FreeGrace2, please disregard post # 1750 - somehow your name got mixedup with my reply to Inquisitor due to massive distractions happening at the moment. All those replies were intended to be for Inquisitor. My apologies.
Of course. I take nothing personally so there is no need to apologize.
However, you quoted me here:
FreeGrace2 said:
I have a huge problem with anyone pedaling the law.
Then you responded with:
[/QUOTE]"Then you have a problem with Jesus who said "not one jot or tittle shall in any wise pass from the law until all is fulfilled"[/QUOTE]
Jesus came to fulfill the Law. No human being is capable of doing that. Read Romans 2-4 and you will see that truth.
Do you think you are fulfilling the Law?
you have a problem with James who said the "doers of the law shall be justified"
I don't have a problem with James. I understand him. He wasn't talking about God justifying people based on being a doer of the Law, as you seem to think. James' whole point was about demonstrating one's faith to others so that they can see your faith.
v.28 summarizes what James was talking about:
But someone will say, “You have faith; I have deeds.” Show me your faith without deeds, and I will show you my faith by my deeds.
In all the English translations of this verse, they all put the quote marks as the quote above. However, that makes no sense.
This is the correct placement of the quote marks:
But someone will say, “You have faith; I have deeds. Show me your faith without deeds, and I will show you my faith by my deeds."
iow, the entire verse after "but someone will say" is by that someone.
What he is saying is a challenge to someone else that the other has faith but he has deeds/works. The challenge for the someone else is to show him their faith without deeds, and he will show that someone else his fasith BY his deeds.
Very simple, really. James' point is that NO ONE can show/demonstrate their faith to OTHERS apart from deeds/works.
All the nonsense about faith without works means no salvation is totally off the mark.
So 2:24 isn't about God's justification. This is what messed up Martin Luther. He (and tons of believers today) thought James WAS talking about God's justification. He wasn't. He was talking about being justified in the eyes of others, when they SEE your faith by your DEEDS.
The point of being justified "in the eyes of others" means to avoid being seen as a hypocrite. iow, being consistent. If you claim to be a Christian, then ACT like one. Too many believers act like everyone else.
Rom 12:17 - Never pay back evil for evil to anyone. Respect what is right
in the sight of all men.
This verse specifically notes the perspective of others.
Rom 14:18 - For he who in this way serves Christ is
acceptable to God and
approved by men.
This verse directly notes how our lifestyle is acceptable/approved by God and by men.
2 Cor 5:12 - We are not again commending ourselves to you but are giving you an occasion to be proud of us, so that you will have an answer
for those who take pride in appearance and not in heart.
Man cannot see the heart; only God can, which is where our faith is. So, by living our our faith, we have an answer for those who take pride in appearance.
2 Cor 8:21 - for we have regard for what is honorable,
not only in the sight of the Lord, but
also in the sight of men.
This could not be more clear: in the sight of the Lord (for justification) and in the sight of men (for their approval or justification).
Col 4:5 - Be wise
in the way you act toward outsiders; make the most of every opportunity.
1 Tim 3:7 - And he must have a
good reputation with those outside the church, so that he will not fall into reproach and the snare of the devil.
Clearly speaking of having a good testimony before others (outside the church-unbelievers), which avoids the charge of hypocrisy.
1 Thess 4:12 - so that you will
behave properly toward outsiders and not be in any need.
Ditto
1 Pet 2:12 -
Keep your behavior excellent among the Gentiles, so that in the thing in which they slander you as evildoers, they may because of your good deeds, as they observe them, glorify God in the day of visitation.
Clearly Peter is emphasizing that believers who live out their faith, not being hypocrites, will have a positive effect upon unbelievers.
1 Jn 3:18 - Little children,
let us not love with word or with tongue, but in deed and truth.
This is directly linked to James 2:15,16; the example of the believer who told people "be warmed and filled" but didn't do anything to meet their needs. He was a blatant hypocrite. iow, he "loved only with word or tongue", but definitely not "in deed and truth".
These verses demonstrate the importance of how others view the believer.
And, 2:15,16 is a clear example of how NOT to demonstrate your faith; just give lip service, which is nothing other than hypocrisy.
[QOUTE]you have a problem with Paul who said "he that doeth righteousness is righteous"; you have a problem with John who said "he that saith I know Him and keepeth not His commandments is a liar".[/QUOTE]
When you consider all the verses about the Law, esp Rom 2-4, it is clear that NO ONE can "keep the Law".
Why do people have a problem with the Biblical notion that obedience to the Ten Commandments is merely evidence Jesus is enthroned in the heart keeping them for us who can't keep them ourselves?
That isn't the problem. The problem is when believers claim salvation is kept or maintained by keeping the Law, which your posts seem to claim.
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