Three Questions for Calvinists

[GaryA]

@Iconoclast:

I am not trying to attack you.

I have nothing against you personally.

I am just using your post to illustrate a point to everyone:

"Do not expect to teach me Meat if you demonstrate clearly that you do not understand Milk 101."

 

[Polar]

@Iconoclast:

I am not trying to attack you.

I have nothing against you personally.

I am just using your post to illustrate a point to everyone:

"Do not expect to teach me Meat if you demonstrate clearly that you do not understand Milk 101."

I put him on ignore. He's a hyper Calvinist who will distort what you say, twist scripture, call you names and then say that you are the one who did this.

You know normally I would not make a post like this, but it seems the Calvinists are using this forum to shove their beliefs at everyone and destroying threads and getting away with it.

We also have people who are saying some of the books of the NT are not scripture.

Seems the Bible is under attack like never before. Calvinism is poison.

 

[LoveBrokeThru]

Another 3 good question for Calvinists..

Calvin had a big hand to play regarding Michael Servetus being burned alive.
The issue seems to have been that Michael Servetus didnt quite agree with the idea of the "Trinity".
So, it was decided that based on this "heresy of unbelief", he should be tied to a stake, and set on fire, and burned.

Now Here are the 3 questions.

When Michael Servetus was tied to the stake.

1.) Did Calvin light the fire?

2) .Did Calvin watch him burn and laugh?

3.) Did Calvin take the day off, and casually heard about the roasting later as he was having dinner. ?

 

[PennEd]

Another 3 good question for Calvinists..

Calvin had a big hand to play regarding Michael Servetus being burned alive.
The issue seems to have been that Michael Servetus didnt quite agree with the idea of the "Trinity".
So, it was decided that based on this "heresy of unbelief", he should be tied to a stake, and set on fire, and burned.

Now Here are the 3 questions.

When Michael Servetus was tied to the stake.

1.) Did Calvin light the fire?

2) .Did Calvin watch him burn and laugh?

3.) Did Calvin take the day off, and casually heard about the roasting later as he was having dinner. ?

Interesting.
What’s your thoughts on Martin Luther?

And John Wesley?

 

[Polar]

Interesting.
What’s your thoughts on Martin Luther?

And John Wesley?

Hi PennEd

I know your questions are not addressed to me, but with regards to the burning of Michael Servetus, there is no question that Calvin was behind that and responsible for it. The methods and actions of Calvin are more reminiscent of the Spanish Inquisition, than a desire to hold up the truth of the Bible.

Luther actually posted his Theses in October of 1517 and Calvin came on the scene in 1536. It should be understood that Calvin understood his baptism as a child as his salvation and never confirmed an actual time when he accepted Christ by faith.

I don't understand you to be a Calvinist but I do understand you do hold to some of the reformed position and I suspect we all do; but not TULIP as it is taught by Calvinists who hold to that understanding to the detriment of any choice God may give us and believe that some people are simply born to fuel the fires of hell.

Happy to answer any other questions. I have studied Calvinism and am currently doing so again. I am not an Armenian either though.

 

[Iconoclast]

I put him on ignore. He's a hyper Calvinist who will distort what you say, twist scripture, call you names and then say that you are the one who did this.

You know normally I would not make a post like this, but it seems the Calvinists are using this forum to shove their beliefs at everyone and destroying threads and getting away with it.

We also have people who are saying some of the books of the NT are not scripture.

Seems the Bible is under attack like never before. Calvinism is poison.

You are another cyber Rambo.
You have nothing of substance to offer,do a drive by attack post, and think you are the man. You do not know Calvinism, or hyper Calvinism, yet you look to cause strife and attack people.

 

[Shepherd]

2 thess.2:13
We are bound to give thanks away to God for you brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning Chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth.
Here it is clearly taught that we are indeed chosen, elected by God to salvation which for some reason you suggest does not take place?

As time permits I will work back and consider what you have offered on this.
I will offer some help if I can.
I have been working on a board trying to make it interactive, question and answer kind of format designed to offer scripturally edifying and positive post, link, concessions, sermons both audio and written.
Then I intend to make a thread dealing with objections.it is an uncensored board, although nursing and blasphemy ate not welcome, your ideas are.

Not merely "chosen:. It says "Chosen" THROUGH "sanctification of the Spirit" and "belief of the truth".

 

[ForestGreenCook]

Luke 14
15And when one of them that sat at meat with him heard these things, he said unto him, Blessed is he that shall eat bread in the kingdom of God.16Then said he unto him, A certain man made a great supper, and bade many: 17And sent his servant at supper time to say to them that were bidden, Come; for all things are now ready. 18And they all with one consent began to make excuse. The first said unto him, I have bought a piece of ground, and I must needs go and see it: I pray thee have me excused. 19And another said, I have bought five yoke of oxen, and I go to prove them: I pray thee have me excused. 20And another said, I have married a wife, and therefore I cannot come.
21So that servant came, and shewed his lord these things. Then the master of the house being angry said to his servant, Go out quickly into the streets and lanes of the city, and bring in hither the poor, and the maimed, and the halt, and the blind. 22And the servant said, Lord, it is done as thou hast commanded, and yet there is room. 23And the lord said unto the servant, Go out into the highways and hedges, and compel them to come in, that my house may be filled. 24For I say unto you, That none of those men which were bidden shall taste of my supper.
Did the man actually invite those who gave the excuses?
Did those who made the excuses know that they were being invited?
So, if the man originally wanted them to come, why did they end up with no supper?

Verse 33 sums it up "he that has ears to hear", let him hear.

 

[oyster67]

Verse 33 sums it up "he that has ears to hear", let him hear.

Whosoever will listen may come and receive salvation. Everyone has the opportunity. So simple, yet Calvinist stumble on this.

 

[Grandpa]

I am a Christian who is known as a Calvinist because I believe the the teaching of scripture.
This portion of Luke is about Israel refusing Jesus except for an elect remnant.So those who are compelled to come on are the gentiles.Mt21:43.
I read 3 pages, no one answered the question.
No one knows or has defined what a Calvinist is.
Many accusations but no substance.
Bibleinteraction@freeforums.net. deals with with this in detail.

I saw it as Israel refusing the Lord Jesus as the first men who were originally supposed to come to the wedding feast but didn't go.

Then the rest could be summed up as "many are called, but few are chosen".


I find myself agreeing with Calvinism and Scripture. But I have been told by scholars/pastors of Calvinism/Calvinistic churches that my understanding of Calvinism isn't necessarily the classic understanding or traditional agreed upon understanding.

I am more of a pure Truth kind of person than a classically trained leaning on tradition kind of person. Although I learn from the classically trained/tradition leaners too.


Its like putting a puzzle together. You have all these people agreeing to put it together a certain way and disagreeing with their favorite groups to disagree with. I haven't 100% agreed with any group but I see that the Calvinists pieces for the most part fit where they are supposed to. There are a few areas where the calvinistic churches put it together incorrectly, but I'm not certain they are really following Calvins theology when they are doing so.

I suppose it doesn't really matter to anyone but me anyway....

We're the true Calvinists!!! Well, how do you really know since he's not around to say...? Because we say so and tradition... Just like the RCC before you...

 

[ForestGreenCook]

Whosoever will listen may come and receive salvation. Everyone has the opportunity. So simple, yet Calvinist stumble on this.

The un-regenerant person as described in 1 Cor 2:14 would not listen to spiritual things that he thinks is foolishness. Only those who have been born again with the indwelling of the Holy Spirit (Eph 2:1-5) will listen to spiritual things.

 

[Shepherd]

The only difference between a staunch Calvinist and a "hyper" Calvinist is that one needs a good dose of Ritalin.

The un-regenerant person as described in 1 Cor 2:14 would not listen to spiritual things that he thinks is foolishness. Only those who have been born again with the indwelling of the Holy Spirit (Eph 2:1-5) will listen to spiritual things.

...or discern/ "rightly divide" them.

 

[Iconoclast]

Not merely "chosen:. It says "Chosen" THROUGH "sanctification of the Spirit" and "belief of the truth".

Yes...the means are described in what you quoting. Notice the other part;
13 But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning
chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:

 

[Iconoclast]

Whosoever will listen may come and receive salvation. Everyone has the opportunity. So simple, yet Calvinist stumble on this.

No one will listen or believe unless God enables them to. We do not stumble on this. We believe what God has revealed in scripture.
Only those who hear the gospel have an opportunity,

13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

14 How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?

15 And how shall they preach, except they be sent? as it is written, How beautiful are the feet of them that preach the gospel of peace, and bring glad tidings of good things!

 

[Bluesproverb]

Not a good sign to start other thread topics about single apologetics terms, like OSAS, when just the term Calvinist leads members to go after one another.

Calvinism is sustained by scripture. No I'm not a Calvinist.

We can't choose to save ourselves. We know this because the one that made salvation necessary sent himself to change our fallen condition if we only believe.

But he himself, as Jesus, told us we can't come to him, be saved, unless God leads us to himself as Jesus.
And in his ministry to his apostles he told them he teaches the gospel using parables so that not everyone would understand and come to repentance,be saved. Because for some they were meant to understand, while others were meant not to understand.

That's God telling us that on his own words.
Calvinism is just compartmentalizing those things so those who are called, an exclusive known as the elect of God, have a place to go. So they can understand why they're there.

 

[Nehemiah6]

But he himself, as Jesus, told us we can't come to him, be saved, unless God leads us to himself as Jesus.

The truth of the matter is that the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit all urge sinners to come to the Savior through the Gospel (which is the power of God unto salvation -- Rom 1:16). Indeed Christ said that He would draw ALL men to Himself after He was lifted up (either on the cross or exalted through His resurrection and ascension). So in fact no one is excluded unless they exclude themselves.

 

[Bluesproverb]

The truth of the matter is that the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit all urge sinners to come to the Savior through the Gospel (which is the power of God unto salvation -- Rom 1:16). Indeed Christ said that He would draw ALL men to Himself after He was lifted up (either on the cross or exalted through His resurrection and ascension). So in fact no one is excluded unless they exclude themselves.

I think it is a matter of relativity. All those parts that speak of the elect of God that he chose before creation of this world would necessarily be the subjects of all verses referring to them in any other context.

Whosoever believes. We know those "whosoever" are those God graced with faith and salvation.

When Jesus told his disciples why he taught the gospel in parables, that tells us only those who are gifted their faith by God are then saved by it.
And those he doesn't gift are not. Nor are they meant to. As Jesus also said.

It's not for everyone. That's why those for whom it is meant are identified by God as his elect. Those he elected to bestow with his grace to faith so they would be saved.

He came to save any one. Not everyone. As he said.

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=proverbs+16&version=ESV

 

[Polar]

The only difference between a staunch Calvinist and a "hyper" Calvinist is that one needs a good dose of Ritalin.

Sometimes the truth is the funniest thing in these threads.

 

[ForestGreenCook]

Whosoever will listen may come and receive salvation. Everyone has the opportunity. So simple, yet Calvinist stumble on this.

If the unregenerate person ever does, listen to spiritual messages he will not discern what he is hearing. He most likely would not stop to listen.

 

[Bluesproverb]

Whosoever will listen may come and receive salvation. Everyone has the opportunity. So simple, yet Calvinist stumble on this.

I think if that were true God wouldn't have a Lamb's Book of Life.
And Jesus wouldn't have taught in parables so that not all could understand and be saved.
And Jesus, God, wouldn't say no one comes to him unless the father leads them.