousand generations.

Death is death

some go to heaven some go to eternal punishment

death is not cease to exist

Revelation 21:4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.

Does this say they are PASSED AWAY or NOT?

HOW IS IT POSSIBLE for the Lake of Fire, which takes place BEFORE the New Heaven and the New earth MAKING IT part of the 'FORMER THINGS' to CONTINUE ON?

Are YOUR thoughts making void the words of God or are they not?

HOW ABOUT A 2ND WITNESS in WHAT IS WRITTEN? Not that we need one since NO ONE can produce anything written that says there is ETERNAL consciousness of punishment anyhow but


Isaiah 65:12 Therefore will I number you to the sword, and ye shall all bow down to the slaughter: because when I called, ye did not answer; when I spake, ye did not hear; but did evil before mine eyes, and did choose that wherein I delighted not.

Isaiah 65:13 Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD, Behold, my servants shall eat, but ye shall be hungry: behold, my servants shall drink, but ye shall be thirsty: behold, my servants shall rejoice, but ye shall be ashamed:

Isaiah 65:14 Behold, my servants shall sing for joy of heart, but ye shall cry for sorrow of heart, and shall howl for vexation of spirit.

Isaiah 65:15 And ye shall leave your name for a curse unto my chosen: for the Lord GOD shall slay thee, and call his servants by another name:

Isaiah 65:16 That he who blesseth himself in the earth shall bless himself in the God of truth; and he that sweareth in the earth shall swear by the God of truth;

because the former troubles are forgotten, and because they are hid from mine eyes.

Isaiah 65:17 For, behold, I create new heavens and a new earth: and the former shall not be remembered, nor come into mind.

SOMETHING HAS TO GIVE.

We can't have people crying in torment forever and ever AND NOT COMING INTO THE MIND OF GOD.